Thermite Welding?

Thermite is used in the welding industry. If a mass of thermite was
ignited in a container underwater, would it continue to burn? Fully
submerged underwater.
Reply to
crows_32
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Cant talk about it until I've thoroughly searched the USPTO website, but Ernie - you'll be the first to know.
Reply to
Lefty
Yes. Hasrd to ignite! I used 3 ignition sparklers - normally one. Thermite was not wet, only moist.
Mixture (factory made from Goldstein Co., Germany, used for rail-welding) gave many sparks, but these sparks seemed to be more small explosions. I think, it was oxyhydrogen gas.
Since this "trial" I dry thermite always in the baking oven before using it.
P.Pr.
Reply to
Peter Prucker
Peter, do you buy the thermite or make it yourself? I'd presume that if you bought it you wouldn't (or shouldn't) have to worry as much about the wetness. Or am I wrong on this? TM
-- Toadmonkey: "Now now. Brain popping and world crashing may be hazardous to ones perception of reality. Very dangerous business that can lead to madness or something worse for some, truth."
Please remove all bits of spam from addy before replying....
Reply to
toadmonkey
Why should I buy thermite or even make by myself? The first has something to do with money, the latter with work. And work ruins all the day! :-((
I let it donate to me. It´s for training of vocational schools.
But even this original thermite will get moistened from longer storage. It´s realy necessary to dry it in the oven at temperatures something over 100 Celsius.
For ignition we use a sort of thicker sparklers, also from "Goldschmidt". (Sorry, in my first posting I used the wrong name "Goldstein". Mistake! Goldschmidt was the inventor, his factory is still existing in Germany.)
Greetings
P.Pr.
Reply to
Peter Prucker
Yes - and a big question of heat transfer. I dont think that water could remove heat faster than it being generated, even ice water.
One thing it will do, however, is to create a HUGE amount of steam and turbulence, probably making any respectable welding unfeasable. Refractory molds which are ordinarily used in this process would become waterlogged and probably explode underwater, unless you can afford solid blocks of graphite or certain other materials. It would not be a practical method for most apps.
Check the USPTO website. Someone invented a laser method for underwater use. I think you'd do much better with a laser. You can contact the inventor to see if it's commercially available etc.
Reply to
Lefty
I think that depends on factors not readily apparent from the original question -- such as the size and configuration of the thermite sample and its contact with water. As an almost absurd example, spread a gram of thermite over a square meter of almost anything and I doubt that it will self-sustain.
For any normal welding situation, you are right of course.
Steve Turner
Real address contains worldnet instead of spamnet
Reply to
Steve Turner
I'd like to see it in action myself - all I can tell you is that I've seen that patent. I have to admit - it does sound interesting - if it works. Sometimes I think that engineers will patent something to cover their ass even if it dosent work "yet", because they expect it to after some refinements.
I think that you could get past the turbulence issue with a laser by using a piece of pure optical grade fused quartz as a "welding tip". It can certainly take the heat, extremely low modulus of expansion, and it behaves alot like glass. You could use a cylider of optical quartz to communicate the laser energy diretly to the weld zone, and because you can get so close to the weld with the quartz the turbulence and steam issues can be somewhat minimized.
I'm just tossing shit out here, but I certainly think it's possible. There's a hundred ways to skin that cat.
Reply to
Lefty
One factor to consider is that molten iron in contact with water releases hydrogen gas as Fe+2H20->FeO2 + 2(H2). Under water there is no free oxyget to ignite the hydrogen, but if it is a surface reaction then the available oxygen in the air may cause an explosion. This is cautioned in early books on Thermit welding on railroad rails.
snipped-for-privacy@aol.com (formerly) wrote:
Reply to
David Grauman
This would depend on the configuration (binders containment etc) of the system. In many cases the answer would be no. However, see what you can find on the Pyronol Torches, which supplement the Al with Ni, and "are" used for underwater applications.
Reply to
Terry Wilder
Eh?
You didn't catch the pointing out of your quite hilarious miss-spelled word? All the "top secret, burn before reading, if I tell you I have to kill you, bullshit goes up in smoke when you spell "proprietary" as "proproetary".
Reply to
Don Thompson
I dont know nuthin' bout that stuff, but I heard that the ATF mixed cowshit and fuel oil with chickenpiss, and they shoots' it out them tanks like in Waco.
Reply to
Lefty

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