OT - Tobacco affidavit or other motive? Legal?

The company I work for gave us a "2007 Tobacco Affidavit". We "MUST complete and return this form by November 22, 2006 or an additional contribution of $14.42 per week will be charged for your medical coverage in

2007".

I don't use tobacco and don't plan to throughout 2007, so I should just fill out and sign the Affidavit, Right?

Under "Authorization and Acknowledgment" it says "I understand that by signing this Affidavit, I am authorizing any payroll deductions required based on the information supplied by me above. I certify that the information on this form is true and correct."

If they are going to take the $14.42 per week for not signing this form, why do they need us to sign to authorize these payroll deductions?

Anyway, the next part is the kicker.. "I understand and agree that XXXX reserves the right to amend, modify, suspend or terminate -in whole or in part- these benefit plans at any time without approval, consent, or acceptance of participants. This reservation applies to all active and retiree benefit plans including all medical and prescription drug plans and includes the right to change contributions and available benefits."

This company has taken benefits and/or pay nearly every year for many years now. The plant is old enough now that it's getting several retirees. Is signing this about the Tobacco usage or giving them permission to terminate our benefits whenever they want?

I agree that I am tobacco free and will remain so through 2007. But I don't agree with the part about them terminating my benefits.

So, I either sign or get an additional $14.42 per week taken out of my pay.

Last year we got a 10% pay cut, our employee medical contribution went from ~$40/month to ~$200/month, our pension plan was eliminated... Some employees figured out that they took approximately 23% from us. I don't like signing a form stating that I agree with them reserving the right to terminate our benefits, because they probably will.

Also, others are questioning the legality of penalizing tobacco users for something they do outside of work that is legal.

Any good advise would be appreciated, I'm already keeping my eye out for a different job, they're kind of scarce around here.

Thanks!

Reply to
Roger_N
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I would look even harder for a better job or occupation. I see nothing really wrong with asking to pay more for tobacco use, but I would cross over the acknowledgment that you agree to your plan being terminated without your consent. I have been successful sometimes with making changes like this -- often nobody even looks at the forms that you are returning. Then later they may get unpleasantly surprised when you tell them "I never signed that disclaimer", but it is their problem.

i
Reply to
Ignoramus1135

"Roger_N" wrote in news:FgZ8h.3$ snipped-for-privacy@news.sisna.com:

Ours starts Jan 1, $50 a month if you are a tobacco user. Next will be obesity, alchohol, then it will be hereditary traits that pre-dispose you to heart disease, cancer, etc. The rates will just keep going up. Legally, they have the right to do this, life insurance has had higher rates for decades for tobacco users.

Reply to
Anthony

Just a note- there is an electrical component manufacturer in wash, state that requires all employess to be tobacco free, 24/7, and will fire you if you are spotted ever smoking, anywhere.

Dave

Reply to
spamTHISbrp

My advise is don't rely on any advise that you get here (except mine, of course). 8-) Seriously, if you want advise that you can rely on, see a lawyer. Bob

Reply to
Bob Engelhardt

==================== You need qualified legal advice. See a lawyer. Don't sign anything until you do. [Anything you sign can an will be used against you.]

Forward a copy of the form to your state labor department as it may be in violation of one of their regulations or laws. If you are not allowed to take a copy of the form with you this is a huge "red flag" and should be reported to your labor department, papers, etc. at once.

You can try marking the offending paragraphs as "null" on the form you return if you have no choice. Be sure and initial.

It sounds like the typical screw job that management tries after the boss attend a seminar on how to reduce health care costs. If they get by with this, look for a whole series of prohibited activities and exclusions such as motorcycle riding. Ruger tried that one, and rescinded it when they discovered how many Ruger purchasers were also motorcycle riders who stopped buying their poducts.

Remember "if you can see their lips moving, they are lying."

Unka' George (George McDuffee) .............................. Only in Britain could it be thought a defect to be "too clever by half." The probability is that too many people are too stupid by three-quarters.

John Major (b. 1943), British Conservative politician, prime minister. Quoted in: Observer (London, 7 July 1991).

Reply to
F. George McDuffee

Politicians make laws and like staying in power. I think you have just described enough voters to cause a change in the laws. Expecially for health plans group plans.

Wes S

Reply to
clutch

Dont worry about it , the Unjust US govt is about to fall , along with its lawyers and cronies . But the jobs it has created must go away also . America will lose 250 million jobs .

The Tobacco master settlement agreement forces the states to hand over millions to T' farmers ..... Thats RIGHT !!! It was supposed to all go for health care ! READ THE FINE PRINT . Also , the guy who booted Waxman out , was a T' grower , he atached a rider on the bill that killed the T' farmers subsidy bill . ha ha ha ha !!!! The T' farmers loan bill .......No provision for loan payback ..

I was told it was a game of musical chairs .... NO , its falling dominos .

The govt has been paying people to work and not to work and to grow and not to grow ... 250 million are paid ...

It has been taxing and printing $$ and steeling oil and selling guns , F-16's , or if you dont buy the guns/planes , it will bomb / shoot you up , then you'll need the guns to protect yourself from the US Mercenaries , who will "save" and "protect" you from guess who !!!

I heard when it happens , it will be like backing out of a ditch , put it in rev ... Like goin back to the 1800's , smaller govt ....

Nature has a different plan . Nature will force the population lower , by taking power away from societies and govts by freeing the best of the gene pool .

In one generation , all poor will sterilize ALL their females voluntarily and the world will lose 6 billion in one generation .

Bet you heard the other version where it would take thousands of years ........

Then we will live happily for another 100,000 years w/o govt , w/o wars , w/o Jesus Christ , w/o Mohamed , w/o Ralph Nader ..... w/o complaints of any kind .

Reply to
werty

It's been 15 years since I worked for someone else, but back then when I got something like this I'd just line out and initial the stuff I didn't like and hand the form in.

Never was an issue.

Reply to
Jim Stewart

Smokers can bag breathe and get the CO2 back into their body . I smoked for years , hyperventilated one day in 1967 , Doc said to simply bag breathe , Worked great , then years later started cutting back on smoking , then it occured to me that smokers vent too much CO2 . So i bag breathed and felt great w/o a smoke . It was the same effect . Next effect is Naicin . Smoking gives you Niacin , cant get pelagra if you smoke ....

But as i got older , i noticed i used less Niacin , it made quitting smoke easier . I also use no protein and nitrogen balance works better .. I dont crave meat , only carbs , works great , got lots of energy .

Smokers take one deep beathe then they take much longer to take the next breathe in spite of having a bag limit their oxygen ! Non-smokers quickly start to increase their rate . i would take a breathe and the next would occur in 20 seconds . Non- smokers will take the 2nd breath in 6 seconds !

Smokers lower their rate , breathing into a bag , til about the 8th breath . The CO2 returned back into lungs will lower blood pH back to normal . Feel much better . Thats why people smoke , their blood is to high pH . and they get Niacin ( nicotinic acid ) look in dictionary ... they're both on same page ..

Reply to
werty

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