Curtiss Hawk 75 - Armee de l'Air colours

Interior cockpit color on French single-engine aircraft is Bleu de Nuit, a very dark blue. Wheel wells and interior flaps would be Chamois, a color like goat skin.

Hishyeness avait prétendu :

French Hawks interior had exactly the same colors than the American Hawks...

FWIW That jives with what I have been told by old Glenn L. Martin hands. The Martin Marylands were delivered unpainted and were to be painted in France. The exteriors were bare metal and the interiors were an anti-corrosive clear lacquer or aluminum lacquer like the U.S. Navy used on the exterior of metal fuselages in the pre-war "yellow wings" finishes. Curtiss Hawks were specified the same. Only exception I have found was the Curtiss bi-plane divebombers which only got as far as Martinique and were staked out in the open to rot. They were supposedly camouflaged but in what colors?? Maybe Chris knows.

Bill Shuey

Hi Bill, I wrote from my reminding of an old article in Replic. I remember one or two photo of a real Hawk with an interior light interior green, not really a zinc chromate, but not far...

But these pictures were maybe from a specific model...

One must be careful where the Hawks were concerned, was the picture of the interior of a French Hawk 75 or a U.S. P-36??. The U.S. Army Hawks were probably interior green, and then there were the Dutch and Chinese Hawks. When looking at a picture you need to know who the aircraft was built for. I have seen one publication which had a "generic" set of cockpit pictures just labeled Curtiss Hawk.

Bill Shuey

Here is my opinion based on what limited references are out there.

Before I start, I might say that the lack of a good quality, in print english reference for this important aircraft is PATHETIC!

There is a Hawk that is restored in French colors. I believe it was featured on Hyperscale a couple of months back in the walkaround you mentioned.

Unfortunately, I do not know the provence of that bird, so it would be hard to draw a definitive conclusion from a restored aircraft such as that. Same goes for profiles that you see in magazines.

There are some things that are known though. One is that the French Hawks A-1 A-2 and A-3 are closely based on the P-36A. The P-36A had a clear coat laquer as everyone has mentioned.

Now this is where it gets tricky. If you look at period photographs, you can see that the windows covering the cutouts behind the cockpit sometimes reveal an interior color different from the exterior color.

I have seen photographs of French Hawks with that portion of the interior natural metal, a shade lighter than the exterior camoflage, and shades that are equal of the camoflage!

Of course, having camoflage in that area is natural as the windows were easier to remove and paint underneath than to mask off.

The three volumes on the P-36 from AJ Press are no help either as the interior photos are from an American P36A (in laquer clear coat - natural metal), and an Argentinian Hawk 75-O which looks to be in zinc chromate. These are factory photos that probably went into maintenance manuals.

Back to the French, the best photos of Hawks I have are in Avions issues #133 and #46. There are several COLOR photos of Hawks in the articles, sometimes of the SAME squadron showing that Hawks had their cockpit cutouts both silver and a green color (sometimes lighter, sometimes darker than the exterior but hardly ever the same).

Of course I don't have good interior photos of French Hawks or else I would cite them. If there are any conclusions I would draw, here they are:

Logic says that if the cutout is silver, I doubt that the rest of the interior would be painted in zinc chromate.

There are some photos of Hawks, that look freshly delivered in a rectangular array, and they ALL have silver cutouts. These are A-1's.

The political situation of the French dictated that they need the Hawks NOW. Being Germany's neighbor the writing was on the wall and they would of specified minimal differences in the Hawks separate from the P-36A.

If there was a change at the Curtiss factory to zinc chromate primer, it would of been dictated by the USAAF, and not France. That may of happened in the later runs of Hawks, ie A4, aks Mohawk IV with the Wright 1820 9 cyl. engine.

I would say paint your interior natural metal if it is a French Hawk A-1 or A-2. Unless you have photo references of the actual bird that would be the best educated guess.

Can you guys tell I have been searching for the same info???

Now if I could only get the Docavia Hawk book by Jean Cuny - I think that would have the answer!

Keith Walker

Concerning the French Hawk 75; for what it is worth, I read in special edition of WingMasters consecrated to French Air Force fighters, the Curtiss cockpit was painted interior green, not zinc chromate. The article describes further interior green as being more yellowish than zinc chromate. Article claims this color was also used in the wheel wells. Sorry for reporting otherwise in first post.

Le 03/07/2005, Brian Burr Chin a supposé :

Yes, that's exactly the reminding I have also.

Many thanks gents

You've been a goldmine of information.

I started back into the hobby around six months ago with the aim of putting together a collection of single engined WWII fighters of the European front in 1?72 scale. This quickly grew to twin-engined birds as well, and then I made the fatal mistake of buying a light bomber, then a medium bomber etc. so now my "to build" collection comprises all the major aircraft types that flew in WWII operated by the French, British, Germans, Soviets, Italians, Czechs an Americans in Europe.

THEN, my wife bought me a Hasegawa kit of the Zero, and all of a sudden the Pacific theatre opened its welcoming arms, and the dam burst to include all IJN and IJA fighters and bombers and their USN equivalents! In other words, if it flew between 1939 and 1945, it's probably sitting on my shelf (bar the really hard to find Japanese examples - i.e. Frances, Grace, Helen, Irving, Lily, Nate, Rita and Sally).

So then, amongst these 100 or so kits (many in different types of the same aircraft) I developed a preference for the Do-17, the P-36/Hawk

75, the Me Bf 110 and the P-61 Black Widow. I had d> Le 03/07/2005, Brian Burr Chin a suppos=E9 :

Keith,

Two copies of the Docavia book are offered for sale at:

Also, a slightly revised but essentially similar version of that book has been published in English:

Beauchamp and Cuny: 'Curtiss Hawk 75' (ViP Press [USA], 1996; 344 pages) -- AIRCRAFT TYPES INCLUDED: Curtiss Hawk 75 (P-36, Curtiss H-75, Mohawk), XP-23 (P-23), XP-1 (P-1), P-6, BFC, BF2C (Hawk II, Hawk III, Hawk IV), XP-31 (P-31), P-26, Seversky 1 XP (Sev-1XP), XP-37 (P-37), Seversky AP-4, XP-42 (P-42), Dewoitine D.21 C-1, P-40 (Curtiss Hawk 81); COCKPIT DETAIL: Curtiss Hawk 75 A-4 (p. 31, 34, 93), P-36C (p. 32,

33); WHEELWELL DETAIL: YP-37 [P-37] (p. 30); MISCELLANEOUS DETAIL: Curtiss Hawk 75 [P-36] cowl (p. 17, 97), cowl guns (p. 278), engine (p. 28, 35, 37), fuselage panels (p. 24), gunsight (p. 285, 286), landing gear (p. 27, 28, 100), propeller (p. 30), tail (p. 23, 26), underwing bombs (p. 285), wings (p. 22, 24, 25, 30), wing guns (p. 276, 279-284); Finnish Hawk 75 Revi C/12/D gunsight (p. 286); Mohawk IV gunsight (p. 286); XP-37 [P-37] engine mount (p. 44, 48); P-40 [Curtiss Hawk 81] Allison engine (p. 38); MULTI-VIEW DRAWINGS: Hawk 75 [Curtiss H-75] prototype (p. 327), retractable-gear version (p. 323-326, fixed-gear version (p. 328), supercharged version (p. 331), "all-flying tail" version (p. 332); XP-37 [P-37] (p. 333); XP-42 [P-42] (p. 329, 330); GENERIC CAMOUFLAGE PATTERNS: Mohawk IV (p. 242-245); GENERIC MARKING PATTERNS: Mohawk IV (p. 242-245), P-35 (p. 233), P-36 (p. 233, 234); SPECIFIC MARKING PROFILES: Hawk IV [BF2C] (p. 252), Hawk 75 [Curtiss H-75] prototype (p. 252), Hawk 75 "Hawk Special" [fixed-gear version used by Gen. Chennault] (p. 258), Hawk 75A-1 (p. 258-260), Hawk 75A-1/2/3/4/6 [Finland] (p. 247, 248), Hawk 75A-2 (p. 261, 264), Hawk 75A-3 (p. 262, 263), Hawk 75A-4 (p. 263, 265), Hawk 75A-5 (p. 267), Hawk 75A-6 (p. 260, 264, 265), Hawk 75A-7 [Netherlands] (p. 263), Hawk 75A-8 [Norway] (p. 265), Hawk 75A-9 (p. 267), Hawk 75M [China] (p. 259), Hawk 75N [Netherlands] (p. 259), Hawk 750 [Argentina] (p. 258), Hawk 751[?] [France] (p. 263), Mohawk IV (p. 242-245, 251, 262, 266, 267), XP-31 [P-31] (p. 252), Y1P-36 [P-36] (p. 253), P-36A (p. 253, 255, 256, 261), P-36C (p. 254, 257), XP-37 [P-37] (p. 255), XP-40 [P-40 prototype] (p. 257), XP-42 [P-42] (p. 257); COMMENT(s): Revised English translation of Collection Docavia No. 22, by Cuny & Beauchamp. Softcover. Dated 1996 but actually issued in 1997

Unfortunately, I suspect that it, too, is now out of print.

Charles Metz

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news.veriz> Here is my opinion based on what limited references are out there. >

i'm amazed at your output, bill. you got more built than i have total......by a large number.

Stop! You're giving me flashbacks! I didn't quit when I got to the end of WWII. I kept getting more and more modern stuff then worked my way back to WWI. And I couldn't quit at just one of each. There were too many neat colour schemes out there...... I was well on my way to trying for at least one of everything before I made myself quit. I should live so long. ;)

Bill Banaszak, MFE

Well, now, I wouldn't say that...I built all those. I sure as heck bought them though. It helped that I never took a sabbatical like some folks did. Once I got going I never laid off. The departure of the former management in

1985 helped too. I didn't have to answer to anybody as long as all my bills were paid and the groceries were in. I did post pics on abms a few years back of the unbuilt collection. I remember it caused Rufus to comment about being glad he stuck to 1/32, IIRC.

Bill Banaszak, MFE

In message , news.verizon.net writes

Both flypast and Aeroplane monthly (Jan 2005) feature the air worthy Hawk 75 from the fighter collection.. This is a genuine ex Armee de d'lAir H75-A1. The articles include colour photos of the restored cockpit. Can't guarantee these are as per original, but given the evident care in restoration I'd bet it was accurate for this particular bird.

The cockpit is basically light green (green, not zinc chromate), as is the cut- out under the transparency behind the cockpit. Instrument panel, gun butts and head-cushion are black. The floor (& some lower panels on the cockpit sides) are aluminium, but the stick & a panel in the centre of the floor are light green.

I'd guess that all French Hawk interiors would be finished to the French spec. Some of the details of this spec would be non-trivial; French language labelling, metric instrumentation and throttles operating in the reverse sense to British & American aircraft. By 1940 most of the birds coming off the line would be to French orders, so they'd be set up to produce them to this standard.