Interested in taking up lockpicking.

For some time now I have been interested in taking up lockpicking as a hobby. I want to make clear that my interest is purely for entertainment value and not for criminal intent. I know the basics of how to pick locks all I am lacking are the tools, and a LOT of pratice. There is a locksmiths shop near where I live however I feel uncomfortable going up to the counter asking "do you sell lock picking sets" without first knowing if it is legal to buy/own them where I live without being a licensed lock smith, I live in Vancouver B.C. Canada. I also know that you can purchase lock picking kits online but I also feel that some/many of these sites are a bit fishy legally.

Reply to
Locut0s
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Lock picking is not a hobby.

I want to make clear that my interest is purely for entertainment

Your request will probably be declined.

I live in

Gee, what would make you think that?

Reply to
Roger Shoaf

Of course it can be!

regards - Ralph

Reply to
Ralph A. Schmid, DK5RAS

Speaking only for myself, my policy is that I don't teach picking techniques unless I've personally known the person for two years.

You can find many forums on the web, but that's out of my control.

When I was new at locksmithing, I was completely fascinated by picking. Now, after 20+ years in the trade, it's an important part of the job, but not totally fascinating. There is so much more to the job.

The reasons I don't teach picking are several.

1) There is no way to know who is the person asking. Most people asking (or lurking and reading the posts) are decent people, but a few are not. So, I've decided simply not to say anything to anyone.

2) Picking locks is a "trade secret" like many other trades which have their techniques and systems.

3) A very small part of the security of locks is that so few people know how to pick them. So, by teaching lock picking, I make all locks less secure for the world. Not what I want to do.

4) Purely selfishly, I learned lock picking the hard way, with lots of practice, and you can do the same.

I wish you well. Hope this doesn't sound unkind, but the world isn't a nice place sometimes.

To reply to your post, a bit more specifically. When you start entertaining people by picking locks, you are sure to get a lot of folks who ask questions. How did you do that? Show me how? What is that tool? What does it do? And as more people learn more about picking, then your car, house, tool box become less secure.

Second question to consider. Do you really want people to know that you're a lock picker? That will make you a high profile suspect every time something is missing, moved, or whatever. "Musta been Locut... he can pick locks".

Reply to
Stormin Mormon

Buy any cheap lock picking set from the Internet and start practicing. Cheap lock pick sets tend to have thicker picks. As a beginner, you'll need thicker lock picks because most beginners tend to break and bend their picks while finding their technique.

Reply to
Matthew

First step, call the local police and simply ask. Then call the local prosecuting body (in my area of the US it's called a "District Attorney" or DA for short). The prosecuting body would be the one that represents the government at your trial.

If the Police and the DA have different responses, you should consider finding another hobby.

If it's OK to own picks (at least in your own home) you can order them from Southern Ordinance.

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hasd reasonable prices and reasonable selections. Before you buy, search this group with google to find out how simple your pick set should be. Hint: you don't need the

64 piece set :-)

Daniel

Reply to
dbs__usenet

This statement will be no more true the 100th time you state it than it was the

1st. Anything can be, and likely is, for someone, a hobby.
Reply to
Putyourspamhere

following from Canadian criminal code would seem to apply to them.

Criminal Code PART IX OFFENCES AGAINST RIGHTS OF PROPERTY Breaking and Entering Possession of break-in instrument

351. (1) Every one who, without lawful excuse, the proof of which lies on him, has in his possession any instrument suitable for the purpose of breaking into any place, motor vehicle, vault or safe under circumstances that give rise to a reasonable inference that the instrument has been used or is or was intended to be used for any such purpose, is guilty of an indictable offence and liable to imprisonment for a term not exceeding ten years. Disguise with intent (2) Every one who, with intent to commit an indictable offence, has his face masked or coloured or is otherwise disguised is guilty of an indictable offence and liable to imprisonment for a term not exceeding ten years.

R.S., 1985, c. C-46, s. 351; R.S., 1985, c. 27 (1st Supp.), s. 48. If you get picks it would probably be a good idea for you to keep them in the privacy of your own home and make sure there is plenty of evidence that lockpicking is your hobby and nothing more. Also keep in mind that picks may be and likely are on the banned list for importation into the country and may be seized by your customs service. There is also a locksports group basically a lockpicking club on Yahoo. You may wish to try there.

Reply to
Putyourspamhere

Why are some of you so uptight about people taking up lockpicking as a hobby? First of all, few "criminals" pick locks, they just break in any way they can (that's a valid statistic). As someone who took up picking locks for a hobby, I'd starve as a crook, as it takes me forever to bypass most locks. But, the satisfaction of doing it is a thrill. It's like solving an impossible puzzle. And, after all, that's all a lock is. It's just a miniature puzzle you have to manipulate in the dark. Personally, I find the experience almost Zen-like, whether I get the thing open or not.

And trust me, a locksmithing license does not make you ethical. Being ethical makes you ethical, and there are unethical people in every trade, license or not. Maybe a plumber or electrician has never stolen anything, but I guarantee you that "some" of them have padded their hours and charged for items not used. Being unethical doesn't always mean breaking into something that doesn't belong to you.

What I've learned from my "hobby" is that picking locks is a lot harder than it looks on TV and in the movies. What I've learned from this newsgroup is that locksmithing is a lot more than picking locks, and I've also gained a greater respect for locksmiths in general. Furthermore, I've learned a lot about security. The more you know about locks and how difficult or easy it is to bypass them -- even if the bypass is done with a swift kick to the door -- the better prepared you are when you start securing your own home and valuables.

One can certainly understand why nobody in their right mind would help someone who posts a message in this group bypass anything, and some of the posts here are just downright obvious. But trust me, even if you have the tools -- which anybody can get on the Internet -- bypassing a lock is still an art that's difficult to learn.

Hell, anything is a hobby if you don't get paid to do it. I learned how to play guitar, but not one professional musician got upset when I did, and many of them even helped me. It's just that for whatever reason learning how to pick locks has become this taboo thing that's cloaked in secrecy.

Somebody in this group wanted to know why there aren't more laws against owning lockpicking tools. I'd like to know why it's so difficult to get lockpicking tools, yet I can buy a handgun damn near anywhere.

Sheldon snipped-for-privacy@sopris.net

Reply to
Sheldon

Wonder if lock picks have "legititmate sporting uses"?

Reply to
Stormin Mormon

Only a few are. Personally I have to laugh everytime Roger says that. Obviously anything can be and for someone somewhere is a hobby. Where most people here draw the line is in giving defeating information requiring less or no skill and practice to implement. No one here can tell you how to pick locks and be even slightly proficient. You have to learn it on your own. However every pro here and many of the amatures can tell you how to destructively compromise 90% of the residential (and a good portion of the institutional/commercial) locks in America in less than a minute.

I love when people say a statistic is valid and yet don't post any valid source for it ;). Truthfully it really isn't possible to state with any degree of acuracy. The only way to determine if a lock was picked is through detailed forensic examination of the lock. That usually isn't done unless there is some compelling reason to do so. Especially when you consider that knowing for sure the lock was picked often isn't going to do much for the investigation, although it may tend to prove a crime occurred.

The kind of criminal likely to pick locks is the kind who has an important reason to not leave obvious evidence of method. i.e. the cashier who would really like to get in that drop safe and dip into the other shifts drops. If the safe is relocked who's to say with any certainty who took the money? Or the employee with legitimate access to an area who is denied access to another area whether it be a room or desk drawer within. Or the kid who want's to get his fathers gun cabinet or gun lock open but obviously doesn't want to destroy the lock in the process.

"Bypassing" most locks is not especially difficult. Picking them may or may not be.

It isn't.

Not from a dealer w/o passing the instant check. Unless it's at a gunshow and even then the purchase is frequently subject to other restrictions. Try to mail order a handgun sometime.

Reply to
Putyourspamhere

They have plenty of legitimate uses. The term sporting is BS when applied to gun laws. It's only purpose is to further narrow the term legitimate uses.

Reply to
Putyourspamhere

As a matter of fact the folks on the yahoo lockpicking group have organized picking competitions. I am assuming that a competition makes it a sport and thus allows a "yes" answer to your query. Kind of a stretch, huh?

Daniel

Reply to
dbs__usenet

Well, not really. You mean to tell me professional locksmiths don't have competitions? And if not, no one has ever thought of doing this? I can't believe it. Even auto mechanics have legitimate competitions.

Reply to
Sheldon

Okay, even with everything I said in my original reply, I have to admit I agree with every response you've given. Yes, people will pick locks to open something so as not to make it look like it was "broken" into (like government agents). But that's not the normal MO for "most" crooks. When somebody steals something, there's usually a clue that it's gone. It really doesn't matter whether they picked the lock or broke the window. You're gonna notice the TV is gone when you walk in the room. Now I will admit, jewelry or cash might be a different story, so I can see your point.

As I said, I have to agree with all your comments, but you have to admit there's more than one person out there like me who has no criminal intent and just enjoys a challenge. Maybe the reason some of my observations are flawed is that I don't think like a criminal.

But, as I said, I've learned a thing or two here. I have a front door that's mostly glass. I had no intention of putting a reinforced deadbolt on the door until I learned that yes, somebody could easily break the window, but they'd have a hell of a time getting stuff out of the house if they couldn't get the door open. I never would have thought of that if somebody here hadn't set me straight.

As I said before, picking locks is picking locks, but locksmithing goes far beyond that. Maybe you guys should call yourselves security consultants. I'm sure some of you do.

Sheldon snipped-for-privacy@sopris.net

Reply to
Sheldon

safes usually... at least here in the states

you get 3 locks, and best overall time wins...and they are NOT all the same brand/model.

--Shiva--

Reply to
--Shiva--

group have

makes it a sport

stretch, huh?

locksmiths don't have

doing this? I can't

competitions.

had a competition one time. showed up at the same time as pop-a-lock. the pop-a-lock dude looked around 20 or so. he was kinda smart mouthed. you know, one that knows everything there is to know about any given subject. the customer said she would pay the person that got the car open first. normally I would just collect my service call and leave. however, I couldn't resist teaching this kid a lesson. had the car open while he was still trying to insert his wedge. he was still trying to collect his service call while I drove off laughing :-)

g'day all

Reply to
"Key

Not often. Trade shows do on rare occasion, and it's more often "how quick can you repin that cylinder" than "how quick can you pick it" -- except for cases where someone has a new highly-pick-resistant design out and is challenging all comers to find a way to defeat it.

Most of us are quite comfortable with our tools and don't really feel a need to wave them in other folks' faces to prove it.

Reply to
Joe Kesselman (yclept Keshlam

Lockpicks are not always hard to find for the average everyday Joe anymore by the way. Shoot, I have seen a perent come in and buy a set for thier teenage kids quite often actually. I agree completely about the whole burglary and just breaking in through windows and doors and what not. If they want to get in they will find a way in. I love selling them to people and giving them challegnes to open, with diff picks I sell. It is a sport in my eyes.

Reply to
Bryan McLaren

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