Ann: Robotics miniFAQ

This is a nice resource.  For the "What's An Easy To Use Computer For A
Robot Brain?" section, I'd suggest looking at Coridium ARMmite:
   <http://www.coridiumcorp.com/ARMmite.phtml>

At $50 it's quite affordable, it has some nice features (e.g. 8 10-bit
A/D inputs, up to 24 digital I/O pins, 60 MHz clock speed), and looks
like it's very easy to use -- it has an onboard BASIC compiler, so all
you need to program it is a computer with a USB cable and a terminal
program.  I haven't tried it yet myself, but I intend to -- it looks
like a great combination of power and ease of use, at a decent price.

Also, as a newbie who's recently been trying to get started with AVR
chips, I might suggest you take them off your list (and probably the
PICs too).  They're extremely difficult to get started with, even for an
experienced software engineer.  At least, this is certainly true if you
don't use Windows (it's probably easier if you do).  But if your FAQ is
aimed at beginners, you should probably recommend products that are more
ready to go out of the box.  But maybe that's just me.

Best,
- Joe

Regarding the AVR, there exists an AVR butterfly resource which seems
EXTREMELY promising from a beginner's perspective (so much so I've ordered
one, and am anxiously awaiting the arrival).  Smiley Micros has a beginner
level book based upon the AVR butterfly, with a resource kit and compiler
for under 90$usd.

http://www.smileymicros.com/index.php?module=pagemaster&PAGE_user_op=view_page&PAGE_id &MMN_position$:24

Now, I haven't actually tried it, but I did read the sample chapter of the
book provided online, and surely, if I can follow it, then just about
anyone can.  As a rank amateur with respect to h/w, I figure this is just
about the best way to dig in, and get up to speed with embedded micros
with a 300 pg book to hold your hand. There is even some soldering
required. 8-).


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That does look good -- but it also seems to be based on WinAVR and
AVRStudio (another Windows app).  I have moral objections to supporting
Microsoft, so those are out for me.  I know, that limits my options, but
I'm willing to live with that.  :)

It could be that this book would be helpful in other ways, though.  I'll
read through the sample chapter and see what I can adapt to the
gcc/avrdude toolchain.

Thanks,
- Joe

Sounds like a job for REALBasic, don't you think? And imagine,
simulators for the Mac and PC!

-- Gordon

Actually, I don't use Windows at all, but only FreeBSD (some linux, not
much), so I was figuring upon adapting the book to a FreeBSD based gcc
toolchain, and winging it ... It's just my way.


I suspect that you are correct, the book will be helpful in numerous ways,
notwithstanding the windows app ...



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I need to post a correction to one of my earlier suggestions...

I said that the ARMmite board has an onboard C compiler, and so can be
programmed from anything with a serial connection.  That turns out to
not be the case (and SparkFun's item description also makes this
mistake).  It's true of the ARMexpress board, but the ARMmite has less
RAM, and no room for an onboard compiler -- so they give you a Windows
program for compiling and downloading your code.

Not a big deal, but well worth being clear about.

Best,
- Joe

I am sorry to be rude, but if you found it difficult to program an avr
in linux, you are not an experienced software engineer.  I am an
inexperienced software engineer and I found it to be trivial.  All the
software I use I installed from standard debian packages (# apt-get
install gcc-avr avrdude) and I made a simple programming cable out of
nothing but a db-25 connector and some ribbon cable.  The avr is, by
far, the easiest mcu I have ever worked with.

Besides, for $50 you can get a whole tube of avrs.  I find myself using
them for things that I used to do with either a pile of 74xx or a cpld
simply because they are so damn cheap.

-chris.

Well then you're sorry, rude, and wrong all at the same time.  :)

Hi Joe,


So - are you using Linux or Mac?

I've been working with embedded processors so long that I can't see the
places that newbies trip over, so I'd be very interested to hear your
perspective.

What are the specific areas that you're having (or had) difficulty
with?

I think you'll like the smileys book.

--
Dave Hylands
Vancouver, BC, Canada
http://www.DaveHylands.com/

Another good microcontroller to consider for beginners is the Arduino
board.  It's pretty cheap, open-source, and looks fairly powerful.  It
also has really great documentation for Mac, Windows, and Linux,
including extensive tutorials.

  http://www.arduino.cc/en/

Best,
- Joe

My understanding of the Arduinio (wiring/processing) app dev'nt is that it
is Java based.  Java, IMHO, is *NOT* so open, controlled as it is by one
company (Sun Microsystems), and Java seems to have a very large footprint
on whatever platform happens to run it.  Correct me if I'm wrong, but in
the absence of a decent gcc like tool-chain, there are some encumberances
which are too much to swallow.  Don't get me wrong, Processing/Wiring are
cool projects, and the choice of Java in an academic setting might have
actually hit the sweet spot, but for an old sw guy just trying to learn
embedded hw/dev'nt, not to my personal taste.

I'd turn instead to something like the TI-MSP430 ... a somewhat under
rated/utilized processor IMHO, and they even have a USB dongle based dev
system (albeit for an entry level chip F2013?) for about $20.00, and there
does exist an MSP430 gcc toolchain.

Having said that, the Smiley book will be here any day, along with my very
own AVR Butterfly, and a bunch of wires, and spinny thingys, a bread board
thingy (whatever that is for?) and lighty up LED thingys, and neat stuff
like that -- and so I'll learn how to add a resistor to an LED (and why I
have to), and then (even) I too can make spinny moving blinkenlights and
get feedback from my surroundings hoo haaa while happily programming -- in
C! 8-).  I feel like a kid at Christmas!  This is gonna be so neat !!!


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Hi,

spam@controlq.com wrote:

Sun released Java under GPL about a week ago:
http://www.linuxdevices.com/news/NS6857451192.html

Also, while the host side of wiring is running Java, it actually
generates C code and compiles that C code using avr-gcc.


They're just using Java as a tool, like they do with Eclipse.

--
Dave Hylands
Vancouver, BC, Canada
http://www.davehylands.com/