UL Approval

You need to review the UL standard for the product you are asking about. You can buy that standard from UL. The UL standard may have information that does not correspond to what you have been told.

U/L and TUV are competitors in a free market. I am not suroprised they do not recognize each other's listings. You don't get AC plugs in a Ford dealer either

The first manufacturer pays s a bundle to get a standard written for their product. Then the standard is often stolen and used by competitors. It has been my experience that the standards are almost identical between NTRL's, but the field personnel will try to sway persons to use their testing facility and services by slightly altering the truth. The real truth can only be found by reviewing the standards.

After finally reading about NRTLs I believe all the base standards are the same as before NRTLs were recognized, and come primarily from UL and also FM (which now has another name), NEMA, IEEE... The NRTLs, like TUV, test to the same standards that would have been used before their existence, but may use different test methods.

bud--

NRTLs try to use the same standard where they exist, they also use the same test proceedure, where the proceedure is specified in the standard. It is very expensive to write a standard, so unless one does not exist you do not do it.

In Europe, TUV only writes standards when there is no other alternative available, as when you write a standard you also have to ensure that it is kept up todate (to client normally only pays towards the cost of the original, not the updates). International standards, IEC, ISO and EN are reviewed at regular interval and update when required, but every update has to be approved by the members of the organisation involved and this can at time be very time consuming.

Best regards

BillB

In the US, if a NRTL creates a standard, what problems are there getting it accepted? IIRC OSHA has a list of standards NRTLs can be qualified to test for. Would OSHA accept a NRTL stanard not on the list for an odd item the existing standards don't cover?

I've never run across equipment listed/labeled by a NRTL. Do you have any idea how much is out there? What type - consumer products, electric power, ...? If equipment is just marketed to the US are NRTLs used? Do NRTLs like TUV have a significant advantage for equipment marketed to the US and the world?

On cost of standards, I presume the cost of developing and maintaining UL standards was borne substantially by fees for inspection. With NRTL competition do you have any idea how UL does this now?

bud--

Actually the NTRL is inspecting to the UL standard, which is what they approved to do by the Department of Labour. I don't see how UL can reject it if the inspection is performed to the same standard by a lab registered to the government body that sets the standards in the first place.

Years ago when I worked at a specialty test lab that was not NTRL. IIRC, customers could get UL to approve our reports under the condition that all raw data of the fire test was supplied with it. Have you supplied full test data to them?

Stephen

U/L is a NRTL, one of 18

The government does not "set" standards they just accept and adopt them. The standard is set by the NRTL or a standards organization like NFPA, ANSI or IEEE.

Have a look at our US web site, it gives full details of what a NRTL is. See:

Also see: Regarding UL standards, these are prepared by committees that represent interested parties in the US (ourselves included), so the cost is shared by industry in the US and not by UL alone.

I cannot comment on what happens in the US regarding NTRL creating standards specifically to test a product where no National standard exists, I can only comment on what happens in Europe, please see my earlier comments.

TUV Rheinland are one of the larger NRTL, we test and approve a large range of product for sale in the US and Canada, have a look our scope on the OSHA web site for details of what we can do.

Products tested by TUV Rheinland are normally tested and approved in a much shorter time scale, with competitive costs, when compared to products tested and approved by UL, please talk to our US office for details.

Domestic and IT products sold into the US and Canada are usually approved before they are shipped, but this is not the case with machinery supplied from Europe. TUV Rheinland offer both approvals and a field evaluation service for machinery, but due to lack of enforcement in the US few manufactures have their machines tested before they ship.

Anyone wanting help in the UK with approvals for the USA or Canada can have a look at our website at

contact me at the TUV Rheinland's UK office, e-mail snipped-for-privacy@uk.tuv.com or telephone 0121-634-8000 and ask for Bill.

Best regards

BillB