Assistance requested with wiring

I'm trying to wire a Freightliner to operate the tarp motor.
The diagram I was given, suggests the machinist who provided
it, is not or should not be looking to quit his day job:)
jpg of his sketch has been ul-ed to the dropbox @ 1Schem.jpg
Switch I was directed to purchase, will switch polarity, but will not carry the load.
Relays are starter solenoids.
Thanks
gary
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Pix didn't seem to make it.... did you follow the "rules" about having a text file also??? Ken.
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here's the link
http://metalworking.com/Dropbox/1Schem.jpg
This is just a concept not an electrical drawing. I'll let the electical wizards on this group help you out.
karl
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On Thu, 01 May 2008 19:05:20 -0600, snipped-for-privacy@hotmail.com wrote:

If you use starter solenoids, you'll need four of them if you want it to run in both directions. The switch can be a SPDT center off or DPDT center off toggle switch. The solenoids would be arranged in an H with top of the H going to + battery and bottom of H going to ground or - battery with the motor being the crossbar of the H.
----------- | | S1 S3 |--M--| S4 S2 | | -----------
The switch would then energize diagonally opposed pairs of solenoids S1 and S2 or S3 and S4, one set for up and the other set for down.
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Don Foreman wrote:

Yup. My thoughts exactly.
http://metalworking.com/dropbox/tarp.txt
http://metalworking.com/dropbox/tarp.JPG
On the right side you see a three position switch. Select 'Tarp On' and the motor drives the tarp over the load. The limit switch stops the motor when the tarp is in place. Select 'Tarp Off' and the motor removes the tarp from the load. The other limit switch stops the motor when the tarp is off.
No provision is made to allow for a jam other than the fuse blowing.
No liability is accepted for use of any part of this circuit.
Have Fun!
--Winston
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I do not mean to rain on anyones parade. But, there is a potential problem using single pole starter relays in this circuit.
If the relays with suppression diodes drop out slower than they pull in, you could have an overlap situation where both k1 and k2 for instance are closed at the same time.
This could cause a very high current pulse which would blow the fuse and could weld the contacts on the relays.
This would only happen if someone were to flip the control switch quickly from cover on to cover off or vice versa without a pause in the center off position.
The easiest way around this would be to use a switch that forces you to release pressure on the lever while in the center off position before it will allow you to proceed to the other position.
Such switches are made. Unfortunately, I don't remember who makes them or who sells them.
The timing of the particular relays that you use may not present this problem. But, it is something to check before turning the system over to the user.
Ron
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Good Catch!
Carl Boyd

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Carl Boyd wrote:

Just use one of the remote solenoid upgrade kits that are sold by winch manufacturers such as Warn, Ramsey, SuperWinch, etc. as upgrades for the base model winches that come with local switches. Fast, simple, compact and designed and tested for the application.
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On Fri, 02 May 2008 06:42:53 +0000, Winston wrote:

...
...
...
Some other posts have said to just use a switch rather than switch + relays; 20A 12V DPDT center-off switches are readily available, eg http://www.parts-express.com/pe/showdetl.cfm?partnumber 0-376 or page 89 of http://www.delcity.net/delcity/documents/catalog/9_switches.pdf if 20A is enough for the tarp motor. Of course if the limit switches aren't heavy enough to switch the motor, you'd need relays anyway.
Note that in the dropbox/tarp.JPG diagram, the K3 and K4 coils are shown backwards. Hooked up as shown, the internal diodes or the wiring to them would burn up on first use. -jiw
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James Waldby wrote:

Those are A.C. rated at 20A. A switch rated properly is a different animal altogether. Bigger and more expensive. Can you tell me the part number for a DPDT center off switch capable of handling locked rotor current, cheaply?
Using the relays allows one to use relatively light gauge wire to connect the control panel to the motor and the limit switches, as you implied.

Good catch! Thanks, James! Corrected version is posted.
http://metalworking.com/dropbox/tarp_a.JPG
http://metalworking.com/dropbox/tarp_a.txt
--Winston
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I have a power winch on my boat trailer that has power in both directions and no solenoids or relays. It's done in the switch. Seems that's all we need here, but my browser is being a real PIA #(*&&%$$^&*& ARG!! So I can't find one. Anyway, Fulton winches have power in both directions. Not all power winches do. Maybe just a switch from them and your done.
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This is what my Warn winch uses to operate both directions without solenoids or relays. http://warn.iwebcat.com/_Members/lookups/partdetail.asp Steve
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Hey Steve, for some reason that link isn't working.
wrote:

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Dan wrote:

That's because the .asp in the link is depending on cookies / session information from the original part search.
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Click on Catalog then scroll down to switches or enter part # 36016
http://www.warn.com/atv/index.shtml
Sorry about that! Steve

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Nothing wrong with that. Ford starter solonoids can handle 300A. Not bad for less than $15. each. JR Dweller in the cellar
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