That home made sports car

Hi Eric. It sounds like you've been bitten by a bug that never stops until it's eaten you up. <g> I've been there; I have an original edition of Costin and Phipps book, and a contemporary that I bought in 1961 -- _Sports Car Bodywork_ by Locke. Over the years I've built a near-bookshelf of bodywork, chassis, and engine sports-car and race car books.

I've helped out on two such projects by others, neither one completed. I'll suggest that it's 5 to 10 times as much work as most people, even experienced metalworking people, think.

You probably don't want to hear this, but my suggestion is to buy a good kit car that you like and build that. There will be plenty of work to do, for a year or more, typically. If you're really lucky, you'll find one that someone half-completed before they gave up. Those toys have left broken marriages behind. It's sTILL much more work than most people realize.

I've gone to great lengths to try things -- hammering aluminum, welding 4130 tube, and so on. When I did some sports car racing in the late '60s and early '70s, I rebuilt two Alfa Romeo engines, and tuned Jaguars, Triumphs, hot English Fords, and Bristols (AC Bristol cars) for my sporty-car friends. I had an excellent English mechanic for a friend and teacher. Out of college I first worked for Ranger Yachts, as a fiberglass layup man. It's MUCH easier to learn than hammering aluminum.

I raced an Alfa Romeo Giulietta Spyder, an MG Midget 1275, and I drove or owned many others. My old college roommate still has one of the 50 Lotus 7 Mk IVs that were brought into the US in 1971. I've driven it; even though it's the most advanced chassis in the Lotus 7 series, it's still twitchy. My MG was more stable. Suspension and handling are exceedingly tricky on a scratch-built car. That's why many of the English club-racer specials took the suspension parts wholesale from some proven car. The Triumph Herald was a favorite.

Carbs are manageable. There is a good book on tuning SU's that I used to use. I've tuned Weber DCOEs for hopped-up engines, and sliding-throat Zeniths. Just read what the experts say. SU's, particularly, have so many combinations of main jets and needles that you'll be completely lost, if your engine has even the slightest modifications, without a good book. There aren't many "experts" left to call upon. IIRC, Clare here on the NG should be able to steer you to info sources.

Good luck. I'd love to see some beginner tackle a start-to-finish sports car and succeed. Something really simple, like Champion's Locost, gives the best chance of pulling it off. Beyond that, it becomes distressingly complicated and frustrating.

Reply to
edhuntress2
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My Allstate agent told me they would insure a Locost. That was maybe 15 years ago. NJ will allow a home-built car, and issue some kind of serial number for it, like a VIN.

Reply to
edhuntress2

Like Ferraris. I've been told by a Ferrari owner, at a concours, that his 275 GTB probably had 10 pounds of Bondo in it -- right from the factory. d8-)

Reply to
edhuntress2

If you read the Costin and Phipps book, you know that the closest thing to a true space frame was the Lotus 8. It was a failure. <g>

Look at the early MB 300 SLR to see what kind of hoops they had to go through to make a true space frame. Or look at the frame on a Maserati Tipo 61, which was known as the "Birdcage."

A Lotus 7, Locost, etc. has no lateral stiffness (no triangulation) above the floor, in the passenger bay. To race them, they cheat like hell with the roll bar triangulation to get some stiffness in there. Otherwise, they're a Flexible Flyer.

Reply to
edhuntress2

If they had doors they would only close ONCE.

A bit like the early Dart Swinger 340. If you dropped the clutch with the door unlatched, good luck!!! The Duster/demon was moderately stiffer.

Reply to
Clare Snyder
<SNIP>

Yeh Ed, I have been thinking about buying the frame. I can weld it, I do have the proper equipment, experience, and skill. But it may be easier to register the thing if I use an already made frame. I can always mod the fram if need be. But I really want to make the body and bolt all the stuff on. Eric

Reply to
etpm

Once again, Eric, I wish you success. I'd love to see the completed project. Are you determined to make the body from aluminum? If so, allow yourself plenty of time to learn. One book I mentioned, _Sports Car Bodywork_, talks through making a body with just a leather sandbag and hammers. I tried it once, just to see what it was like, using a hollowed log and some 3003 aluminum. Banging out the hollows wasn't hard, but I would have needed more practice or some instruction to shrink out the edges.

I think that time and patience go a long way on these projects, until you get good at it.

Reply to
edhuntress2

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How did you try to shrink the metal?

Reply to
Jim Wilkins

I used a home-made leather-faced slapper and a dolly. It was the same dolly I used over 50 years ago on steel.

I didn't anneal, but the aluminum was already pretty soft. I have used the old trick with plain acetylene to leave a layer of soot, and then burning it off with the torch. That anneals aluminum very well, but I wasn't getting the buckles out with the method I tried. It's supposed to work.

Reply to
edhuntress2

Making a paper pattern over the buck, cutting the aluminum to the patern, forming it over the buck allowing overlaps if required, then trimming and welding to achieve the basic shape makes the job a lot easier than working from a flat sheet and attempting to do all the shaping by stretching and shrinking. There is a limit to what you can do with an english wheel, plannishing hammer, and shrinking dies - muchless with a paddle and leather bag.

That's how we formed the nose-bowl for the Pegazair project. I "carved" a form out of pink foam, then we made the patterns, formed the aluminum with the hammer and bag, welded the panels together, and wheeled and plannished it to final shape, theun using shtinking dies put the lip around the edge (simplified version - but basically correct), We DID have to anneal the material several times, and for filler tig welding the panels together we used strips sheared off of the metal we were working. The seams dissapeared completely on the finished product.

Reply to
Clare Snyder

Do weld seams behave differently when reshaped?

I'm more concerned with steel MIG welds than aluminum.

Reply to
Jim Wilkins

"modern jeep" aka Fiat?

Reply to
Larry Jaques

Congrats on your pending retirement, Eric.

If not a wheel, maybe enjoy its noisier cousin?

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Reply to
Larry Jaques

A 55gal swear drum would suit me.

Reply to
Larry Jaques

I wonder if that comment might explain a mates situation when he had to replace a diff in his Jeep here in the UK. Apparently no way to know whether it was a US made diff or a Italian one from the VIN number you just had to remove it and measure the fasteners. The US one used inch still but the Italian one used metric, fortunately for him it was the Italian one as they were £350 each whereas the US made one was £700 with shipping, customs, and VAT.

Reply to
David Billington

AKA a Plannishing hammer

Reply to
Clare Snyder

I'm good at hammer forming copper and silver and have also done aluminum. Shrinking soft metals isn't that hard, plus you can buy shrinker/stretchers that really make it easy to shrink. EWric

Reply to
etpm

I worked at a racing company in the early 1990s and they had the low end US made shrinker/stretchers and I was told they were acceptable on steel but they found the surface damage to soft metal such as aluminium too great so avoided their use. I mentioned to the workshop foreman that I had a UK made shrinking jaw set and brought them in and we did a back to back test and the results were like chalk and cheese, both worked but the surface damage was far less with my set, I expect they're equivalent to the high end US made ones mentioned in Fournier's book or the Swiss Eckold ones.  There's some information in the dropbox at

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the dfsshrink files to show the jaw construction and resulting surface. Would be interesting to know how much difference the alternate grit jaws shown at TinManTech make for the results with the low end shrinkers.

Reply to
David Billington

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