Electric shocks (was: 100V appliance on 110v power supply)

Fire Mouth: It So Happens It doesn't have a 3Prong plug, If You Had been Attending the thread conscientiously you'd not assume erroneously ., and he said the trany from japany is well grounded and supplies for agrounded 3P plug, it is simply a hot chassis assembly and I stated he can isolate it 100% from the circuits and supply with "stand offs" and other plastic isolating materials if that is desirable., Shock Proofing It !

The Fact that he got a harrowing Shock from it while testing it in his cement floor garage is noteworthy enough to take measures to make the Old For Sale Unit desirable of it's own volition irregardless of Supply.

Agreed: a Grounding conductor is always desirable and safest. Roy

From: w snipped-for-privacy@hotmail.com (w_tom) =A0=A0=A0=A0If a transformer is properly grounded as required by codes, then if the appliance has an internal short, that short will trip a circuit breaker.[ }:-oooh Not NEC ] Grounding transformer secondary is necessary for breaker to trip. Leakage across to a floating transformer secondary may put enough voltage on chassis to cause shocks - with or without an internal appliance problems. But transformer secondary must be safety grounded - as codes require. When grounded, further useful information (ie a tripping circuit breaker) would then tell us more, immediately eliminate any human safety threat, and cause humans on the scene to fix any existing problems. Even if the appliance does have an internal fault, that fault would not be fixed because a transformer secondary is not grounded. =A0=A0=A0=A0BTW, I have assumed the appliance has a three prong receptacle. I have mostly ignored a two prong receptacle because the problem could be more complex. First most, does the transformer have secondary properly safety grounded? "Roy Q.T." wrote: All those observations seem all for naught to me, since he as a Hot Chassis Item. It behooves whom ever get's to keep it to isolate the works 100% from that chassis with plastic or insulated offsets to avoid any objectionable current flowing through it as he's experienced., Or keep it as is and Fancy Oneself in those days. Point: No Manner of Transformer will correct the condition & a separate ground conductor will only disguise the fault. He should have plugged it in his safe insulated floored section, but then again it was all for the better :-) =AEoy

Reply to
Roy Q.T.
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This is correct. Standing barefoot on a concrete garage floor while dicking around with anything plugged into mains should never happen.

Good Luck - you'll need it. Rich

Reply to
Rich Grise

Nah - we'll just nominate him for this year's Darwin award.

Cheers! Rich

Reply to
Rich Grise

Word up.

Reply to
Bob Stephens

NOTE: this experience happened in the U.S.A. and other countries may differ

a friend of mine had a phonograph player in his basement. the unit operated fine, but if you touched a metal part of the player, and a metal support post in the basement, you would get a mild shock (about half of what I've gotten from touching 110v mains by accident)

Later on in life, I found out that if you attempt to bypass the safety feature of polarized p,ugs for non-grounded equipment, or if the electrical outlet was wired incorrectly, this happens.

as you are on a foriegn system, I cannot be sure, but I'd advise to switch the live and neutral lines. and also put an earth line in there also.

Reply to
tater schuld

This is because it was a hot chassis player. That is no longer acceptable in the US, but it was very popular for many years for cheap consumer electronics to operate without a power transformer and use a hot chassis. For almost any cheap table radio, record player, or TV set made before 1970 this was the case, and for a lot of TV sets well into the eighties it remained the case.

That just makes the problem worse, yes.

Grounding is a good idea, but if there is chassis leakage, that is bad and it should be fixed if possible.

--scott

Reply to
Scott Dorsey

Same Hazard Different Equipment; & In Puerto Rico [where US standards are applicable]

Liviing at the YMCA in 1980, I rigged a small 3 Pipe (EMT) Fixture to test & inspect stuff with a 3outlets/1switch head on a 1900 box and a lamp fxiture coming out of it, one of the pipes slightly bent out held my soldering pencil just right at the top just below the outlets, together with the other 2 pipes it opened up at the bottom like a Y and held up just right with nylon wire ties and actually looked cool., with one of those Aluminum Lamp Shades on a Gooseneck.

I had no wire so I snaked a piece of BX into it & added a plug, this worked ifne in the 2 prong outlets at the "Y" Then: I moved back to PR and connected it into an outlet in my fathers garage It Took Hold of me & Wouldn't let me Go ! my hand cramped over the metalclad plug, I managed to push myself off the wall and break free... I took the BX off and cabled it right and tested the circuit., the Contractors wiring had somehow opened and shunted the Neutral inside the unerground pipe, hence when I tried pulling the wires out to rewire it, the White neutral conductor would not pull out of the piping so I couldn't rewire the underfloor the concrete slab run.... It was hopless I thought & told Dad, we sold the house a few years after.... I couldv'e been killed.

thinking about it I tried to eliminte that shunted conductor to feed in a new one, but i recall the snake got stuck & wouldn't go through either, I could have used the Red Conductor for pull but there was a definite wire jam inside the pipe about half way under the garage. we moved.

Only God Knows how the new owner resolved it if he has :-o =AEoy

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From: snipped-for-privacy@panix.com (Scott=A0Dorsey) tater schuld wrote: NOTE: this experience happened in the U.S.A. and other countries may differ a friend of mine had a phonograph player in his basement. the unit operated fine, but if you touched a metal part of the player, and a metal support post in the basement, you would get a mild shock (about half of what I've gotten from touching 110v mains by accident) This is because it was a hot chassis player. That is no longer acceptable in the US, but it was very popular for many years for cheap consumer electronics to operate without a power transformer and use a hot chassis. For almost any cheap table radio, record player, or TV set made before 1970 this was the case, and for a lot of TV sets well into the eighties it remained the case. Later on in life, I found out that if you attempt to bypass the safety feature of polarized p,ugs for non-grounded equipment, or if the electrical outlet was wired incorrectly, this happens. That just makes the problem worse, yes. as you are on a foriegn system, I cannot be sure, but I'd advise to switch the live and neutral lines. and also put an earth line in there also. Grounding is a good idea, but if there is chassis leakage, that is bad and it should be fixed if possible.

--scott

Reply to
Roy Q.T.

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