Safety chain

How heavy is the load..and what is the FPS of the load moving away from the support? I can figure it out for you

Gunner

I am the Sword of my Family and the Shield of my Nation. If sent, I will crush everything you have built, burn everything you love, and kill every one of you. (Hebrew quote)

What do you not understand about "accidental trailer disconnect".

The trailer coming loose, unless you were foolish enough to PLAN it, is ACCIDENTAL - ie. an accident. Your understanding and definition of accident is not the only valid one.

You talk about people quibbling over words and definitions, an you are (one of ) the wort for it on the group.

The carabineer will experience no load, except for the static weight of the chain. The chain and carabiner past the pin on the shackle are useless, unsafe, and rigged incorrectly.

What do I win?

"J. Clarke" wrote

A link is one of those little round thingies that go together to form a chain. On the pin of the shackle, there are two of them on the pin, one coming from the tow chain, the other going to a dead section of chain that is then held from dragging from a caribiner. That short dead section carries no load and serves no purpose. If it was to be pressed into service to lengthen the chain, a shackle would be unsafe and an incorrect way to join two sections of chain unless the links of the chain were sufficiently large enough for the shackle to pass through them, and one link be located on the top of the horseshoe formation of the shackle, and the other on the pin. The proper way would be to use a link for joining chain that has two pins and two cotter keys, kind of a double horseshoe, can't think of the name of it right now.

Yes, Grasshoppah. But what purpose does that dead section of chain have except to serve as something else to catch debris on the highway? IT SHOULDN'T BE THERE AT ALL.

Steve

"J. Clarke" wrote

So, with all your education, training, and expertise, you come here and tell us that the proper safe way to shorten a chain is with an improperly installed shackle and a fifty cent carabiner? And for that, I'm a fuckwad? If you rigged that up on my job, your name for you for the next year would be "WORM".

Have you, in all your lectures, courses, dissertations, education, practical experiences and travels EVER heard of a twin clevis link? Google it up, and see how it compares to your two links on a shackle pin setup. Google up chain repair link and see how many other industry acceptable ways there are to repair chains, but some of them unsafe for heavy shock loading. Some of them are marginally safe for 10% SWL. (That's Safe Working Load, in case you missed that in your lectures.)

JC, you can use a lot of stuff to rig chains, and the proof of the pudding is whether or not it holds during a lift, an incident, or an accident. There's right. There's wrong. There's improvised using what you got, but you wouldn't use it every day but you just can't do anything else and you hope it lasts for this use. Then there's stupid.

You can't fix stupid.

Steve

Heart surgery pending? Read up and prepare. Learn how to care for a friend.

In person, do you look like you're sucking on a lemon? 'Cause it kinda sounds like it.

Cheers! Rich

Steve B wrote in sci.engr.joining.welding on Mon, 18 Oct 2010 07:30:31 -0700:

For attaching to the next tow vehicle that has the chain loops in a different place and needs longer chains?

So, you'd use a chain with an improper and possibly illegal technique ( a shackle with two links on the pin) used to join two pieces of chain together? With chain, under extreme pulling stress, with two links on the pin like shown, they move to the sides of the shackle pin, and immediately on contacting the sides of the shackle, start to deform at ninety degrees, and the contour of the shackle causes the links to follow the shape of the sides of the shackle, causing the links to deform and possibly fail with a severe load on it. I have seen links fail in this application, hence my opposition to it from the start. It seems, though, that it looks okay. I'm just stating my opposition because I have seen it used, and seen it fail. BUT THAT IS UNDER EXTREME LOAD. In normal highway situations, it may be perfectly okay, but when things start flying, and things get shock loaded instantly, that is a failure scenario.

An acceptable substitute would be a twin clevis, or a double pad eye mounting system with the pad eyes mounted to the trailer frame with two to four long welds holding them on, and a grade 8 bolt through one pad eye, through the last chain link, through the next pad eye, then secured with a nut and keeper pin. It would be very easy to have a proper set of chains for each vehicle, or just short chains and twin clevis connectors.

Or just use any old way, and hope it shakes out okay.

Steve

Bottom line?

What caused it.

Was it "accidentally" not connected right?

Actually Steve, unless he has switched the photo, that is not the situation in the picture. There is a link hanging from the link that is in the shackle, but it is not on the pin.

The word professionals use for the "horseshoe shaped part" is the "bell" of the shackle.

But it does no harm.

Actually, if the chain needed to be lengthened, all that would be needed would be to take out the shackle and re-locate it to a more distant part of the chain, which was his whole point in the first place.

Unless you needed to lengthen the chain when switching vehicles. Or you are shortening the chain in a test before you cut it two links too short.

Steve B wrote in sci.engr.joining.welding on Tue, 19 Oct 2010 22:13:06 -0700:

No! I agree with you. But in the picture that I saw, the shackle pin was put through a link of the chain, and the shackle would be also attached to the tow vehicle(not shown in the picture). That leaves some of the length of chain unused. And if long enough, might dangle on the ground.

But the shackle pin is only through one link in the chain shown. Can you have a closer look at the picture?

That's not what I saw in the picture.

I agree that what you say is true. But that's not what was shown in the picture that was posted.

I agree that would be a great way to do it. Solid connection, no excess chain to dangle.

Hope is over rated.

I did not closely examine the photo, and was wrong. I would not use this type of rigging, but it is technically correct so as to leave the chain long enough for various vehicles, and keep the end from dragging.

My apologies to all.

Steve

This is all good and well, but many types of chain (if not most) do not have "enough hole" in the links to insert a shackle pin into the chain.

Ignoramus31115 fired this volley in news:0K2dne7EwrZ1oV3RnZ2dnUVZ snipped-for-privacy@giganews.com:

Um... Ig... Most chain has a slightly larger "hole" in the link than the diameter of the rod from which the chain was formed. Otherwise, how would the "next" link go into it? I think I've seen a few that have a "pinched" waist, so the links cannot rotate through one-another.

I own only 5/16" binder chains, which suit my tractor work. They have openings that are roughly 1/32" larger than the nominal 5/16". The links will rotate completely around in one another, including passing the weld.

LLoyd

Then you are usng the wrong chain for the task.

I am the Sword of my Family and the Shield of my Nation. If sent, I will crush everything you have built, burn everything you love, and kill every one of you. (Hebrew quote)

What the OP was trying to do is insert a shackle pin into a link IN THE MIDDLE OF THE CHAIN.

So he tries to insert a shackle pin in addition to having two neighboring links.

Works for me, as long as I slide the unloaded link into the middle.

jsw

Which MOST chains CAN accomodate.

Not a twisted link dog-chain - or a sash chain- but that's no good and illegal for a safety chain anyway

"Ignoramus31115" wrote

That is a fine point, Sir. My error in looking at the photo was called to my attention, and I realized that one COULD put a shackle in a line of links. But, as you point out, one would have to use one wussy of a shackle to be able to get it in there. Fine observation, Grasshopper.

Steve

Heart surgery pending? Read up and prepare. Learn how to care for a friend.