HST IC125 couplers when failed?

I don't know about the multiple working, but I have kicking around in my draws (pardon the expression) an old loco guide book that mentions a special coupling bar that was stored in the guards compartment when not in use.

Now this book dated from the days of blue HST's so its relevance today might be limited, but I did see a yellow HST power car at Derby 2-3 weeks ago with its nose "hatch" open and a bar-like device hanging out.

Hope these ramblings are of some use, if you intend to model a failed HST, please take pictures!

It was a bloody great bar, I'm not sure how it fitted onto the HST drawbar but it would have fitted onto a standard draw hook on the loco that was to move the HST, this would have to be secure as the possibility of either over-run or propelling (pushing) of the HST might happen.

It might be better to ask in news:uk.railway were they will know for sure, you might even be luck an have a reply from a railway employee who has used the bar! :~)

Good thought - Will give them a call. I cannot see how to secure such a bar to a standard coupling hook. Some HSTs (8 power cars) were subsequently fitted with buffers (I saw a photo somewhere but failed to save a copy).

Seems it is true that you only find out if you understand something when you try and explain it to someone else.

Regards

Mike

Try typing "HST DVT" into Google - that should give you a few leads.

Cheers, Martyn

There were (are) indeed two separate HST emergency couplers, one long and one short, used as you describe Stuart.

Loco coupling hooks, being forgings, did not all fit the bars and there was a database set up of which locos could and could not be coupled (and at which end) to an HST. The gauge for checking this was a simple C shaped plate that gauged the hook throat and also the distance from the hook to the shackle pins.

As part of the ECML electrification project, some HST power cars were fitted with buffers and various other modifications so that the Class 91s could run in passenger service with HST sets before the Mk 4 coaches were ready - mainly so that the PCs could provide 415V 3 phase ETS which the 91s could not. At first the PCs were 'idlers' but later they were set up to provide traction power as well, so as to prevent problems with commutator glazing when the motors were rotating without power. The acceleration available from one of these hybrid sets was quite phenomenal.

Rigid bar coupling, as typing "hst emergency coupling" into Google would have told you :)

Some got buffers, but this was not repeat not to allow them to work in multiple sets (they'd need control cabling run through from the ends, and they didn't get that). The buffers were fitted to sets which were used as temporary coaching stock workign with class 91 electrics on the east coast main line. One power car was removed and replaced by the class 91, the other power car remained to act as a driving generator trailer, feeding power to the electrical system of the HST set. The buffers were fitted to allow the sets to be shunted without firing up the main engine.

Whilst this is true, I thought the earliest application of the buffer fitted power cars was for proving the push-pull system on the WCML. I remember trains of mark 2s with an 86 on one end and a power car on the other.

ROB

Kind of like the couplings at the gangwayed end of a pacer then.

Mat.

Thanks for all the info, I wasn't in the country during all this so I missed it, hadn't realised just how much had gone on whilst I was away. Two bars solves the problem, I wondered how they coupled up to other engines when they needed rescue or for shunting.

Regards

Mike

Stuart would it be okay to quote your reply verbatim ?

This is for a web page . . .

Mike

I have a pic of 43123 on the back of an 86-hauled Wolverhampton service from Euston here:

The initial tests for the TDM system were carried out on the WCML ,initally with 87101 and a Class 305 EMU, and then the HST conversions. As previously stated, the HST DVTs moved to the ECML for use behind the

91s and 89 on KX-Leeds services. Happy days...

Adam Warr

It not often that a HST will fail completely. A bar coupler to couple over a locomotive hook is provided. The HST power cars that were fitted with buffers were used with multiple trials with class 91 locomotives. The class 91 locomotives had been built but the Mk4 coaching stock had not. Hence this was the only alternative to get running trials with class 91s. Once the Mk4 stock became available the converted HST power cars were returned to squadron use but retained their buffers. Hope this helps, Steve

Thanks it does. I had not realised just how much had been going on!

Regards

Mike

Sure, no problem. One correction though - the loco bar has a fixed cross-bar on the end, rather than a pin, which goes over the loco hook. There is a pin but it goes in front of the loco hook jamming the loco hook between cross-bar and pin. Drop me an email if you want more details or daft stories. I once got called out to a 101 which had both ends stuck in different gears...

Stuart.

Many thanks

Mike

HST's with only one power car were capable of nudging the ton unassisted. However, they had to be loco-assisted over the Devon banks if one PC was dead. Two of the buffer fitted PC's (43013/43014 IIRC) are still in regular use with Network Rail's New Measurement Train. There's a pic of my buffer fitted 43123 at

Mick

Just to add to the confusion, ISTR seeing a magazine picture showing two of the buffer fitted power-cars coupled back to back, (like a pair of American singled ended loco's), puling a rake of Mk. 4's.

Believed to be high-speed trials with the new Mk. 4 stock in Scotland before the catenery was live.

I still think that a pair of 43's would have made a good, cheap, hi-speed loco for "Thunderbird" duties.

David C.

"David C" wrote

John.

Nice model

Mike