RAF Hampdens question on paint scheme

Hi,
At this URL...
http://homepages.paradise.net.nz/southfly/hampden.htm
I have posted several pictures of 489 NZ Sqn Hampdens. I am trying to
gather information on why one Hampden (XA-Y) appears to be painted in an 'ocean' grey and sky scheme, yet images of both earlier and later Hampdens from the sqn show them in Green/Brown/Black schemes. (Of course, the photo dates could be wrong...).
Can anyone shed any light on this matter, please? Was it a trial scheme, as I have only ever seen this Hampden wearing it?
I am gathering info on the aircraft flown by 489 Sqn with the aim of publishing a book on the topic... any data anyone can provide is most welcome, esp. with regard to the Beauforts and Blenheims initially operated by the sqn. I managed to view several photos of the Mosquitos the sqn operated at the end on WWII, so hope to publish some profiles soon.
Thanks very much, Ian
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Ian wrote:

Ian:
    This sounds like a Coastal Command color scheme, probably really Extra Dark Sea Gray over Sky. I would have to do some digging into a mound of books to be sure, but I believe a couple of hampden squadrons were tasked with torpedo bombing for a while using modified aircraft. See if you can beg, borrow or steal a copy of the book "Hampden Special" from Ian Allen publishers. Should have some info.
                            Bill Shuey
                            Bill Shuey
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Hi Ian Looking at the photos on the web and a couple of the same aircraft in the Hampden Special I believe this aircraft is painted in the standard Coastal Command scheme of extra dark sea grey and dark slate grey over sky. Note that all the photos are from the same shoot and that the less common type of B&W film (Orthochrome I think, I can never remember which is which). This type of film gives some unusual effects with certain colours, and the roundels are the giveaway - the red and blue tonal values are reversed, with red coming out nearly black, and the yellow is very dark. One noticeable trait of this type of film is it is very difficult to distinguish between EDSG and DSG - the Hampden Special has very faint tonal variations which may or may not be a camouflage pattern. Note also the lack of underwing roundels, another trait of Coastal command schemes. The photos in the special are credited "British Official" and appear to come from a walkround series - these were usually taken for a reason - whether this was the colour scheme, the modified bomb doors (to enclose a torpedo) or something else I don't know.
--
Dave Swindell

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Good eye! Orthochromatic film was replaced by Panchromatic film during WWII. Cheers,
The Keeper (of too much crap!)
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writes

Thanks Dave,
You don't think it's more likely to be the standard monochrome top finish, then eg EDSG? Looks like I'll have to get that book! :)
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The standard temperate sea scheme upper surface colour for FAA and Coastal Command was a two tone scheme of Extra Dark Sea Grey and Dark Slate Grey. All over top surfaces in Extra Dark Sea Grey was not the norm until after the war, but there are cases where this was used (eg Banff wing Mossies). The point I was making earlier is with Ortho film it's very difficult to prove a two tone temperate sea scheme without other evidence, as a general rule though I'd go with a two tone scheme with Ortho photo's if the aircraft was serving with the FAA or Coastal Command and I had no other backup (eg a Pan or colour film shot, or documentary evidence otherwise) As this appears to be a one off scheme, (other photo's I have of UK operated TB1's would appear to show retention of their old Bomber Command Scheme) then either could be the case, but the port forward view appears to show slight tonal variations in a camouflage pattern, the stbd side view does as well if you look really closely, but I might be seeing what I want to here! I think on balance the two tone is more likely, but unless someone has pan or colour shots of this plane then there is no way of knowing for sure.
--
Dave Swindell

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The restored one at Langley (Canadian Museum of Flight) was from the torpedo bomber OTU at Patricia Bay. It is now in standard Bomber Command colours. I had taken some pics the last time I was there but am still unpacking after a move. I assume that they picked this up from the vestiges of paint left on the airframe after recovery. I will be in that area in September and will try to get some pics. If you do a search for "canadian museum of flight langley" you will find their site. However, it is currently under construction. The photos of the Hampden are all in grey primer.
Cheers,
Doc
writes

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On 15 Aug 2004 22:11:31 -0700, snipped-for-privacy@yahoo.com (Ian) wrote:

There was a proposal that these Hampdens carried an early/experimental Torpedo bombing scheme of Medium Sea Grey over Sky
There is evidence on the elevator of a pattern.
See here for a previous discussion:
http://disc.server.com/discussion.cgi?disc 4358;article37;title=Welcome%20to%20the%20RAF%20Discussion%20Forum;pagemark`
Don't reply to the btconnect address - and remove nospam!!
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(Ian) wrote:

http://disc.server.com/discussion.cgi?disc 4358;article37;title=Welcome%20to%20the%20RAF%20Discussion%20Forum;pagemark`
Thanks for that- is there any way of seeing the photos these guys are talking about?
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http://homepages.paradise.net.nz/southfly/hampden.htm
Did the above URL work for you? hth
The Keeper (of too much crap!)
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On 18 Aug 2004 18:38:04 -0700, snipped-for-privacy@yahoo.com (Ian) wrote:

Probably still have them somewhere - I'll look and see
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