OT disgusted with all presidential candidates

Of all recent presidents, starting with Clinton, I only liked Barack Obama and still do. A great president, very laid back and did not
start any wars and did not mess up much.
That said, all current candidates for president, starting from Hillary and ending with Carly, and everyone in between, just make me want to throw up. Very stupid, pompous, self absorbed people who, to date, have not even said anything original.
I am curious if anyone else feels this way.
i
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On 6/5/2015 8:39 PM, Ed Huntress wrote:

It doesn't matter, any bets that ISIS follows through with it's threat to smuggle a nuke into the US...thanks to Obammy's refusal to do anything to the people he was raised with? It'll probably be done by ex-Gitmo scum that Obammy let go.
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And it can be just a dirty bomb - TNT or plastic explodes Radioactivity around.
The only hope is the Rad testers in the ports.
Martin
On 6/5/2015 8:33 PM, Tom Gardner wrote:

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A dirty bomb is a non-event, it is significant only because people agree to talk about it and fear it.
A fire of a big enough pile of used tires, which abound, causes more damage than a nuclear dirty bomb.
i

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Ig - I don't mean black grime dirty bomb. I mean a TNT explosion that is big, and around the TNT was enriched radioactive material that isn't good enough to make a high class nuke but has a lifetime of radiation into millions of years.
That is far more damming than any flame bomb or explosion or pile of tires.
The nuke dirty bomb kills all in a region - all plants - for millions of years and people if they come into the area.
Russia has a plant that is a dirty site of a out of control nuclear pile. That isn't enough for you ?
Martin
On 6/5/2015 9:55 PM, Ignoramus6359 wrote:

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It would require a cleanup or evacuation of at most a square mile. Probably more due to the general squeamishness of society. But it is not that big of a deal. In the end, no one or 1-5 people will die of radiation.

This completely untrue. Even near Chernobyl, where a giant reactor exploded, the nature is flourishing.

That was a huge explosion in terms of material involved, more than can be smuggled.
If a dirty bomb was not so feared, wrongly, terrorists would not even want to use it.
i

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wrote:

Given that many half-lives are measured in hundreds and thousands of years, yeah, that's PFTC. Flora and Fauna come back quickly, but some of the area is still so hot, a single bite of food grown in that ground will kill you within days. But they didn't get the killoff of people they thought would happen from cancers over the years, either. Most of the people died from initial cleanup, and the gov't knew they would but didn't tell them. A large percentage of those people probably would have gone in anyway, though. Good, patriotic men, like our firefighters, who willingly give their lives for the safety of others. I salute them.

http://www.kiddofspeed.com/ _Really_ interesting story of a girl on a motorcycle, riding through the hot zones around Chernobyl.
--
Worry is a misuse of imagination.
-- Dan Zadra
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Then why Flora and Fauna are there? It does not make sense.

Chernobyl was a monumental event, an enormous reactor exploding. And even then, human losses were quite limited.
A terrorist dirty bomb would be a small device. See the difference?
Chernobyl and terrorist dirty bomb compare like a barrel full of shit, versus a single juicy fart.
i
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It is not the same, but has some similarities to, say, a hypothetical threat from me to put a "curse" on you. It is only a threat, if you think that the "curse" would actually damage you.
Same with "dirty bomb". If it was not feared so much, no one would want to smuggle detectable, dangerous, radioactive substances that require enormous shielding, and yet are only bound to take a few actual lives, at most.

I have a CDV-700 and a few hot samples (uranium ore rocks). It is awesome. It detects radiation in ambient air, granite, etc.
i
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We have drugs smuggled in all of the time. Get real. It might come across the lake or across the river or up a river.
Martin
On 6/7/2015 3:23 PM, Ignoramus25277 wrote:

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On Sun, 07 Jun 2015 11:28:01 -0500, Ignoramus25277

Why bring up 'dirty bomb' again? The thread morphed away from that days and days ago. <g>
But, yeah, I catch your drift.
--
Worry is a misuse of imagination.
-- Dan Zadra
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On Sun, 07 Jun 2015 11:28:01 -0500, Ignoramus25277

Some can take more rads than humans, but if we eat those animals, we'll die.
If we can trust the people writing books about the area, the animals can sense radioactivity and they stay away from tainted plants.
--
Worry is a misuse of imagination.
-- Dan Zadra
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You have it figured it would be a ground level bomb. How about at 5000 feet in a Cessna ? And having the wind blow the radiation all around.
Chernobyl didn't explode. It burned. The carbon core over heated. The coolant was lost - and the frames holding the fuel melted and jammed so extraction could not be done. They were doomed early on.
One doesn't need much to do a great amount of long term damage.
Martin
On 6/6/2015 10:17 PM, Ignoramus26399 wrote:

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Do the math. For any amount of dirty material, you need many times that amount for shielding. Shielding is needed so that the people transporting it, and the pilot, would not die, and also to hide the material.
And a "cessna", which is difficult to procure, would not carry that much weight.
All that talk about dirty bombs is mostly like that, not realistic.

Right.
i
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http://www.mayoclinic.org/diseases-conditions/radiation-sickness/basics/symptoms/con-20022901 "Doses greater than 6 Gy to the whole body are generally not treatable and usually lead to death within two days to two weeks, depending on the dose and duration of the exposure."
"After the first round of signs and symptoms, a person with radiation sickness may have a brief period with no apparent illness, followed by the onset of new, more serious symptoms."
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Everyone who serves in the Army, at least.
-jsw
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If the amount of dirty bomb material is such that it does not kill the courier in minutes, it is not enough to cause significant contamination and to kill other persons.
i
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On 6/8/2015 9:22 PM, Ignoramus7853 wrote:

A lethal dose of the radiation will not kill in minutes, it takes up to 48 hours:
<http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Acute_radiation_syndrome
Low level contamination would be the main problem. While not immediately fatal, the contaminated are would have to be evacuated and cleaned. Imagine how much fun it would be to move out the entire population of New York City or Los Angeles RIGHT NOW, and then take how many months to collect the contamination. Meanwhile, there is no normal activity for anyone in the city, everything stops, and refugee centers have to be set facilities would have to be set up for millions of people.
You don't have to kill a lot of people to make a city uninhabitable for a long time.
David
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Perhaps for gamma or neutron sources with short half-lives, and thus high intensity. The lethal effects of radiation took long enough to appear that Radium was briefly used as medicine in the 1920's.
The longer the half-life, the less radiation emitted during a person's lifetime. The nasty ones have half lives in the days to months and are chemically very similar to elements the body absorbs and uses, like Calcium.
https://orise.orau.gov/reacts/guide/alpha.htm "4. A civil defense instrument (CD V-700) cannot detect the presence of radioactive materials that produce alpha radiation unless the radioactive materials also produce beta and/or gamma radiation."
That's because alpha doesn't penetrate the diaphragm that seals the evacuated ionization chamber, and wouldn't even if it could be made of tissue paper. The first US personnel in Hiroshima didn't know that and overexposed themselves to contamination they assumed their Geiger counters would detect.
Inhaled or ingested dust particles that emit alpha particles cause severe localized tissue damage. http://www.ippnw.org/pdf/PlutoniumDGHealth.pdf
I got to talking with the Health Physics Officer of a nuclear power plant at a party, and we were both surprised and alarmed to find that I knew more about radiation than he did, due to my Chemistry degree and some government research I did with isotopes. The next time I saw him he proved to me that he had been studying hard.
Your conclusion is probably correct though, a dirty bomb's main value is to scare the uneducated.
-dj5uC
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There are alpha probes for CDV-700 available.
I have a CDV-700 and love it dearly for its ease of use and sensitivity.

OK, I am glad that we agree on this.
The logistics of a "dirty bomb" attack are very cumbersome and the result is, literally, a fizzle.
i
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