Kelvin mystery (almost) solved

Took the No 6 head off the big Kelvin today, and found the damage to be at the low end of the spectrum of possibilities.

The inlet valve was very obviously bent, and it's quite clear that this was a result of a foreign body being trapped between the valve & seat when the piston reached the top of the compression stroke. There are marks on the top of the piston from impact with the valve face.

There is no air cleaner on these engines, just a vertical induction pipe about 20" long at one end of the manifold, No 6 is at the opposite end of the manifold. Its position makes it most likely of the six to suffer this sort of problem, I think.

Luckily the damage to the piston is superficial, there's no need even to draw it out. Also luckily there was a new, if slightly rusty, inlet valve in the 'ship's stores' - a bit of polishing in the lathe, 10 minutes lapping it to it's seat, & the head is ready to go back on in the morning. I'll have to dust off the big torque wrench, the main head studs have to be pulled down to 450 lbft. I've straightened the bent valve as best I can, & will regrind the face so that hopefully it will be worth keeping as a spare.

The great mystery (to me), and what prompted me to post here on the subject in the first place, is why the valve was reopening after closing. All I can come up with is that the rush of air through the gap between the bent valve & its seat was working in a way which was capable of lifting the valve fractionally. Any comments on that? The ground valve face is perhaps 3 times the width of the seating.

The engine is an older version of that shown at:

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Cheers Tim

Tim Leech Dutton Dry-Dock

Traditional & Modern canal craft repairs

Reply to
timleech
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"timleech" said

Took the No 6 head off the big Kelvin today, and found the damage to be at the low end of the spectrum of possibilities.

Ah, good, I was in the right ball game then ;o)) As I said,

"If there is/has been debris in the cylinder, it might have slightly bent the valve and although inertia will close the valve, the spring pressure is now insufficient to hold it closed. As the revs pick up, the valve does not have time to slide open before the rising compression holds it against the seat.

This would explain why it will not tick over on that cylinder but fires as the revs rise."

Close enough for an Ojai board ........

Regards,

Kim Siddorn.

Reply to
J K Siddorn

Pretty close, certainly, but I'm not convinced about the 'inertia' bit. Not saying you're wrong, just I'm not convinced . Bear in mind this was a visible effect at around 200 rpm, not a lot of inertia in a valve at that speed (I don't think Kelvins went in for high lift cams ) The force needed to straighten it (I know that's different) was quite substantial. My guess is that the compression being enough to fire the fuel charge at higher rpm has more to do with higher piston speeds etc. It was blowing substantially at all speeds!

Cheers Tim

Tim Leech Dutton Dry-Dock

Traditional & Modern canal craft repairs

Reply to
timleech

Tim;

just my two cents (pence??) worth...........discard that 'bent but straightened valve'

It may have some internal fracturing or stress cracks, although it looks good to the naked eye

It would be a pity to have that suspicion verified via a holed piston...........

Regards,

G

Reply to
Gary Glaenzer

Actually, of course, Kelvins are Scottish (thought I'd better get that in before someone else did . Whereas the English Perpendicular Garder L3B, probably the nearest equivalent, has cylinder head studs of 3/4" BSF, the Scottish Perpendicular Kelvin has main studs of

1 1/8" BSF, with some extras at 7/8" BSF thrown in! Granted the Gardner has *slightly* smaller bore (& longer stroke) & less bhp per cylinder, but they're in the same ball park. Both excellent engines, but using very differing approaches to achieve similar ends.

Cheers Tim Tim Leech Dutton Dry-Dock

Traditional & Modern canal craft repairs

Reply to
timleech

Actually no. It was just a thought as the engine sounds very exposed to casual villainy.

About an inch down so far having removed the marine style big end. Apart from a badly rusted area that has sat in the rod cut outs what's emerging is clean and bright. Diesel is passing slowly and I now need to indulge in some dentistry and then fabricate some sort of jack. The crank is turning after one main was melted out and all the studs removed from the other main housing! I gratefully acknowledge the assistance of Owain and Matt (who spotted him in Fred Dibnah's programme?) The bottom 2" of the water jacket is rock solid scale/rust which suggests a fresh water life. What say you? regards Roland

Reply to
Roland and Celia Craven

Scrap....SCRAP! I'll have you know Sir that I only purvey the highest quality pre-owned rust Roland

Reply to
Roland and Celia Craven

In message , Roland and Celia Craven writes

Ooops !! - slip of the tongue : - )

Reply to
John Ambler

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