OT: Counterfeit bill detection

There's a rash of counterfeiting going on in my area. This involves washing the ink off 5 dollar bills and re-printing them as higher denominations. This defeats the chemical pens that will reveal the use on substandard paper.

It is possible to hold a bill up to some light and check whether the watermark matches the portrait printed on the face of the bill. But this is time consuming and rarely done by clerks in a hurry.

There's one other method that works well, but I've only seen it in use once. If one illuminates US currency with a UV 'back light' the plastic security strip fluoresces. Each denomination's strip is in a different location and its strip fluoresces with a different color. A simple guide affixed under the lamp is used for comparison, although the clerk I talked to said that she got used to identifying the strip/color location very quickly. All one needs to do is drop their bill on the counter, next to the cash register and lamp. If its bad, a clerk can tell at a glance.

This seems like pretty inexpensive and simple technology. So why don't more people use it?

Reply to
Paul Hovnanian P.E.
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That is only one kind of counterfeiting, and by far the least common. Several years ago (late 1980s-early 1990s or so), I designed counterfeit detection machines, and, as a former printing press operator, I have to say I'm very impressed with the skill of these guys. It was estimated that, at any given time, almost 30 percent of the currency in circulation was counterfeit. At the time, large volumes were coming from Iran. When the change was made to the new bills with the large portraits and plastic strips, it took the counterfeiters about two weeks to retool.

So, more people don't use it because it really wouldn't work, all by itself. There are better technologies, not particularly expensive. It always gives me a chuckle when I see a cashier holding a $50 bill up to the light as if s/he knew what to look for. I've seen many thousands of counterfeit bills, and there's NO WAY you're gonna tell which is which without some equipment other than your eyes and a UV light.

Reply to
rangerssuck

I think it is you that is the counterfeit.

Reply to
Richard J Kinch

Huh?

Reply to
rangerssuck

Yep, I agree, this guy is just making stuff up. He has his decimal point in the wrong place, big time: the truth is 0.03 percent.

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Reply to
Doug Miller

At the risk of sounding like Gunner, I don't recall seeing you at my meeting with the Secret Service agent. And that is all I am permitted to say on the subject.

Reply to
rangerssuck

Let the Record show that snipped-for-privacy@milmac.com (Doug Miller) on or about Thu, 25 Jun 2009 13:54:16 GMT did write/type or cause to appear in rec.crafts.metalworking the following:

BWahahaaha!

Of course, that's what They(tm) want you to believe.

pyotr "I'm not paranoid, is plot by enemies to make me seem paranoid" filipivich

bwahahahahaha!

pyotr filipivich Rock is Dead! --- Long live Paper & Scissors!

Reply to
pyotr filipivich

I think what most of them are looking for is the presence of the little mylar strip, and if they are more discerning, the watermark. In other words, they are mainly looking for lesser quality notes, of the type produced by drug users, and not the good ones coming from more sophisticated operations.

Jon

Reply to
Jon Danniken

CLIP

Just FYI. If you say this stuff and it turns out you are not really involved with the Secret Service or other legitimate agency looking into counterfeit money, I'd bet you are now in danger of a seriously closer look at by those legitimate agencies...

In other words, be careful waht you claim!

Reply to
Joe AutoDrill

ROTFLMAO!!!

Reply to
Doug Miller
0.03% seems reasonable. Of course, one must take into account that when a counterfeiter starts up an operation in one area, the percentage of bogus money might be higher locally. Maybe 0.3% (I'm just guessing here).

My point was: given all the security features that require the cashier to hold a bill up to the light, mark it with a special pen, etc. the UV light on the counter seems pretty easy to use. Often, cashiers hold high denomination out of the till while making change (so if the customer complains about "I gave you a $100 but you gave me change for a $20", the evidence is still present), placing it under a lamp for a few seconds doesn't add to their workload.

But I've only seen one of these units in operation. Strange.

Take a set of bills and put them under a black light (I've got a CFL lamp). You might have to shade them a bit if the ambient light is bright, but the security stripe location and color is pretty obvious.

Reply to
Paul Hovnanian P.E.

And I'm saying that the lesser quality bills are not even the tip of the iceberg. There are print shops in the middle east that produce passable US currency by the pallet load.

Reply to
rangerssuck

Oh, please. You're not going to bait me into this kind of crap. And I never claimed to be involved with anyone other than as a contractor to a company that produces machines for detecting counterfeit currency. Now, try to spin that into some kind of dark conspiracy, if that's what amuses you.

Reply to
rangerssuck

No worries. I'm not a conspiracy nut. Just trying to pint out the obvious that if I were an investigator and someone knew a lot about counterfeiting and didn't show up on my radar as an investigator, I'd surely take a closer look at them.

Now back to our regularly scheduled programming...

Regards, Joe Agro, Jr. (800) 871-5022

01.908.542.0244 Automatic / Pneumatic Drills:
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Spindle Drills:
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Site:
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V8013-R
Reply to
Joe AutoDrill

[snip]

Pics or it didn't happen.

Reply to
Paul Hovnanian P.E.

While visiting a hardware outlet in the other London with senior son four years ago, he questioned the cashier, when she placed the bill under a UV light as to how often she found counterfeit bills. Her answer? "About a half hour ago!" Gerry :-)} London, Canada

Reply to
Gerald Miller

OK, it didn't happen.

Reply to
rangerssuck

I'm fresh out of ritish pounds so I can't see what they're looking for. But Canadian bills have some spots that glow blus under UV. Not sure if there's a denomination-based pattern. But its something that'll trip up the fools with color printers.

Reply to
Paul Hovnanian P.E.

This has surely been addressed before, but I wonder what is the

*practical* attraction for counterfeiting really high-quality bills. It seems as though the talent & trouble required to do a good job (one that can fool the regular detection methods) could produce even greater profit if put to a legitimate use. Personally, if I were to try my hand at counterfeiting, I'd do dimes. I would get to play with metal (making the dies, for starters), and who would ever suspect a dime as being bogus? Now, when the time came to buy a car, and I showed up with a dump truck full of dimes, someone might wonder, so I would have to play it cool...

Joe

Disclaimer (for the clueless LE types): I have never, nor will I ever, attempt to duplicate *anything* in violation of any applicable laws!

Reply to
Joe

This guy thought like that:

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IIRC, he lost money on the venture, after capital costs of presses and materials costs, even before he got caught.

That's where your "front" vending machine company comes in handy. They're expecting you to deposit sacks of coins.

Apparently it costs the US mint around $0.04 to make a dime (lower denomination coins cost more than their face value to make). There are plenty of legitimate businesses with better markups to retail than that.

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Hypotheticals. Years ago I saw a display at the Bank of England showing their cost to make a highly secure 50 pound note. It was shockingly high, something like $5 or $10 each. A lot for a fancy colorful piece of paper, with a relatively short life in circulation.

Reply to
Spehro Pefhany

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