stick selection for thermal arc 185

ah..Sam? You buy the rod for the job at hand. You do of course have to buy the rod thats appropriate for the machine you are using..and the job.

5/16" 6010 is not approriate for autobody sheetmetal work on a small machine.

6011 for all positions in rough rusty work where you need penetration.

6013 for most utility work (most everything else)

6011 is AC/DC

6013 is AC/DC

I think with your machine..Id max out the rod size at 1/8' until you get a better feel for welding.

The manufacture isnt going to sell you a machine that will not use the worlds most common rods.....

Gunner

"Considering the events of recent years, the world has a long way to go to regain its credibility and reputation with the US." unknown

Your machine should be OK with most mild steel rods up to 1/8". IMHO you are better off running DCEP with 6010 or 6011 unless you are having serious problems with arc blow. Then switching to 6011 and AC may be worthwhile. As far as the rods go, the main difference is that 6011 has additional arc stabilizers required for reliable AC operation.

There are lots of different electrodes with different characteristics. Some of the basics are 6010 (DCEP) and 6011 (AC, DCEP, DCEN) which are both deep penetrating, fast freezing electrodes, often used on dirty metal, pipelines, etc., 6013 (AC, DCEP, DCEN) which is mildly penetrating and typically used for sheet metal, and 7018 (AC, DCEP) which is a moderately penetrating low hydrogen rod for producing high quality welds on clean metal. All of these are all-position rods, as indicated by the 1 in the third digit. Technique differs between rods. 6010 and 6011 require a whipping action with a few specific exceptions. 6013 and 7018 are drag rods.

Open circuit voltage on the Pro-Wave 185TSW is listed as 69V. That isn't particularly low. Max allowable is only 80V for safety reasons. If low OCV is a problem for you, there are rods made for small AC welders that typically have low OCV. Check the Lincoln Electric web site for examples. They make several flavors of 6011, several of 7018, etc.

Thanks for the replys

now that you pointed it out, i found in the manual where it says

69volts. for whatever reason i thought I saw 26volts as the open circuit voltage, so I was a bit worried. ;) If you couldent tell, im new to welding, last time I welded was in shop class in 1988, and that was just messing around. I figured Id start with stick sinse I dont have any argon or tig filler rod yet, to get my feet wet so to speak. I have some equipment repairs to do, but I figured id mangle up a pile of scrap metal first. :)

you mention 7018, whats the shelf life on that stuff? It seems like I read in the newsgroup that you have to keep that in a rod oven? Is that true? Or do you just have to make sure its dry before you use it? even if its been sitting exposed on my shelf for a year?

Tig looks a little daunting, with all the electrode types/sizes/tip grinds gas cups, filler rods etc... seems like alot of variables. Which leads me to another question, how important is the profile on a tig electrode? and is there a preferred method to grind those without buying a $500 specific tool?

so many questions, I know. :>

Thanks again

Yes, 7018 is supposed to be kept in an oven once it is out of a hermetically sealed package. And if it comes in a non-hermetically sealed package, it is supposed to be baked at elevated temperature first. The problem is the flux is hygroscopic. It absorbs moisture from the atmosphere which winds up contributing hydrogren to the weld which is supposedly being done with a low hydrogen electrode. OTOH lots of folks ignore this for home and farm use. Actually, some folks seem to ignore this even when welding to code.

Tig is a different animal all right. But it gets easier after you get past the beginning stage. The profile on the electrode is more important than most folks realize. The angle controls the fan out of the arc. The more acute the angle, the wider the fan out. The more obtuse the angle, the more concentrated. There generally needs to be a small flat spot on the tip, too. If it is too small for the current you are running, you risk overheating the very end of the electrode and having it fall into the work. If it is too large, the arc will tend to wander around on it and the work.

I would bet you can do pretty much whatever needs doing around the farm with stick. If I were you, I would stick to that until I got the hang of it. Then I would take on tig just for the heck of it.

The only rods that have trouble with low OCV are 6010 and 7018. I think the Thermal 185 should be OK if you buy decent rods. Cheap 7018 (hobart, Murex) sticks more than good 7018 (lincoln excalibur is the best 7018 I have used). Try stepping down to 3/32" rod if the 1/8" rods have trouble.

Ahem. On my old (old, old, old!) Marquette AC welder, the OCV is 90v. How much danger does that pose, and any way to compensate for it?

Andy

It isn't the volts that do you in, it is the current. Actually only milliamps are needed to kill you, but don't worry about it too much. Your skin resistance will limit the current to safe levels as long as your skin is dry. And af course your welding gloves add more protection. Just watch out for anything sharp that could penetrate your skin and keep dry. Also there is no problem with being in contact with the electrode if there is not a connection thru you to the ground electrode. Especially bad if it is arm to arm thru the chest and heart. So wear decent shoes/boots and don't touch the electrode with one hand and the work withe the other without gloves. This all boils down to DON'T WELD BAREFOOT IN THE RAIN.

Dan

Dan

I wouldn't worry too much about your old Marquette having 90 OCV if you haven't zapped yourself too bad yet. It poses a bit more electrocution/shock potential than new ones. Not much you can do about it other than replace it. But if you avoid getting in the circuit by wearing proper protective gear and observing the same safety practices that you should be observing with brand new equipment, you should be OK.

And dont lie in the bottom of an aluminum boat in shorts and no shirt on a hot day, welding upside down under the control console while really sweaty. Or at the least wear gloves when handling the rod change....

The memory of that episode still hurts.

Gunner

"Pax Americana is a philosophy. Hardly an empire. Making sure other people play nice and dont kill each other (and us) off in job lots is hardly empire building, particularly when you give them self determination under "play nice" rules.

Think of it as having your older brother knock the shit out of you for torturing the cat." Gunner

What you must be careful with low volts and high amps is that you don't fall to the ground to a place where you get stuck with the electrode making contact with you for several minutes.... in electronics they say that for several minutes, even milliamps can kill people. Am I correct? I feel so. Pedro/Peter