Ranger 9 charging circuit issue....?.

that lincoln Ranger 9 I got some months ago wouldnt charge the
battery. There was a melted wire going down into the fan shroud, and
Ive been putting off fixing it for months. It ran fine, just wouldnt
charge. So this weekend I decided to bust it open and find out what
happened..
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(you can use the zoom button to get a closeup of the damage)
It looks like something, probably the coil pack clamp bolt (missing)
got down into the backside of the flywheel/fan and into the stator of
the battery charging generator (alternator?)
One of the leads was melted all the way back to the stator and melted
off the solid state gizmo (voltage regulator?), and some of the
windings had gotten mighty toasty. Ohmed windings to the laminations
shows a dead short..and with the bashed laminations, its not
suprising.
I figure I can use a dremal tool and cut off the bashed lamination
sections, and get them out of the winding insulation. what do i do
for some sort of "dope' to paint over the bare/dinged etc etc
windings?
Im going to have to make up a crimp and crimp on a new wire to replace
the burned away one and then put both wires into some sort of sheath
material. The original vinyl sheath having melted away and needed
cutting away.
It didnt do the magnets on the inside of the flywheel all that much
good either, but they are plastic type magnets and for the most part
are all there and nothing is loose, after I took out the busted
chunks...cringe....
If I have to..I could rewind the entire stator..it doesnt look all
that complicated....but the laminations were covered with a thin layer
of black plastic before being wound...might require wrapping with
paper? and rewinding over them......
I dont know how much Lincoln wants for a new assembly...but its gotta
be damned expensive...so its field expediant repair or nothing.
All you coil winding tranformer making electicamal types gots some
seegestions?
thanks
Gunner
"The American people will never knowingly adopt socialism, but under the
name of liberalism they will adopt every fragment of the socialist program
until one day America will be a socialist nation without ever knowing how it
happened." -- Norman Thomas, American socialist
Reply to
Gunner Asch
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I'd use Krylon's Crystal Clear - a clear Acrylic spray that I've used for a long time to both waterproof and insulate "stuff".
It comes both as a "thin" version and a "thick" version (often used by hobbiests for decoupage projects) and is available at paint, big box, and Wally-World stores.
It's also cheap!
Heat-shrink tubing/tape.
Plain old-fashioned Scotch 33 electrical tape can also work.
Back to the "thick" Krylon Crystal Clear again, perhaps only _on both sides_ of the paper.
If spraying/coating the stator, chuck it into a lathe and get it spinning at a moderate speed while applying the coating both to assure balance but, also, to throw off the excess. Let the coating dry while the stator rotates.
Then rewind the stator.
Hope this helps.
Reply to
RAM³
Rewinding the bad coils would be easy, except for finding the correct wire in small quantity. If you're going to try rewinding, let me know and I'll save you a lot of grief. What else does this power? Don't give up on just opening the short. Bake it in an oven and the coils may loosen up. Depends on what they used to seal it at the factory. Use your welding gloves and a wooden stick to push the windings away from the damage while it's hot. It's going to smell and stink so be ready for the static.
Here is a good test for finding out if the individual coils are shorted. Put a large, 100 to 150 watt light bulb in series with the windings. Power it up and put a hacksaw blade on the laminated end. It will buzz. If they buzz less or do not buzz at all, you have a shorted coil. Grainger's has the red insulating paint in spray cans. You can use any heavy paper to insulate the windings from the core.
Al
Reply to
Big Al
Did a quick search @ Grainger's. :
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Al
Reply to
Big Al
Don't cut the laminations! They have to be there to keep the magnetic field going in the proper direction, or the magic electrons can't be herded in the right direction to do work. If anything, I'd plan on removing the windings on the damaged wings and bashing the laminations back flat, possibly warm them up a bit with a Rosebud to make them compliant. But not past dull red, or you could mess up their magnetic properties.
But before that scrounge around for a replacement stator. Doesn't look THAT expensive, unless you have to buy brand new.
And if they quote a ridiculous price, you ask them whether they run a parts store or a Museum - Parts stores sell replacement parts to keep the world moving, museums put priceless things on a shelf behind glass solely to admire and study.
The voltage regulator might be the killer part of the deal, considering it's a Permanent Magnet rotor you can't just adapt an automotive regulator. Probably a brute force zener clamp regulator that sinks the excess to a resistor.
You have to transition to a fine-stranded motor lead wire before you leave the coils, then wrap and tie the connection point with lacing twine and varnish - the vibration will quickly kill solid lead wires if you try anything else. And the sheath is probably silicone covered fiberglass sleeve, readily available.
Fishpaper between the windings and the slot/core - standard stuff when winding motors, choose your thickness and sheet sizes, McMaster stocks it. And the electrical insulating spray varnishes are standard, McM has them too. The magnet wire itself is going to run you $25 to $50 by itself, unless you find it surplus.
But I wouldn't try rewinding one on a core that is physically damaged like yours is - go find one that failed electrically and the core is good, and you can use yours as an example of how to wind it and bring out the leads. Note that some windings will go CW and others go CCW, and 12 wraps is 12 not 11 or 13, you don't want to mess that up.
Not necessarily - there could be a Bean Counter out there going "We don't want to be sitting on this pile of parts for 50 years, and we don't want to scrap them, and we don't want pissed off customers that go buy a Miller - so price the damned things to move!"
Yeah - If it has a 120V output winding in the generator, get a small solid state battery charger sufficient to run the ignition and forget about that "lighting coil" alternator for now. If you find a good used coil and a regulator in your wanderings, then you split the unit and reinstall it.
If it had a front pulley on it I'd say hang a generic 12V 30A car alternator off the nose, wire it in with a "ALT" warning lamp and resistor for the exciter circuit, and be done with it. But it doesn't.
(Or does it? But don't sacrifice the pull starter to get one, unless they do it Old Kohler Style with a knotted loose rope in the sheave.)
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Reply to
Bruce L. Bergman
DIY is nice, but I suspect if you can find an electric motor shop (you can find anything, right?) they may be able to do the whole job faster, cheaper and with less hassle.
Reply to
Pete C.
I believe its just the generator for charging the battery.
How can you save me grief? You wind coils or have another stator?
Gunner
"Obama, raises taxes and kills babies. Sarah Palin - raises babies and kills taxes." Pyotr Flipivich
Reply to
Gunner Asch
The engine is an Onan 18 hp.....electric start twin cylinder.
I just looked (and added additional pictures to the picasa album online) and its an Onan P218 engine.....
One assumes that Onan used the stock stator etc to power the beasty.
Onan parts in my experience....cost ones first born and a testical.
on the other hand...I just checked Ebay...and there are a number of them there..including one with the coil pack, regulator, stator and ignition module.......
ebay # 320297996063
I wonder if the P220 parts are the same as the P218? They look the same, and it wouldnt be a bad thing to have spare electricals on hand, ne? Not to mention that voltage regulator....
Gunner
"Obama, raises taxes and kills babies. Sarah Palin - raises babies and kills taxes." Pyotr Flipivich
Reply to
Gunner Asch
Check out ebay item no. 150293176299 - purports to be a P218 alternator stator.
Grant
Reply to
Grant Erwin
I had the same problem with a Miller unit. had the same engine. If I remember right, the stator and regulator were not that expensive. I replaced the regulator anyway and the old one was still good. I don't know the cost of the rotor as mine was ok. Go to an Onan dealer to check the cost.
Tom
Reply to
Tom M
Bought a used stator on Ebay for a total cost of $31. Its in route. I figure I likely need a voltage regulator, no idea of how to test the current one, but figure since a wire burned completely off it..the solid state unit is likel to be toast.
Still looking for one.
This is the regulator
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"Obama, raises taxes and kills babies. Sarah Palin - raises babies and kills taxes." Pyotr Flipivich
Reply to
Gunner Asch
Harleys use a similar permanent magnet charging system . If the charge amps is around 19 or so , a Shovelhead regulator will work . Up to 32 amps (at 12v) can be handled by an early Evolution regulator . Both are a shunt-to-ground type regulator .
Reply to
Terry Coombs
Ahh, We have a Winner! Gunner, if you get that far, compare the circuit diagrams and prices. As long as it isn't in a chromed case, they probably sell a lot more Harley regulators than Onan or Kohler which would drive down the price.
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Reply to
Bruce L. Bergman
I may still have a 19 amp reg hanging around . Upgraded my (RIP) '76 Shovelhead to a 32 amp system . Fershure still got a stator and rotor . Aftermarket will be cheaper than HD ...
Reply to
Terry Coombs

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