A new welder

My son, 35, wants to put up some robust shelving in his garage. We talked about it and schemed some last weekend, came up with a plan. I said I'd be glad to pick up the steel but he wanted the experience of going to Discount Steel -- and it is definitely an experience. So he did -- and he definitely enjoyed the experience. He also picked up a sixpack of zinc-rich primer rattlecans at Grainger during the week. Today we welded up some shelf brackets. The shelves will be

3/4" good-quality void-free 7-ply or 9-ply. The cost difference at Depot between cabinet-grade plywood (no hardwood veneer) and crap is surprisingly modest. The uprights are 1 x 2 x 3/16" channel, the shelf supports 1-1/2 x 1-1/2 x 1/8" angle, two 12" shelves per support. We had a perfect day for cutting steel in the back yard: nearly 60, not sunny but not rainy or windy either. I acted as mentor and gofer. Kev did all of the measuring, marking and cutting with the portable bandsaw. Then he drilled the 5/16" lagbolt holes on the drillpress and learned a coupla things about drilling steel -- drop of cutting fluid, brisk initial plunge to get a chip going, then just enough pressure to keep a curly chip going (smoke is OK long as the chip is curly), ease off just a tad right when it breaks thru so it doesn't grab. Y'all know the drill, now he does too. Thence to the weldatorium. Did that indoors with the doors open since MIG makes very little smoke or sparks and no slag. I can move Mr. Miller out on the apron, but didn't see any reason to do so. Kev did all of the welding, every bit of it. He's never welded before. I offered some verbal suggestions, handed him the autodark and the gun and invited him to have at it -- which he did with enthusiasm. We consulted a coupla times about settings -- let's try adjusting the wirefeed rate and the voltage, see if we notice any difference in how it runs and sounds and looks when the mask goes up. He sure did! His first welds weren't bad at all, though he did go over a couple of them again and I did patch one a bit for him. Had one jigging eau chitte so he got to learn how to "unweld" with angle grinder and thin cutoff wheel -- and saw that his weld was definitely sound. He learned how tack welds in some places work better than others in that they'll suffer some bending and twisting but they don't stretch for crap so location counts if adjustment might be desired. Got so our "jigging" amounted to me getting a piece oriented to the line and square, then holding it (with gloves) and shutting my eyes while he shot a tack. After about the third one we didn't need the hammer anymore! They all came out straight and about blackout square. All of his welds will unquestionably hold their loads, and his later ones were quite respectable in appearance as well. It's easy for a beginner to make a cold no-strength weld with MIG and not know it, but I know what a good weld looks like whether pretty or otherwise. His weren't all pretty, but they were all good -- eventually. No photos because the paint is wet -- and they're not *that* great but they're certainly a hell of a lot better than the best buzzbox stick welds I made on my first day or my third way back when. As usual, I learned a thing. I now see the value of knocking off mill scale in selected situations. I've never worried about it with stick or MIG and never had a problem -- but some of his tacks were cold until we started turning up the heat for tacks. Hm! I now think that once one gets a good puddle going the scale gets blasted off and mostly floats to the top of the puddle. Hey, we're not doing nuclear containment vessels and we don't need to pass Xray! But a MIG tack doesn't seem to get enough of a puddle going to do that unless the heat is one full step higher than it would be for running a bead without punchthru. It is unquestionably best to remove all millscale from all weld zones, but I don't generally regard it as worth the bother and I've never had a weld fail in service. However, I think I will now make barespots for tack welds with MIG.
Reply to
Don Foreman
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Slam the heat to a tack weld. I usually crank up two steps.

Yup. Thats one of the things Toms wire cup wheels are good for. The gnarly knotted ones. Stick one on an angle grinder and hit her hard. Burns right through the scale right quick.

Gunner, who just got the new (old) Airco/Esab Heliwelder V (square wave) running on Tig tonight. Had to modify an old Hobart pedal and put in new switch and pot and cabling..but she purrs..she purrs.....310 amps AC Squarewave makes right pretty aluminum welds.....

Political Correctness

A doctrine fostered by a delusional, illogical liberal minority and rabidly promoted by an unscrupulous mainstream media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a turd by the clean end.

Reply to
Gunner

I always tack with a higher setting then for welding. Short time to get the energy there, so higher voltage.

Nick

Reply to
Nick Mueller

For four generations in our family, most of the male bonding or "get togethers" involve a joint project. Sure beats sitting around the tube together. Of course, fishing together is in a whole 'nuther league.

You're lucky, you can still show your son a thing or two. "The Kid" is a FAR better welder - machinist - fabricator than I.

Reply to
Karl Townsend

Thanx for a great report, Don. Definitely a whole 'nother spin on "new tricks and old dogs".

Reply to
Robert Swinney

How does the squarewave work (compared to straight AC) on thin stuff? I have no complaints at all TIG'n ally thick enough for current > 60 amps but have often wondered if squarewave would provide a more stable arc at currents below 40 amps or so -- enough improvement to bother making a little add-on squarewaver box for currents of say 75 amps and below. I have a theoretical answer to that question, but I'm interested in hands-on mask-down experienced observations with squarewave at low currents.

Reply to
Don Foreman

'Tis indeed. I recall one June evening when I was wormin' some submerged stumps on little lake X about 40 miles from town and catchin' nice bass fairly regularly when I noted a boat launch at yonder ramp, head right toward me and just keep comin' till I thought it'd run over me. "What a flaming jerk", I thought. The boat came to a stop about a boatlength away, the driver flipped his bowmount foot-controlled electric motor in, shot me a big scativorous grin and said, "Hi, Dad!"

I softly said "6-inch motoroil power worm." Man, we caught and released a buncha decent bass that evening! Guys in a boat about 20 yards away couldn't believe we were throwing back all those fish. We said "dang bass keep taking our lures so we can't catch any freakin' walleye! (in 6 feet of water)

Being taught is just as much fun as being the teacher, sometimes even more!

Reply to
Don Foreman

Very nice, though I would call him a new weldor. Why such thick angle for shelving, what is he going to store on these shelves?

i
Reply to
Ignoramus12689

You learned a lot of things there by merely doing and observing.

One thing ........ you mentioned moving the welder to the apron .......... You need to know that MIG is VERY susceptible to the wind, even a slight breeze. Welding outside needs to be done in dead calm conditions. Otherwise, do it in the still air of a garage or other enclosure. Wind messes up welds far worse than mill scale.

As always, BEFOREHAND, get your spray hose or fire extinguisher handy. Sprayhoses are not great for electrical stuff, but if it's what you got, it's far better to have it there and at the ready than in the back yard unhooked and strung and tangled all over the place. Do a good lookaround for flammables such as paper, cause those little molten BBs can travel a long ways and stay hot.

Nice story.

Steve

Reply to
Steve B

"Tom Gardner" wrote

I once worked at a stainless steel fab shop. Most of the welding was on small stuff on a table, and me sitting on a stool. My neck vee got FRIED the first couple of days. Then I took a piece of leather and laced it to the bottom of my hood, and that fixed that. Soft thin leather. OSHA and hunters call them "snoods". (They're on wild turkey's chins.)

Steve

Reply to
Steve B

We'll see today. His forearms might be a bit pink. He'll love it. Girlfriend: "Kev, how did you get a sunburn?" "Aw, just doin' a little welding." (Her dad is a welder...)

MIG welding is like shooting: everyone (of either gender) I've introduced to it has loved discovering that they can do it too. It's FUN!

Reply to
Don Foreman

Whatever he wants, since he'll never have to worry about them.

I once regretted underbuilding a shelf system many years ago, have never since regretted overbuilding them a little.

Reply to
Don Foreman

Thanks! If we'd gone outside to weld we'd have used fluxcore. MIG is nicer, but some jobs are too big to bring inside, e.g. trailers. I do have three ABC fire extinguishers in my shop, and they're all inspected regularly.

Reply to
Don Foreman

My big Airco 300 (digital readouts etc etc) , has all the square wave knobs and gizmos and thingajiggys and I managed to weld a couple Pepsi cans together at the base not long ago, and could only do so using square wave (with a .02 electrode and tiny aluminum wire) at about 5-15 amps.

You can dial it down and in for doing really really thin stuff. Im still learning how to use the big bitch.

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This smaller welder has none of the options except post purge time. The silkscreening is there for the other options..but none of the boards are there nor are the shaft holes punched out.

However I did try it with some AC rod sometime back at the suggestion of a poster and it welded marvelously, like welding DC, with none of the arc blow. Ill play with this beasty this weekend and see what it can do.

Im NOT a welder, nor do I play one on TV..but I manage to stick things together well enough. Sometimes even pretty.

I dont have picturs of it yet...but its my third tig...cringe.

This one..I repaired and loaned to a friend of mine after building a stand for it

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Miller Dialarc 250 HF)

Gunner

Political Correctness

A doctrine fostered by a delusional, illogical liberal minority and rabidly promoted by an unscrupulous mainstream media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a turd by the clean end.

Reply to
Gunner

Did your son get a little triangular sunburn on his chest from having his shirt not having the top butoned? I hate it when I forget.

Reply to
Tom Gardner

That's what I wanted to know, thanks! It might be worth the bother to cook up an addon squarewave box for work below 75 amps with my DialArc 250HF. It works fine at low current in DC mode but arc stability is poor below about 40 amps on AC -- which isn't surprising.

Reply to
Don Foreman

"Don Foreman" wrote

That's a good thing. Most discover what kind of fire extinguishers they have, and if they're within inspection after the FD leaves.

Steve

Reply to
Steve B

I like a factor of 3. This allows for almost any situation, and if you can overload a system built with 3x fabrication, it was going to fall anyway.

And most times, the difference between 1.25 overbuild and 3.00 is very little in time or materials. Sometimes, just plain geometry and common sense. If not that, then just a little thicker metal.

Steve

Steve

Reply to
Steve B

The first MIG I bought as a kid for doing a project car in the parent's garage. I never MIGed before so EVERYTHING metal within the range of the cord got a experimental bead.

Reply to
Tom Gardner

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