CA rules on Propane bottle without the new I/O port :-)

Well - I broke down today and took the day off to buy a propane bottle. One for my furnace and whatnot. The new bottles don't drive the torch
well at all due to the limited flow.
The smallest allowed by law is 15 gallon bottle. (Maybe forklifts are exempt).
The 15 is a tall sucker - I'd say 4' and between a welding bottle and a barbie bottle. The nice thing is the base of mine is a full ring - to roll if needed (tacky in cement) and has holes. The holes will be useful along with the ones in the top ring as tie downs in the truck. Horizonal transport is legal. I plan on a cradle on the side of my pickup just for this.
Martin
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I'm thinking that you got fed a line of BS. There are new tanks with the now-required "OPD" gizmo in them in all sizes, from the traditional foot-or-so tall 5 gallon unit that's often used in BBQ grilles, on up to the full-sized 5 foot tall monsters that hold I-have-no-clue-how-much available pretty much anyplace you can buy propane or tanks.
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I have been buying propane for 40 years. I have half a dozen bottles around the house and shop. I don't think my dealer that fills (in fact my route man) my 500 gallon tank would feed me a line. You can buy the new OPD on anything you want it installed - just you have to have it on less than 15 gallons in Ca. e.g. those used in campers and barbie at home.
Since you live in 'Chaotic' areas - it might be anything :-)
My 500 gallon tank doesn't have OPD on it that is for certain!
Martin
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I'm having a hard time trying to figure out what you're saying. Obviously, you're typing english words, but the way that you're sticking them together is confusing as hell. So let's make sure we're both on the same page...
I don't know about you or anyone else, but I'm reading the rather awkward phrase "The smallest allowed by law is 15 gallon bottle. (Maybe forklifts are exempt)." to mean that you think the smallest tank size that can be legally bought in California is 15 gallons?
If that's the case, you're operating on misinformation - whether because of your own misunderstanding, because someone gave you bad information, or a combination of both. You can still legally get (and in fact, many places will hand you a new one in exchange for your old one and an extra 5 bucks) the little tanks anyplace that propane or propane tanks are sold.
If I'm misunderstanding your statement, please feel free to let me know what you actually intended it to mean.
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Don Bruder wrote:

I think you missed his statement of OPD.
I understand what he meant.
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Less than 15 gallon can NOT be purchased without the OPD valve. That is the law. Not just in California, but across North America (Canada and the USA)
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clare @ snyder.on .ca wrote:

OK, *NOW* we're on the same page. The original, confusing sentence should have read "The smallest allowed by law WITHOUT AN OPD is 15 gallon bottle. (Maybe forklifts are exempt)."
Minus those three words, the whole thing turned into a severe case of "Say WHAT??? I can go buy a five gallon tank from AT LEAST 5 stores right here in town, and be perfectly legal. What's this crazy man talking about???"
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On Thu, 04 Dec 2003 17:58:30 GMT, clare @ snyder.on .ca wrote:

Might be true in California, might be true where you live, but it isn't the law across the entire USA. OPDs are a gas association *recommendation*. Some states have codified that recommendation into law, some haven't.
Gary
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Here is a list of which States enforce the OPD guidelines and which one they enforce if any. NFPA 58 is a set of guidelines that some States enforce as law and others ignore completely (Washington for example). The NPGA doesn't make law they make rules that put money in their members pockets.
http://www.npga.org/files/public/NFPA_58_State_Adoptions.pdf
Cheers,
Kelley
On Thu, 04 Dec 2003 17:58:30 GMT, clare @ snyder.on .ca wrote:

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I think he means the smallest tank you can buy without the OPD valve. OPD valves are not required for all sizes of propane tanks. I have a tank that is about a 60 lb tank that does not have a OPD valve that the local feed store is happy to fill.
Dan

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Dan Caster wrote:

So has anybody worked out a hack for these (protecive of fools etc.) ridiculous valves? Like, for example taking a new, never been filled, tank, drill a hole and weld a pipe bushing on the bottom. Put a standard valve there! Go get it filled - no one looks at the bottom - and at home or the shop turn the damn thing upside down and attach the regulator. Ken (feeling bullet/flame proof at the moment)
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wrote:

They've dione the same damned thing here in NZ and now, athough you can get the old cylinders refilled, you can't buy new ones without the new valves.
As someone who only ever uses liquid-draw from these little tanks (by up-ending them) this is a right pain in the backside.
Even the 47Kg Liquid-draw tanks I'm now using have an annouing excess-flow valve that means I can't draw anything like the flow-rate I need -- so I have to use two separate tanks.
What next -- all tools must be made from Nerf material to stop people hurting themselves?
-- you can contact me via http://aardvark.co.nz/contact /
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On Fri, 05 Dec 2003 08:20:25 +1300, Bruce Simpson put forth the notion that...

Seatbelts on bar stools?
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Copyright 2003
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wrote something ......and in reply I say!:
phppphhhhpphhhp! You still hit your head as you fall. Sue all Hotels not issuing bike helmets at the bar!

**************************************************** sorry remove ns from my header address to reply via email
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Make a "suckling pigs" manifold using the disposable bottles? :^)
Tim
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My "hack" is to get the large tank filled and then transfer the lpg to smaller older lpg tanks. I am sure it is against the law to do this IF you transport the tanks. But don't think the feds can make it illegal without involking interstate transportation ( which includes transporting on any roads that received federal funds ).
Dan

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On 5 Dec 2003 11:00:53 -0800, snipped-for-privacy@krl.org (Dan Caster) wrote:

If the feds wanted to make it illegal (it isn't illegal at the federal level) they'd simply need to show that either the tank or the gas traveled in interstate commerce at least once since their manufacture, or show that using a non-OPD tank has a commercial effect on commerce across a state line (for example, by lessening the sales of OPD tanks, even by one tank). That's how much they've distorted the meaning of the interstate commerce clause.
But fortunately it is *not* against federal law. Anyone telling you that is misinformed or lying. The OPD requirement is merely a gas association (NPGA) *recommendation*. Some states have adopted the NPGA recommendations as law, others haven't. Washington state is one of the ones which hasn't.
Gary
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wrote:

Well this is nothing new. There is Kalifornias rules and regulations and then there is the rest of the worlds rules and regs. Funny what other countries and states deem safe there is always a Warning labell as required by Kalifornia on it just the same. Either Kalifornia is "right" and the rest of the world is in left field, or Kalifornia thrives on seeing its name on stuff no matter what the real cause is.
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Roy wrote:

You must be related to Schwarzenegger, who could never figure it out either.
Yo Bro, it's California! Abrasha http://www.abrasha.com
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Murdered any Bosnian Muslims lately?
Gunner
"No man shall be debarred the use of arms. The laws that forbid the carrying of arms disarm those only who are neither inclined nor determined to commit crimes. Such laws make things worse for the assaulted and better for the assailants. They ought to be designated as laws not preventative but fearful of crimes, produced by the tumultuous impression of a few isolated facts, and not by thoughtful consideration of the inconveniences and advantages of a universal decree." - Thomas Jefferson
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