OT-John Kerry

*****Gunners Note..this is an email from someone Im well aquainted with in the retired Special Forces community.

"Gunner I am personally acquainted with the author of this article in the WSJ. Steve Sherman is highly thought of in the Special Forces/Special Operations world and has authored "Who's Who" type books that have become the authoritative word by those who need to know who was, who wasn't, who is and who isn't. The man tells the truth as he finds it without embellishment." (name with held by Gunner)

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A turning point may have been reached in the Iowa caucuses when Special Forces Lt. James Rassmann came forward to thank John Kerry for saving his life in Vietnam. Although Mr. Rassmann, like most of my veteran friends, is a Republican, he said that he'd vote for Mr. Kerry. I don't know if the incident influenced the caucus results. But I took special interest in the story because Jim served in my unit. Service in Vietnam is an important credential to me. Many felt that such service was beneath them, and removed themselves from the manpower pool. That Mr. Kerry served at all is a reason for a bond with fellow veterans; that his service earned him a Bronze Star for Valor ("for personal bravery") and a Silver Star ("for gallantry") is even more compelling. Unfortunately, Mr. Kerry came home to Massachusetts, the one state George McGovern carried in 1972. He joined the Vietnam Veterans Against the War and emceed the Winter Soldier Investigation (both financed by Jane Fonda). Many veterans believe these protests led to more American deaths, and to the enslavement of the people on whose behalf the protests were ostensibly being undertaken. But being a take-charge kind of guy, Mr. Kerry became a leader in the VVAW and even testified before Congress on the findings of the Investigation, which he accepted at face value. In his book "Stolen Valor," B.G. Burkett points out that Mr. Kerry liberally used phony veterans to testify to atrocities they could not possibly have committed. Mr. Kerry later threw what he represented as his awards at the Capitol in protest. But as the war diminished as a political issue, he left the VVAW, which was a bit too radical for his political future, and was ultimately elected to the Senate. After his awards were seen framed on his office wall, he claimed to have thrown away someone else's medals -- so now he can reclaim his gallantry in Vietnam. Mr. Kerry hasn't given me any reason to trust his judgment. As co-chairman of the Senate investigating committee, he quashed a revealing inquiry into the POW/MIA issue, and he supports trade initiatives with the Socialist Republic of Vietnam while blocking any legislation requiring Hanoi to adhere to basic human rights. I'm not surprised that there are veterans who support a VVAW activist, if only because there are so few fellow veterans in politics. Ideally, there'd be many more. If you are going to vote on military appropriations, it would be nice if you didn't disrespect the soldiers. Congress hasn't had the courage to declare war in more than 60 years, despite numerous instances in which we have sent our military in harm's way. Of all the "lessons of Vietnam," surely one is that America needs a leader capable of demonstrating in himself, and encouraging in others, the resolve to finish what they have collectively started. But the bond between veterans has to be tempered in light of the individual's record. Just as Mr. Kerry threw away medals only to claim them back again, Sen. Kerry voted to take action against Iraq, but claims to take that vote back by voting against funding the result. So I can understand my former comrade-in-arms hugging the man who saved his life, but not the act of choosing him for president out of gratitude. And I would hate to see anyone giving Mr. Kerry a sympathy vote for president just because being a Vietnam veteran is "back in style." Mr. Sherman was a first lieutenant with the U.S. Army Fifth Special Forces Group (Airborne) in Vietnam, 1967-68.

"This device is provided without warranty of any kind as to reliability, accuracy, existence or otherwise or fitness for any particular purpose and Bioalchemic Products specifically does not warrant, guarantee, imply or make any representations as to its merchantability for any particular purpose and furthermore shall have no liability for or responsibility to you or any other person, entity or deity with respect to any loss or damage whatsoever caused by this device or object or by any attempts to destroy it by hammering it against a wall or dropping it into a deep well or any other means whatsoever and moreover asserts that you indicate your acceptance of this agreement or any other agreement that may he substituted at any time by coming within five miles of the product or observing it through large telescopes or by any other means because you are such an easily cowed moron who will happily accept arrogant and unilateral conditions on a piece of highly priced garbage that you would not dream of accepting on a bag of dog biscuits and is used solely at your own risk.'

Reply to
Gunner
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So, what's your point Gunner?

Other than the fact, that you wholeheartedly agree with the opinion of some right wing nut case, who doesn't like that Kerry went home to Massachusetts and who doesn't like Jane Fonda. Which is really a point you don't need to belabor in this newsgroup. We know that already. Tell us something we don't know.

Abrasha

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Reply to
Abrasha

Massachusetts and

The point is that now Kerry is a front runner. Therefore, Karl Rove, Bush's brain, and his minions will have their long knives out. One of their documented tactics is the whispering campaign. They used it effectively against Sen. McCain, where they planted a rumor that McCain's long captivity rendered him too unstable to be president.

All the article says to me is that Kerry was capable of political thought and had the character to act upon his beliefs. I suppose it would have been better if Kerry, after returning from combat in Vietnam, had been more like Bush, who, after going AWOL from the ANG, spent those "off the record" years apparently loafing around, snorting coke, getting drunk and having a good ol' time for himself.

Furthermore, Kerry has actually consistently stoop up for vets, unlike Bush, who has opposed combat pay for troops in Iraq, cut and de-funded vets benefits and the VA medical system.

Jeff

Reply to
Jeff McCann

What are you complaining about?

You weren't forced to read it.

I would like to hear your definition of "right wing nut case". The author of that note seemed literate, and he presented his view in a very professional manner. You, on the other hand immediately started belaboring a post you didn't have to read and started calling people you don't know a "right wing nut case". Frankly, you seem the one with both an attitude problem and much less literate. I suspect that speaking out of your ass can do this.

Strider

Reply to
Strider

All the above may or may not be true, Jeff. I haven't checked and don't have the time at the moment.

The thing about Kerry to me is that every time I have done some checking on him, it has turned out he's been two-faced.

The only folks on the Democratic side, so far, who I haven't decided to be "probable" liars, are Edwards and Lieberman.

I was kinda hoping to have TWO valid candidates up for election. And that is an honest statement of my view. Then I could examine their platform, position on the issues, etc and make up my mind.

But so far, Kerry, Dean, and Clark have given me no cause to trust that they actually mean what they say. Thus, as of this moment (it could change) I can't even trust the words out of their mouths. And I've got to have that trust before I even care what their positions are.

I can't figure out why the Dems aren't pushing Lieberman or even Edwards more than they are.

Bob

Reply to
Bob G

Blaming anti-war protesters for deaths of soldiers in that war is nonsensical.

That's like blaming the ambulance driver for the car crash he responds to.

Many americans at the time felt that war was both illegal and immoral, and felt it their civic duty to protest US presence. My personal feeling is that the politicians of both flavor did not care about public opinion, and the broad spectrum of anti-war feeling encouraged them to end the war. Thereby preventing any more deaths from it.

Jim

================================================== please reply to: JRR(zero) at yktvmv (dot) vnet (dot) ibm (dot) com ==================================================

Reply to
jim rozen

By then I had reached an age such that I had no personal stake , but, it seemed to me, at the time, that a large percentage of the protestors were more concerned about the possibility that their names were coming up on the draft lists. Civic duty of any kind was low on their priority lists and, if protest of the war had just been a matter of civic duty, they'd have shirked that also. There is, of course, that large body of individuals for whom protest was just a participatory hobby, a social event, if you will.. I have no real idea how large that percentage was. I would guess it to be fairly large and consisting mostly of young females and older folks of both sexes. I had been a young liberal myself, but, by that time of the Viet Nam War I had put in 10 years or so as a Federal bureaucrat and was teaching in an inner city Junior High school.(Both activities prone to opening ones eyes to the flaws of liberal thought.)

Harold (Collum puniceus)

Reply to
Harold Burton

You have a real problem here, the likely Democratic candidate, Kerry, Dean, or Clark, might be liars. The Republican candidate is a liar. Lieberman is just the "Bush" on the Democratic ballot. Who are you going to vote for?

Pete.

Reply to
Peter Reilley

My personal experience was different. I was at an age where I never did have to register for selective service, but the protesters I am talking about were in the forties as a rule, parents of friends. Wife's mother was/is also pretty active in protesting a number or recent wars, via church groups and so on. I suspect she probably has an FBI file.

Jim

================================================== please reply to: JRR(zero) at yktvmv (dot) vnet (dot) ibm (dot) com ==================================================

Reply to
jim rozen

I think that you should go back and look at John Kerry

John Kerry lead the effort to defund the CIA, NSA to the amount of 1.3 billion dollars from 1997 to 2000. Now ask your self why we couldn't find out about 9/11.

John Kerry was part of the leader ship that stripped over

4 billion dollars out of the defense budget from 1996 to 2000 including defunding the Veterans administration to the tune of 200 million.

John Kerry first wife (family wealth a mear 200 million) and by which he had two children was driven into deep depression when John Kerry started sharing the beds of of Hollywood starlets. While still married to his first wife he started seeing the Heinzs chick. In the marriage prenuptial agreement it was stipulated that the first marriage was to be annulled. (legalese that it never was a real marriage in the first place in that no sex took place). Strange when it produced two children and if it was annuled which it was that makes Kerry's firts two children illegitmate and not able to inherent any of Kerry's estate in that no sex took place and theirfor Kerry's first wife gave birth to children that were not Kerry's

In other words John Kerry was balling Ms. Hinze while still married to this first wife. Have we seen this before???

Lastly since John Kerry has no outside income (and legally he can't touch is wife's money for campaigning) for making his run for the white house. He has had to Mortgage his half of the 12 million dollar town house in Boston and his private art collection (which includes two Renoir's). Well the monthly repayment of his loan and very favorable rates 3-4% will be 30,000 a month. Not bad for a guy who only makes 130,000 year.

John Kerry smells like ten day old fish.

The Independent

Noah Sim>

Reply to
Jim Dauven

I suspect its because Lieberman and Edwards are not leftist enough. Particularly Lieberman who is a true Reagan Democrat. Though I was not pleased with his 180 turnabout from his normal stands and standards, when he started running with Algor.

Gunner

"This device is provided without warranty of any kind as to reliability, accuracy, existence or otherwise or fitness for any particular purpose and Bioalchemic Products specifically does not warrant, guarantee, imply or make any representations as to its merchantability for any particular purpose and furthermore shall have no liability for or responsibility to you or any other person, entity or deity with respect to any loss or damage whatsoever caused by this device or object or by any attempts to destroy it by hammering it against a wall or dropping it into a deep well or any other means whatsoever and moreover asserts that you indicate your acceptance of this agreement or any other agreement that may he substituted at any time by coming within five miles of the product or observing it through large telescopes or by any other means because you are such an easily cowed moron who will happily accept arrogant and unilateral conditions on a piece of highly priced garbage that you would not dream of accepting on a bag of dog biscuits and is used solely at your own risk.'

Reply to
Gunner

*sigh*....

So by your logic, Abrasha shouldn't read things he doesn't like? How does one go about doing that, exactly? In other words how is he supposed to know whether he'll like something without reading it?

Personally I was SURPRISED to see Gunner attempting to smear someone who isn't a conservative republican, like himself, the moment they seemed to be gaining in popularity. This is EXTREMELY uncharacteristic of Gunner, and I NEVER would have expected it of him.

Reply to
Artemia Salina

(snip)

One thing Kerry hasn't consistently stood up for is gun ownership. The last time he was running he announced that he didn't think AK 47's should be legal for civilians because they were used to hunt him in Vietnam. Just what I like, a real logical thinker.

Reply to
Noah Simoneaux

Gary Nolan:

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Oops! Thought you were talking to me!

Reply to
Artemia Salina

I couldn't disagree more.

Giving aid and comfort to the enemy, whether moral or materiel support, is still cheering the opposition.

I don't see your connection. A better analogy would be protestors blocking the road and claiming the crash victim didn't deserve treatment because his car tags were expired.

What? Did they care about public opinion or not?

The war was almost won in 1968/69. The NVA (the real enemy) would have retreated if not for the vociferous protestors and waffling politicians at home. That encouraged them to struggle on and outlast our nation's resolve. Also to drag out the Paris Peace Negotiations.

If you look at battle and casualty maps, it is obvious this was a border war. If the NVA had been pushed back into Laos and Cambodia, the RVNs could have handled the Viet Cong.

I was one of those Americans who had to fight his way back into his own country. My opinion of the protestors/hooligans is that they were a bunch of worthless, whiny bastards. We can discuss that if you like.

Reply to
andy asberry

Because they are sort of honest?

Reply to
Offbreed

Not if he's going to bitch about it being posted.

Gunner can post any damn thing he want's to.

Strider

Reply to
Strider

You haven't answered my question.

How about Abrasha? Can HE post anything he want's to?

Reply to
Artemia Salina

Which question?

"So by your logic, Abrasha shouldn't read things he doesn't like?" "Not if he's going to bitch about it being posted."

"How does one go about doing that, exactly?" Accept that if you read something, you might not like it, but you shouldn't whine about it being posted in the first place

"In other words how is he supposed to know whether he'll like something without reading it?" That wasn't the issue

Yes he can, but he need not whine about someone else posting as they please.

I hope that this cleared up your confusion.

Strider

Reply to
Strider

Because the leftwing radicals have control of the party and Lieberman and Edwards aren't quite as far left as they want.

Strider

Reply to
Strider

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