Aluminum Milling Coolant ( AGAIN!!! )

anorton wrote:


I could also blame the late hour, but I refuse to blame alcohol for my own boorishness! ;-)
Cheers! Rich
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One more thing that flood coolant is good for, is at washing the milling area down for cleaning.
i
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As far as I know, you have two options:
1) Vegetable oil based mist cooling, which you may not like for many reasons.
2) A blast of cold air.
Both have powerful negatives. Mist coolant settles on everything in the shop and also spreads chips everywhere. Blast of cold air spreads chips everywhere.
i
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On 3/21/2011 1:37 PM, Ignoramus1419 wrote:

Vegetable oil in mist form is pretty flammable. Try shooting some cooking spray at an open burner on your stove sometime. LOL. So you don't think a moderate pressure flood oil coolant would work? Something like a 10 weight machine oil?

I don't think chips are that big of a deal. I've been sweeping up chips for two years. One of the reasons I didn't implement a coolant system on the mill(s) previously was because I didn't want coolant all over the place with those higher spindle speeds. Now that the one mill is in a bench top enclosure (have the base, but not sides built for the other little machine cabinet) I figured it was time to do something about that. Pete's suggestion about a vortex tube and a vacuum looks very interesting. My only issue so far is that the DIY versions I've found so far are pretty large. Simple to build though. The guy in the link I posted earlier is claiming 15C (59F) cooling out of his design. I can think of two or three minor modifications that should make it more efficient with about the same amount of air consumption. Not an expert on that of course. Just started learning about them a few hours ago.
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Bob La Londe wrote:

The Loc-line site applications section shows two examples of vortex chiller guns with Loc-Line nozzles:
www.loc-line.com/application/index.html
The chillers in those pics don't look especially large, it appears it's 1/2" Loc-Line being used.
They also make a giant 2.5" Loc-Line vacuum hose so you can be color coordinated on the vacuum side as well :)
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I beileve that thise mists do not have enough oncentration of oil to be flammable.

I would use something factory made, personally, too many gotchas to work out in DIY equipment of this kind.
i
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Ignoramus1419 wrote:

A blast of cold air directed across the cutter and into a vacuum nozzle shouldn't spread chips everywhere.
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On 3/21/2011 4:37 PM, Ignoramus1419 wrote:

Cold air will scatter the chips out of the way, but won't do anything for surface finish quality?
MikeB
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BQ340 wrote:

Chip evacuation will certainly help the finish by eliminating chip welding, the biggest issue.
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On 3/21/2011 7:39 PM, Pete C. wrote:

Does the air then really have to be cold to prevent welding? I'm sure the finish would not be nice & shiny with just air.
MikeB
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BQ340 wrote:

I machine aluminum dry on my manual Bridgeport and I get a nice & shiny finish as long as there is no chip welding. Just manually blowing chips clear with an ordinary shop blow gun works fine.
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wrote:

I would think that dispersing chips was all it did you wouldn't need to cool it would you?
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Bob La Londe wrote:

Dispersing the chips is sufficient at manual Bridgeport RPMs, i.e. 2,700 RPM. At your RPM and with the tiny cutters you use the cooling may help. Certainly it is easy enough to try just normal compressed air.
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On 3/21/2011 7:07 PM, Pete C. wrote:

I just finished making a manifold about 10 minutes ago to do just that with a Lokline on one side and a quick coupling nipple on top. Sadly I broke the little control valve on the Lokline so I had to regulate the flow with the compressor regulator. I tried plane compressed air a while back, and it seemed to help a tiny bit, but I was turning half the speed at the time. My poor little 30 gallon compressor is certainly cycling on quite often this time. Would have just used my long air gun with a bungee cord around the trigger, but I couldn't find it.
You know. This whole thread I think has gone off kilter. I probably should have said "lubricant" rather than coolant. Even a film of WD on the surface of aluminum seems to make a noticeable difference. I just don't want to spray or pour WD unsupervised into a cabinet with a brush motor spindle in it. Well, that and I didn't plan the cabinet very well. It would probably take 2-3 gallons to make sure I had a good flow through the filter screen basket back into the pump.
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Bob La Londe wrote:

I use the loc-line mag base with a quick connect. The valve helps in regulating the air, but you need to use a fine nozzle and adjust your air pressure. I use a 1/16" nozzle and was running about 15 PSI on my regulator without a valve in the loc-line the last time I used it.
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On 2011-03-21, Lloyd E. Sponenburgh <lloydspinsidemindspring.com> wrote:

Just avoid anything that says "absolutely no water based coolants". :)
i
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Bob La Londe wrote:

I don't have a lot of experience, but recently I got a job as the CAD draftsman at a machine shop, and I was floored to find that there is even such a thing as water-based coolant.
WD-40 is fine for garage door tracks, squeaky front ends, and keeping your hand tools from rusting in the shed, but I used it once on an old, old model 13 or so teletype, and wound up having to disassemble the whole thing and clean the little parts in a lightweight solvent; it gums up, and I don't know if the solvent (in the WD) is flammable, but I presume it is.
On that note, I'd seriously recommend against using anything volatile around an open-brush motor that runs at such an insane speed - I can't even imagine a motor that would be capable of 30,000 RPM without flying apart! Or any open-brush motor at all; you don't want to cause an explosion.
For coolant, have you considered "liquid paraffin?" It's colorless, odorless, and used in those little candle-like mood lights, but I don't think the vapor would be hazardous.
Unfortunately, the only experience I've had cutting aluminum was at much lower speeds (like a couple of orders of magnitude) and the guy who was coaching/teaching me used lard; Crisco would also work there, but being more or less solid, it wouldn't be applicable for flooding.
How about non-detergent motor oil?
I don't really know much about stuff that's touted as "coolant," other than that they seem kind of expensive relative to ordinary stuff that you can find lying around.
Heck, maybe even "Mineral Spirits" or turpentine might be a possibility.
I don't know if this will be any help, but I wish you well; if possible I'd like to see videos of your new baby in operation. :-)
Cheers! Rich
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On 3/21/2011 12:54 PM, Rich Grise wrote:

I don't even care for it for most of those applications. It does seem to work ok for cutting aluminum though. Knowing the anti WD crowd will scream, I use it in the field for tapping steel sometimes too where it impractical to use a dropper of cutting oil. Its not great, but the pressurized cans do blow the chips out of the hole nicely. Yeah I know an oil can would do they trick, but I've bought a bunch of pump cans over the years and they just don't seem to keep pumping for very long.

It does seem to attract dirt when used in those type applications doesn't it.

Yeah, kinda why I dismissed all the mist type applications. The motor is self fan cooling and moves an incredible amount if air. In fact I honestly think it helps cool the cutter and work piece to some degree. Maybe I should design a motor mount that redirects the air flow through one of those vortex coolers. LOL.

No worse than any other candle or lamp fuel I imagine.

Crisco is awesome for that last finish pass on aluminum in the lathe with a rounded cutter to get that nicy shiny finish. I keep a tub in the frig out in the shop for pieces I want to look pretty. My wife was telling me that Criso is no longer animal lard though. I need to go look at my can in the fridge.

Basically a light weight ND oil is what I think most people used to use ages ago for most machining. Mineral oil is a pretty common ingrediant in cutting lubes too. I have read a ton of product labels. Whale oil was one of the old standbys, and jojoba oil is awesome too, but expensive to produce.

Not sure what mineral spirits is in relation to mineral oil.

New? This is just further incarnations on a theme. This particular machine is just the little Taig revamped again. I get consistent 60IPM if I want, but for virtually zero loss of steps I can run it at 50-55. For a little margin for error I set the max at 45, but increased the acceleration and deceleration. Now that I got the mass of that 12 pound spindle off of it, it really screams. A while back I put bigger motors on it with a little more torque. Eventually I'll get rid of the 20 tpi lead screws it came with and replace them with lower tpi screws which will allow me to take advantage of that increased torque and up my IPM for rapids again.
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Biodiesel (100%)? It's a good lubricant and smells better than petrodiesel.
Laurie Forbes
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Bob La Londe wrote:

...
AFAIK, Crisco has never been lard - it's "hydrogenated" soybean oil. The last family reunion, my aunt and cousin who grow soybeans on their farm were telling everyone to buy more Crisco. ;-)

Cheers! Rich
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