Solar Power to provide 220 to barn for welding, etc.

Solar power panels usually charge a bank (or banks) of batteries so you'll have power available at night and on cloudy days. It's certainly possible to setup a 220V solar system. Only you can decide if it's worth the cost. Sometimes it's one of the few options for remote locations. Compare the initial cost against a generator. Solar has huge 'up front' costs and relatively small operating costs.

Reply to
frOg
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Is it possible to use solar power to run 220 in my barn for a welder?

Will I still need to have 220 run out to the barn from the house or will solar handle the load by itself?

rvb

Reply to
Rick Barter

Reply to
RoyJ

If you decide to do a cost analysis, there will be a big number for the cost of batteries. Don't forget to amortize them over a reasonable period. In my own calculations, I have found that battery life/replacement cost is a killer.

OTOH, it's possible to weld with two car batteries hooked in series, using a wire-feed welder. If you go to a wrecking yard you might be able to get a few batteries cheap, and trickle charge them with solar panels.

Reply to
Leo Lichtman

"Rick Barter" wrote: (clip) Will I still need to have 220 run out to the barn from the house or will solar handle the load by itself? ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ Another possibility would be to keep some storage batteries on a charger in the house, and wheel them out to the barn when you want to weld.

Reply to
Leo Lichtman

Yes.

That greatly depends on how much acreage you have and how many million dollars you have for a solar farm the size of a football field.

Now you can charge some batteries with it..and weld with 2-3 12vt batteries in series, directly from the batteries,,but amperage control is a bit tough this way.......

You can also spend a couple grand and buy a decent 4000-8000 watt inverter to get AC out of your battery bank to run a mig welder of modest size. I suggest a couple forklift battery banks..which only weigh about 2000 lbs each if you plan on doing any serious welding with that MIG. Then , depending on how many amps your solar field provides at charging voltage..you may be able to weld again in a week to a month after the batts charge back up again.

The cheap way of course is to put in a 22 vt 60-100 amp subpanel and run 220 out to the barn..or pick up a gas powered welder.

Unless you win the Power Ball...the last two may be your best options....

Gunner

"If thy pride is sorely vexed when others disparage your offering, be as lamb's wool is to cold rain and the Gore-tex of Odin's raiment is to gullshit in the gale, for thy angst shall vex them not at all. Yea, they shall scorn thee all the more. Rejoice in sharing what you have to share without expectation of adoration, knowing that sharing your treasure does not diminish your treasure but enriches it."

- Onni 1:33

Reply to
Gunner

Yes but, you need to do more research to determine if you would want to. There might be a reason why they make engine driven welders.

Depends on how big your piggy bank is when you go shopping for your solar system. And, oh, yeah, make sure your barn is big enough to house your solar system.

Reply to
Speechless

Thanks for the info everyone. Gunner, you mention the 'cheap way' is to put 100-amp sub-panel. That's what I'm in the process of trying to do and when I got hit with the estimate of $1200 to go 150' I almost shit myself. Then I just started thinking of alternatives.

I thought of buying a Miller Bobcat or something similar, but it seemed if I was going to spend $4000 or more on a welder, I should just spend the $1200 on getting the sub-panel installed and then buy a Lincoln Tombstone or something. I figured it was worth asking about solar.

In any event, I'm thinking of trenching the whole thing myself and finding out what size wires and what conduit I need. Getting it ready and then just calling an electrician to hook it up. Problem is I don't know how deep to go and I have gas and some water lines in the way.

I guess I could just call up digsafe and get them to mark the locations of the pipes, dig around them by hand and trench the rest. My father-in-law rents equipment so I can rent the trencher pretty cheap. ;)

Anyone have any advice on how sound my plan is here? I've been learning Oxy/Acetylene welding and am doing pretty good with that, but I really need to be able to arc weld and run an air compressor out in the barn. I'm looking to get the electrical upgraded, setup a chimney for my coal forge, and build my workbenches and tool racks before winter.

Thanks,

rvb

Reply to
Rick Barter

Used to be 18" for underground electrical wiring. Can't see any reason they'd change it.

Around here, the utility line locator folks have made a few mistakes, which can get pretty interesting when the excavators hit a gas pipe while digging on a "safe" line. :)

Reply to
John Husvar

The parts for a 60 amp sub panel run about $100 and $1.50 to $2 a foot for 6/3wg USE copper. 100 amp panel isn't much more, #2 Copper USE is outta sight price wise lately. In many jurisdictions you can do your own wiring, just need to have it inspected.

The big deal is trenching. Hand digging is a PAIN, a 4" trencher goes down up to 30" or so, can be rented for around $100 for 4 hours. You need to get any water or gas pipes marked, hand dig those at your liesure, then do the main trench in one sitting. Your inspector will tell you how deep they want it.

If you are go> Gunner wrote:

Reply to
RoyJ

Absolutely. But I doubt you'll be interested once you find out how much it will cost. At best you're talking about $1000 for limited capability.

My solar arrays, which power a whole house, only generate enough power to run a single small welder directly. Yet I can run all these larger machines

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as much as is generally required in a one man shop. It works like this: high current draw from the batteries for relatively short periods when welding (or for cooking, AC etc) and long periods of lower current recharging from solar or wind.

Wayne

Reply to
wmbjk

Where would you come up with such absolute nonsense? Array size depends on location (average daily sun hours), load size, and load duration between recharges. For the usual home welding, 500W for example might be appropriate. Size would be about 7'X7'. Which could be mounted on top of any shed, or on a pole much like a backyard satellite dish. Cost of such an array would be about $3000. BTW, just in case you wanted to know how far off your recommendations were, 3000 goes into even a single million some 333 times.

Look up some of Ernie's posts about the Ready Welder.

I thought you claimed to be an electrical engineer or some such? A modest MIG requires 1500W. Here's something that should do for under $400

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I power a whole house

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a well-equipped shop (and a 255A MIG) on 2000 pounds of batteries. Where would you get the idea that it would take 4000 pounds for a small welder alone? That much battery would store perhaps 60kWh, or 15 hours of constant 4kW home welding. Is that what you meant by "serious" welding? And don't forget that if someone had your fictional football-field sized array, then whenever the sun was shining the batteries wouldn't get depleted even when powering some 300 small welders.

Again, just silly nonsense. Let's say 30 minutes (a day's worth) of

1500W welding. Requires perhaps 2000W*.5hrs=1000Wh (10 cents worth of grid power). With 4 hours of full-sun equivalent, about 300W ($1500) of solar to recharge in a single day. Or half as much for 2 days to recharge etc. Or consider another scenario - if one only welded on weekends, say 1 solid hour of welding over Saturday and Sunday, and had 5 days to recharge, then more like 2000W*1hr=2000Wh, recharged over 20 hours of sun, perhaps 125W of PV, about $700.
22 vt? Must be electrical engineer lingo...

My whole place, including the land, the house, the power setup and all the shop equipment cost about as much as an entry-level subdivision cracker box. The notion that huge sums of money are needed to do such stuff sounds like rationalizing to me.

Wayne

Reply to
wmbjk

I definitely second Roy's comment of adding stuff now, while the trench is open, even if you never think you'll need it.

Steve who hand trenched between the house and the barn--twice--because the first time he didn't know how much fun and how useful electric welders were.

RoyJ wrote:

Reply to
Steve Smith

I would put, at the least, the following:

0) power 1) Ethernet 2) Coax (TV) 3) phone 4) compressed air line i
Reply to
Ignoramus21252

Just remember to put the low voltage stuff at minimum...8" away from the power lines..and preferably as far as you can. 150' of power line makes a nifty linear transformer and can induct a heck of a interference signal in a phone line or even a Cat 5 cable.

Gunner

"If thy pride is sorely vexed when others disparage your offering, be as lamb's wool is to cold rain and the Gore-tex of Odin's raiment is to gullshit in the gale, for thy angst shall vex them not at all. Yea, they shall scorn thee all the more. Rejoice in sharing what you have to share without expectation of adoration, knowing that sharing your treasure does not diminish your treasure but enriches it."

- Onni 1:33

Reply to
Gunner

i have a question. i hand dug a 100' trench (2 feet deep) from the house to the barn/workshop, ran a 220 line inside pvc conduit and put a separate pvc conduit for a telephone line and tv coaxial cable. the 2 conduits are right next to each other in the trench. sometimes i get a terrible buzz in the phone, i wondered if running a phone line so close to a large electric line could cause interference in the telephone line.

b.w.

Reply to
William Wixon

Ding Ding Ding. We have a winner!

Reply to
frOg

Reply to
RoyJ

compressed air line? what would i need that for from the house to the barn? oh wait, to be able to run air tools in the house from my compressor in the barn? hmmmmmmm interesting.

rvb

Reply to
Rick Barter

Can you decipher 6/3wg? Also, how do I know which gauge wire to use? Another thing...the electrician was going to come off the meter I think to run the wires. How does that work? Where can I find a book or something to show me how do to this properly?

rvb

Reply to
Rick Barter

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