is roommate right about the cost of turning heat (gas) on briefly in the morning?

snipped-for-privacy@crackasmile.org says...


No, we didn't, Dimmie. Steam systems are still around, particularly in commercial systems. Hot water systems are *quite* common and are still being installed.

How in hell do you manage to be AlwaysWrong, Dimbulb? There isn't any steam in a hydronic system. They run at about 180F @14PSI. There had better not be any steam in there.

No, it isn't. There is no steam at 140F (actually 180F), Dimbulb.

High efficiency is the reason they're still in use, Dimmie. Even non-condensing units are ~85% efficient.

No, Dimmie it isn't. ...any more than your 100W light bulb that doesn't put out as much heat as a 100W heater.

Wrong again, Dimbulb. How _do_ you manage it?

Six one, half dozen of the other. The heat isn't going anywhere, except into the room.

No, Dimbulb, that isn't "known".
--
Keith

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Water based cooling systems, yes. Boiler operated systems... hardly.
What is "quite common" is your inane need to follow around behind my posts like a little retard. You are as bad as the RoyTard. Sad part is that you actually have SOME brains.
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snipped-for-privacy@crackasmile.org says...

1) Steam boilers are still used in many large installations. 2) Hydronic furnaces are still called "boilers", even though they don't boil anything.

They only reason for anyone to follow you around is to clean up the shit you spew, Dimbulb.
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No shit. Not nearly as often for building heating functions, however. More often used in modern times for hot water for kitchens, showers, etc.

No. They are called hydronic boilers. They are not called boilers at all. They are not called hydronic furnaces either. That is the term for the entire system.

Except that it is you that is full of shit, boy.
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snipped-for-privacy@crackasmile.org says...

Wrong, as usual, Dimbulb.

Or "boilers" for short. Wrong again, AlwaysWrong.

That's three strikes, Dimmie.
--
Keith

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If there is no steam, then it is NOT a boiler, idiot.
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snipped-for-privacy@crackasmile.org says...

Tell that to the companies that make them.
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They make HYDRONIC BOILERS, and that is what they call them. They do NOT make boilers, and then put them into a hydronic furnace. They are two different animals. Just like you... not human.
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snipped-for-privacy@crackasmile.org says...

"Hydronic" is an adjective, modifying the word "boiler", Dimbulb. According to you, if they don't boil (water) they can't be called "boilers", hydronic or not. Wrong again, AlwaysWrong.

That's three more strikes, Dimbulb. You must stay up all night thinking of more ways to be wrong.
--
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What's the matter? Wasn't the plate of shit you had for breakfast this morning skanky enough for you?
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snipped-for-privacy@crackasmile.org says...

Nope, no breakfast at all, Dimbulb. I don't live with you, though no one could.
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ChairmanOfTheBored wrote:

By definition, to me, you are strange. The USA is strange.
"Of, relating to, or characteristic of another place or part of the world; foreign."
It wasn't intended to infer inferiority or superiority - just difference. American English is not the same as British English.
To misuse a quotation, "In the strange world of English, skating on thin ice can easily get you into hot water*.."
*But let's not get steamed up about it..
--
Sue

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Oh... I don't know... banging your brains out in a centuries old stone mansion master bedroom sounds like a fun manner of getting steamed up. ;-] Whether it is cold out or not... Do you smoke after sex... or is it steam?
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@privacy.net says...

No, he's wrong, assuming that heat is wanted. Of course it's cheaper to freeze. In almost all cases, it's more efficient (I.e. cheaper) to let the building cool when there is no need for heat. Any "surge" in heat is more than compensated by the lower heat loss during the "down" time. Heet lost (thus needed) is proportional to the difference in temperature so keeping the inside temperature low when the area is not in use will save energy and money. OTOH, some heat sources don't take kindly to being shut down (electric and radiant hydronic, in particular) and will take "forever" to recover, though. These heat sources should be set and left. This isn't a matter of efficiency, rather practicality.

It's the same in much of the US. I have (had) "hydronic" systems, both oil and gas fired, as you describe and grew up with gas-fired forced-air. We have had electric baseboard as well. I think I prefer forced-air, but hydronic is fine too. Electic baseboard would be ideal if electricity weren't so expensive.

Both are used in the US. "Hydronic" systems seem to be more common in the North and forced-air more common in moderate climes.

In all the systems I've seen the "boiler" is left operating, so there is no mass of water than needs to come up to temperature, though it must be kept at temperature when the heating system is not in use. This generally isn't a problem since there is a need for background heat anyway (it also keeps the boiler from rusting). Perhaps this is why hyronic systems are seen mainly in the Northern climes. My "boiler" also heats domestic water, so it runs all year.

The heat from the cooling water doesn't really go to waste in the heating season. It's still heating the building.

No, you forgot that Dimbulb is a pedantic moron. ...and AlwaysWrong.

Don't apologize to Dimbulb. It'll swell his puny head to the popping point.
--
Keith

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You're a goddamned retard. Evidenced by your assertion that "the north" uses water more than forced air.
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snipped-for-privacy@crackasmile.org says...

'Tis a fact, Dimbulb.
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OK, you got my burner goin'...
The worrisome flatmate is correct that -- if you take the view of considering the time the heat is enjoyed (ie, briefly before going to work) -- it is more costly *per minute of enjoyed benefit* from the fuel used to heat the flat. But the cost of that fuel used to heat for that 10 minutes isn't any more costly than that same 10 minutes when they get home in the evening. Except... Because it is, presumably, colder in the a.m. than in the p.m., it may require a *little* more fuel to heat the flat to 24o C in the morning, but as Sue said, it doesn't amount to much more "scratch".
The heat isn't "more costly", but without anyone there to enjoy it after you've both gone to work, maybe that's what he means by "costly": a few pence for only a few minutes of warmth, whereas if it was evening, someone might enjoy that comfort for an hour.
My read is that the flatmate is saying, in essence, "Suck it up, matey. It's such a small period of time to be cold before getting into your car (which can be heated with waste heat from the burning of fuel -- basically, "free") or arriving at work where *they* pay for your comfort".
--
DaveC
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