Moving Rockwell 11x24 lathe to basement

Who knows? Some 11 - 12" lathes have quite massive beds, some are lighter.

Generally, almost all lathes have some means of self-aligning the headstock to the bed. Most have a Vee groove that aligns in two axes to the inverted-Vee way of the bed. So, you get both front-back and up-down alignment from that Vee and the flat in back. Just be sure the bed and headstock vee and flat surfaces are totally clean before reassembling it, and then check front-back and up-down alignment with a dial indicator after the lathe is back together. If the alignment is off after the bed is leveled, pull the headstock off and check again for paint, chips or dings on the aligning surfaces.

Jon

Suggest you leave the saddle and headstock on - what do they weigh maybe 40 pounds? Bolt the legs to crossmembers that stick out at each corner and pick it up with 4 guys and carry it down.

I've heard horror stories about guys who removed headstocks only to have several shims fall out, and of course they never knew which went where. I know that a machine rebuilder might pull off a headstock but I sure the heck wouldn't.

Grant

Charles A. Sherwood wrote:

Thats a pretty clever idea... I agree that removing the headstock could be problematic, which is why I asked if anyone else has done so on a rockwell

11x24. However I don't see any harm in removing the saddle. thanks for the advice chuck

Headstock and saddle should be a lot more than 40 pounds, I would think. I'd remove them. I'd probably also pull the motor. If you are going to be painting or rebuilding the lathe, and will be breaking it down to do so, I'd break it down before moving it.

Bolting the legs to crossmembers and using those to lift it is not necessarily a good idea. Lathes have a high center of gravity, and if it starts to go over you'll be in trouble. Hanging it on slings from crossmembers might be better, or attaching the crossmembers higher up.

John Martin

Chuck, I moved my Delta 11x24 (I think it's the same) down by taking the headstock and bed down as one piece with a refrigerator dolly. The base with motor went in another load, apron and tailstock by hand. It worked for me. We added an extra strap at the bottom of the dolly (headstock down) and tied a 1/2" nylon rope on the dolly. I guided it while my two sons belayed, all of us above, nobody below. They're good sized boys, about 6'-1" or better and 200 lbs.

I don't know if you could do it with only two or not. You can't support much while scooting down the stairs one step at a time, and you for damn sure better not try it from below the dolly. Never get between a load and where it'll go if things go bad.

Pete Keillor

I'm not positive but suspect that the HS on the Rockwell weighs a heck of a lot more than 40 lbs. At least the HS on my Clausing 5914 lathe sure seemed to weigh a lot more than 40 lbs and the Clausing and Rockwell seem to be of similar size and weight.

Two of us were able to move the Clausing (in pieces) downstairs to the basement. The bed went down all by it's lonesome self, and I remember thinking that it was a Good Thing that the HS and saddle had been removed. But then the Clausing HS is pinned to the bed so realigning it wasn't especially difficult.

This was my original plan. Can you estimate how much the bed and headstock weigh together?

I help move a clausing 12x36 to a basement. The bed alone on a refrig dolly was the maximum two people handle. It was difficult moving and lifting it off the dolly and back onto the cabinet wasn't much fun either. My logic is that the rockwell is a little smaller machine and its shorter bed so I'm hoping that the combined weight of the shorter bed and headstock is no more that the weight of the long clausing bed.

I looked at the rockwell manual and it is pretty vague about how the headstock is attached to the bed. At one point they describe how to align the spindle parallel with the ways but it turns out to be a leveling procedure. Another place says to ship the headstock to the factory for this service. No guide lines for headstock removal or replacement. I suspect this falls into the rebuild catagory and whoever is doing the rebuild is smart enough to know how to reattach and align the headstock. chuck

I set the headstock-bed combination on the base with a pipe through the spindle tied to the tail end of the bed. One of my son's really big friends helped me (6'4", 250 lb, playing football in college). As I recall, we grunted pretty hard to lift it that high. My swag would be 3-400 lb.

My headstock is grooved to fit the tailstock ways (inner ways) and clamped with a two bolt clamp. There may be another clamp. I can't tell if there are any shims, but it doesn't look like it. I can't tell about dowels, either. Since it's in place and working well, I'm not curious enough to find out, either.

Good luck, and be careful.

Pete Keillor

As a machine tool rebuilder and repair tech (well..at least folks pay me ...

If at all possible, leave the headstock ON.

Everything else is removable. Motor certainly, carraige, tailstock, ways from base if applicable etc etc...but unless there is no other option (and there almost always is....) leave the headstock on.

As others have mentioned..getting the headstock realigned may be a pain in the ass. Generally not..but...do you really want to spend the next week or two futzing around with ground stock and dial indicators and shims and whatnot?

Shrug, YMMV.

Gunner

"You cannot invade the mainland United States. There would be a rifle behind each blade of grass." --Japanese Admiral Isoroku Yamamoto

Not to disagree with a pro, but at least the south bend machines I've moved/installed all get moved with the headstocks *off*. In most cases the lathes are so filthy they come all apart for cleaning anyway, and the V-ways on the SB machines put the headstock right back where it should be.

I would be interested to see what Scott Logan would say on this matter.

Anyway, the larger SB machines have headstocks that must weigh over 75 lbs, I've always found it less risky to remove them, when I cannot move the machine in one piece.

Also the split bed hardinge headstocks go right back in place easy too. I like to gaze upon the hand scraping underneath! :^)

Jim

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With SouthBends and Logans, I can agree for the most part..but not for most other lathes.

Chuckle..one of the service calls I have in the next couple weeks, is to realighn the head stock on an HLV-H, that someone decided to remove. Cuts a really nice back taper now.

Gunner

"You cannot invade the mainland United States. There would be a rifle behind each blade of grass." --Japanese Admiral Isoroku Yamamoto

My dad moved his (mine now) Sheldon 11x44 down into the basement with the talestock taken off. The whole machine was there, legs, tray, bed, ways, head, carriage, motor, and gearbox...

He fortified the stairs and used a 12 volt winch and lowered it down, around a corner and into the resting place. The 'movers' that moved them into the house wouldn't do it. (understood).

When he moved out, he had to do it in reverse as the movers wouldn't touch it again. (kinda understood).

It is slow and careful - and make sure the stairs can hold the weight. Use heavy sheets to bridge across and down the stairs.

He had a 12 year old son at home at the time - I was far away when he relocated that time. But some help is useful - just don't work under the load or downhill.

Martin

Yes. This is the cardinal rule for riggers. If one watches them, they always obey it explicitly. And it's amazing how many amateur riggers *dis*obey that rule, and how often.

It's really that simple, gravity works downhill. Seems simple, but most of the stories of injuries one hears about, during equipment moves, involve disregard of that rule.

Riggers don't 'work' hard. They use the right equipment for the job, and think it all the way through beforehand. The work is mostly cerebral, hardly at all muscular.

Jim

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Chuck, I've moved my Rockwell 11x24 several times. I estimate the bare bed to weigh about 120 lbs and the headstock about 80 lbs. Both can be easily moved separately by one person but together would be a dangerous job moving down stairs as others have said. Pete accurately described the attachment of the headstock to the bed. There were no shims in mine. The inverted Vee aligns the headstock and was scraped in for precise alignment. I had no loss of accuracy when I disassembled and reassembled my lathe. Jim S.

The machine was moved successfully last weekend.

The cabinet went down first and was placed in its intended location.

The bed and headstock went down as one piece on a refrigerator dolly. Everything else (saddle, tailstock, QC) was removed. It was not possible for one person to pick up the headstock end of the bed so we loaded it onto the dolly with a winch. We used a chain hoist to lift it off the dolly and set it on the cabinet. There is no way two normal guys could lift the bed and headstock high enough to set it on the cabinet. Lucky for us, the lathe sets right under an I beam.

It took about 3 hours to take it apart, move, and reassemble. Divide and conquer; Then reassemble!

chuck

I've moved this 13x40 Clausing Colchester into my basement. So the question isn't can you move the head and bed together. it's how are you going to do it?

I had to remove the headstock as by itself it weighs well over 300 lbs. Me and a buddy could just lift it but by no means could I have lowered it down onto the floor without hurting myself. We used an engine hoist to do the dirty work on removing the headstock. I moved everything except the bed down the stairs on a two wheel hand cart. The bed was a real beast but was easily managed with the help of a few friends and the right tools. Check out how I moved it at

Look under Lathe Move.

With your machine there is a very good chance you can rig up a way to get the bed down the stairs on a two wheel cart. You need to be aware of each step and the capabilities of the tools/people you are using. Recognize potential failures at each step and put corrective actions in place to prevent these failures. As in "what happens if one person looses grip or footing while decending the steps"? Lathe bed crashes to floor. How to prevent that from happening. You may want a third person to tie off the cart to something solid and belay the cart down with a rope to control the decent. It's this basic process of accumulated "what ifs" that will get you to understand all that is required for a safe move. When you've done this a dozen times over, you are pretty much ready to move. Working scared and slow are the two best ways to ensure a safe move. It's the exact moment when people become confortable and complacent that accidents happen.

Congratulations! Like I said, the big kid and I had to grunt pretty hard. You want to use your legs, not your back. I'll stick with my

3-400# based on picking it up. Next time, or if I'm alone, I'll view it as an opportunity to buy an engine hoist.

Pete Keillor