My first time - etched brass

I have to admit that it was a total disaster. I was trying to make Dragon early Hummel engine exhaust (or is it some king of air intake?). The parts are impossible for me to handle. I was using 2 tweezers simultaneously but after connecting 2 parts - trying to connect third disconnected previous 2. Trying to use 'super glue' was even worse - the parts are so small that I almost glued it to the tweezers, not to the second part. Is all etched brass this difficult to handle? Or it is just this particular piece in Dragon Hummel? Thanks god Dragon provided alternative styrene part - I will have to use this one. The brass in pretty much devastated by my attempts and by super glue.

Maciek

Reply to
Maciek
Loading thread data ...

"Maciek" wrote in news:eauo21$kcv$ snipped-for-privacy@srv.cyf-kr.edu.pl:

Hello Maciek,

I found brass kinda hard to handle at first too. But I found out that that you will need one or twoo good quality needle nose pliers like these:

formatting link

And you have to "anneal" the coper or brass parts. This is done rather easily. You take the part you want to bend. Grip it with a pair of pliers (small) and heat the part over the flame of a cigarette lighteruntil you see the part change colour to a silverish colour. Pleas practice on some scrap brass/copper. Do not use a candle or a zippo lighter because you will end up with very nasty blackened parts.

I would also advice to buy very sharp pointed tweezers like these:

formatting link
take tweezers you already have and file and sand it to a very sharp point.

For the rest there is a lot of practise with it, bt in the end the result is worth it.

And remember you DON'T have to use all the parts in an etch set.

I hope this helps

Dennis Loep

Reply to
Mechanical Menace

It does take some practice. I use the gel version of super glue- I find it a little easier. I have to constantly wipe my tweezers clean. I have learned not to blow at my workbench to clean dust and scraps away while I have photo etched brass out, and not to cough or sneeze at the bench :-) I also find working with PE is easier on a humid day than a dry one- the brass seems to be affected by static electricity. I have done a model ship with a PE accessory package. There were dozens of PE parts, and doing that ship I finally got the hang of it.

Awhile ago I bought a very good set of needle-nozed tweezers from a retiring dentist. Such high grade tweezers are essential to working with PE.

Reply to
Don Stauffer

Don Stauffer wrote in news:CbIAg.1$ snipped-for-privacy@news.uswest.net:

The brass is not affected by static electricity, but the superglue hardens as result of a chemical reaction with the moisture in the air. (at least that's what I have understood once)

There is moisture in the skin of your fingers, that's why they work so fabulously well with superglue.

What I have noticed however is that when you use a brass or copper pin as glue applicator and dip that in the bottle, the life expectancy of the bottled glue drastically drops. Anybody have noticed that too, and have a clue.

Cheers,

Dennis Loep

Reply to
Mechanical Menace

Maybe you just bit off a bit more than you should have to start with. I started into using etched parts with simple things like seat belt buckles when I was a teenager...now I regularly fold and form complex etched parts without any special tools. Granted, I also have some metalsmithing background, but even so I took some years to gain the skills with etched parts that I have now - so don't get discouraged.

I think it probably would have been better for you to get a kit you want, and then choose an etch set for it that you think you can deal with - I like the Eduard line myself. That way, you can look over the etched parts to see if they look like you can work with them vice opening a kit and sweating it out...

Tip - one thing I've learned about dealing with small etched parts is not to try to move, hold, bend, etc. them with your fingers. Use a tool

- a needle in a pin vise, tweezers, a toothpick, whatever - to prod, poke, and position. If you use a very sharp needle you can even "stick" parts to pick them up without doing noticable damage to the part.

I also use both thick CA glue and watch crystal cement to attach etched parts depending on where they go. Both types of glue have slightly longer working times. Postition the part, and then use a needle (my favorite CA applicator - some use the eye end, I just place a drop on the sharp end) to bleed glue between the part and the plastic.

I also very rarely paint etched parts prior to attachment - glue them directly to bare plastic for best results. Then trim, file, paint as required.

Reply to
Rufus

Do you anneal before bending or after? There are also kit supplied parts that look like laser cut stainless steel. (Dragon Ta 152H) How do you deal with this?

Reply to
ppp

Personally, I've never annealed etched parts...

Reply to
Rufus

snipped-for-privacy@yahoo.com wrote in news: snipped-for-privacy@4ax.com:

Anneal the part before bending. This makes the part bend more easily and takes out the "springiness"

The DML/Dragon (and some other producers) stainless steel parts are also etched.

I have never tried to anneal stainless steel, I can only suggest to snip off a scrap piece and try it. And then tell us your experience.

Cheers,

Dennis

Reply to
Mechanical Menace

Rufus wrote in news:EP2Bg.119255$1i1.103247@attbi_s72:

Of course annealing is not obligatory, but I found it works very well. If you need to keep parts straight then you DON'T anneal.

Cheers,

Dennis

Reply to
Mechanical Menace

I have but only cooling jackets for MG's that need to be rolled into tiny tubes.

Reply to
Ron Smith

Ron Smith wrote in news:77KdnapQ0NG6eUnZnZ2dnUVZ_v- snipped-for-privacy@rcn.net:

Anneal them!

They will be much easier to form. If annealed properly you can shape them almost as easy as lead foil.

After annealing they will be not so springy and can very easily be rolled into shape

Cheers,

Dennis.

Reply to
Mechanical Menace

Reply to
Ron Smith

I bend parts all the time - particularly those nice Eduard seats. I never anneal brass parts. But that's just me.

Reply to
Rufus

That makes a bit more sense.

Reply to
Rufus

They're the only brass PE I've ever found that really needs annealing.

Reply to
Ron Smith

Tight radius, I could see that. I haven't rolled any etched MG jackets but I'll keep this in mind if ever get around to such.

Anealling would make the aircraft parts I've used too soft, as thin as they are. Haven't used any stainless parts in years, and I doubt it would do anything but make them more brittle. I know some of the newer Eduard sets look like they're stainless, but they are actually a thinly plated brass...not sure why they do this.

Reply to
Rufus

The worst so far are 1/35 .30 cal jackets.

According to their rep at AMPS a few years ago it's strictly an appearance thing, dealers were bitching about the brass oxidizing and looking ugly. The plating is nickel-sliver and if you need to solder a particular joint you need to sand the plating off.

Reply to
Ron Smith

I can imagine trying to wrap those around a needle to get them right...

I would think they could solve the appearance problem by simply changing the packaging - just make it air-tight. I'd think that would be cheaper than plating...maybe not. As for the oxidation, I'd think that might actually help paint stick to the parts...give them a bit more "tooth". Though I've never had any trouble getting enamels to stick to them.

Reply to
Rufus

Rufus wrote in news:MupBg.121029$1i1.109574 @attbi_s72:

right...

I think the oxidation has nothing to do with the air getting in the packaging. I guess there is some acid from the etching procedure left that causes the oxidation/discoloration.

Cheers,

Dennis

Reply to
Mechanical Menace

Then that's simply a process problem - I've etched brass as a metalsmith, and it will naturally tarnish a bit left on it's own unless you coat or treat it somehow - hence Eduard's plating. Not as bad as pure copper, but it will lose it's shine eventually if left in the open air. I've only ever intentionally oxidized brass with liver of sulfer, and even that doesn't work that well on brass...it rubs off, as I recall.

Either the packaging is/was not inert enough, or it's permiable enough to air that it lets the parts oxidize natually. Either way, it may be unattractive from a marketing standpoint but it doesn't hurt the parts any. The only thing that would stop me from buying an etch set is if it was visibly pitted...and I never seen one like that.

Reply to
Rufus

PolyTech Forum website is not affiliated with any of the manufacturers or service providers discussed here. All logos and trade names are the property of their respective owners.