USB camera for powder check

"Buerste" fired this volley in news:hssckq$enn$ snipped-for-privacy@speranza.aioe.org:
Then cavity resonance might not be the best way to measure it, although it's a good idea if you were working with factory-new brass. Either weight or mass are the _only_ ways you'll tell if the load is correct. Also, you'll have to do the final check before you place and swage the bullet.
It _could_ be reasonable that the same station that did the powder loading could measure the mass before and after powder loading, but before the turret turned. The way progressive loaders work, I think it might be better to make a transducer that impinged on the side of the case being measured, than to have a transducer per station, with the requisite problems of connecting them electrically as the turret moved.
There are a number of problems to solve -- elasticity of the clamp that holds the casing, moving the transducer probe to the casing, a calibration method that "knows" how loads within the acceptable range affect the resonant frequency (dropping it, of course), and so on.
LLoyd
Reply to
Lloyd E. Sponenburgh
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Quality magazine has an insert on USB etc cameras.
One source - Sams / Costco / Walmart - cameras for security - but they might not focus close...
The other I'd think on the lower cost is one for a telescope. Those focus close.
Martin
Martin H. Eastburn @ home at Lions' Lair with our computer lionslair at consolidated dot net "Our Republic and the Press will Rise or Fall Together": Joseph Pulitzer TSRA: Endowed; NRA LOH & Patron Member, Golden Eagle, Patriot's Medal. NRA Second Amendment Task Force Charter Charter Founder IHMSA and NRA Metallic Silhouette maker & member. http://lufk> The thing that scares me the most in my reloading endeavors is a squib. To
Reply to
Martin H. Eastburn
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A question occurs -- why must it be a USB camera? That would then require a computer to display it.
I would use a stand-alone camera which puts out standard video, and couple it to the monitor which is otherwise connected to the nearby CNC lathe.
And -- such a camera normally does not have an auto-focus. You just pre-focus it at the right distance and you are in business. (You may want to make a spacer ring to allow it to focus close enough.
O.K. That would use the computer -- and require some rather fancy image processing and image-recognition software, too. :-)
Understood.
How about a level sensor in the power measure to lock up the press when the level in the hopper falls below a preset level? Normally, you are not going to get improper dump of powder until the supply gets too low to maintain pressure in the hopper.
Enjoy, DoN.
Reply to
DoN. Nichols
Further to the above. Have a look at
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information on a system that compares one frame to another and can detect a difference. It seems mainly concerned with motion but there is no reason that it cannot detect difference between any two frames.
What I looked at is Linux software but if you are setting up a dedicated system that shouldn't cause problems.
John B. Slocomb (johnbslocombatgmaildotcom)
Reply to
John B. Slocomb
That's what a powder check die does, I just don't have a spare station.
Reply to
Buerste
My bullet weight varies more than the 2.7 grain charge and my cases are mixed headstamps and they vary. My powder charge is about the volume of a pea. I'm on the right side of the press and the powder dump is on the far left. I CAN observe the case after the powder dump but I have to move awkwardly to do so. Thus the camera to take a peek in the case and put the image on a screen that's behind the press on the right. Too bad, I have a few comparator scales at work with settable +/- tolerance for weighing wire. I don't want to give up my "Factory Crimp Die". I still want that 8-station press!
Reply to
Buerste
I'm not worried about the hopper running out. The charge is so small that the hopper is still three quarters full when I'm WAY tired of reloading. It's the odd happenstance that I don't get a dump or the cycle was out of the norm. I've only had one squib in 5,000 rounds...one too many!
Reply to
Buerste
Good points. Obviously your problem is shooting those itty bitty pea shooter loads. Get yourself a BMG.
Now you have reached an age that you don't need to wait to get what you want. Order that eight station unit today. Spend your kids inheritance.
Karl
Reply to
Karl Townsend
If I only had a convenient place to shoot rifles! I would love to get into bench rest... I sold my 240 Gibbs, It was a pain to fire-form cases and build rounds. But, it could dot an "i" at 1,000 yards on a calm day! In 15 years, it only saw about 100 rounds and I only made 25 cases. I still have a couple of .223 Mini-14s but they are for sale. I think a .50 BMG could become an obsession that would break the bank! I imaging dumping powder with a measuring cup. I can shoot .38s for $0.03 each and not have to chase brass.
Reply to
Buerste
Wow! How does that cost break down? Curious. Bob
Reply to
Bob Engelhardt
Must be using OLD primers, they're 3 1/2 cents apiece on sale now. And that's from somebody that's not gouging! Yeah, I've still got a few(and always fewer) boxes of 1K that say $7.95 on them, that was then, this is now.
For the other poster, new .38/.357 brass runs $25-$40/100, depending on who's doing the gouging and when it's available. Light charges will extend case life, it's not impossible to get 20 reloads or more out of a case that way. 7000 grains per pound of powder, 2-3 grains per charge for Bullseye or similar for target loads, runs $22-$30/lb, again, depending on where it's bought. Cheapest store-bought bullets are around $15/100 for lead, run right around 20-25 cents@ for jacketed. If you don't value your time and can get access to free lead, you can cast bullets for essentially the cost of the electricity or propane. With a 4-up gang mold, or better yet, a pair, 300-400 good bullets an hour by hand are quite possible, assuming a big enough pot and using a big ladle. The limiting factor is the cooling time of the mold. Some of the fancier casting machines come with forced fan cooling to up the rate. Larger bullets take longer to freeze, can't do too many 12 gauge balls or slugs per hour.
Stan
Reply to
stans4
Must be using OLD primers, they're 3 1/2 cents apiece on sale now. And that's from somebody that's not gouging! Yeah, I've still got a few(and always fewer) boxes of 1K that say $7.95 on them, that was then, this is now.
For the other poster, new .38/.357 brass runs $25-$40/100, depending on who's doing the gouging and when it's available. Light charges will extend case life, it's not impossible to get 20 reloads or more out of a case that way. 7000 grains per pound of powder, 2-3 grains per charge for Bullseye or similar for target loads, runs $22-$30/lb, again, depending on where it's bought. Cheapest store-bought bullets are around $15/100 for lead, run right around 20-25 cents@ for jacketed. If you don't value your time and can get access to free lead, you can cast bullets for essentially the cost of the electricity or propane. With a 4-up gang mold, or better yet, a pair, 300-400 good bullets an hour by hand are quite possible, assuming a big enough pot and using a big ladle. The limiting factor is the cooling time of the mold. Some of the fancier casting machines come with forced fan cooling to up the rate. Larger bullets take longer to freeze, can't do too many 12 gauge balls or slugs per hour.
Stan *******************************************************
I cast from a bottom-pour 20# Lee pot. I use Lee 6 cavety molds and can cast 24 to 36 bullets/minute easily. The Al cools so fast there is no cooling time, in fact they need to be hot. The last batch of Wolf primers were $23/k, a bit cheaper than they are now at $28/k at Widener's. I bought 16 pounds of 700x powder for $80 or so, I forget exactly. I can crank-out 500 rounds/hr at a very leasurly pace, not counting set-up time. I have yet to buy used brass for more than 4 cents each and as little as 2.5 cents each.
On the other hand, I'm not including shipping, electricity, media, equipment or time.
Reply to
Buerste
I've had one. Really sucks when it is a revolver. Nothing like beating a squib back into a case that might have powder in it so you can open the crane. For my heavy barrel security six target model, a bic pen body worked fine to protect the rifling.
I have a progressive press but it is such a switched on pay attention thing that I'd rather use a turret press or a Lee hand loader and take my time.
Snapping a digicam photo of the cases in the loading block with powder in them for review after loading, sounds like a nice addition to my loading process.
Wes -- "Additionally as a security officer, I carry a gun to protect government officials but my life isn't worth protecting at home in their eyes." Dick Anthony Heller
Reply to
Wes
I've found several of the sorts of video components on eBay in the past couple of years, and they were fairly inexpensive.
If the sellers even know what to call/name the items, they might use terms like illuminator, or some similar term. If the seller doesn't realize what the items were used for, they might use some weird descriptions.
Another term they might use is C-mount, referring to the specific camera mounting arrangement on many of the industrial machine vision setups.
Software will be a more difficult quest, IMO.. a program from a cheap surveillance camera setup probably won't work well for a machine vision application.. I suspect that there would be a lot of false alarms, but maybe not.
Reply to
Wild_Bill
[snip]
I wonder how accurate such a s/w solution could be. The surface of the charge is variable in texture, so a simple comparison to a standard image might give you too many false alarms when the charge is OK. There are more sophisticated algorithms tat will work, but tuning them is non trivial.
Here's what I'd do: Aim a laser diode into the top of the cartridge at a slight angle off vertical. Make the angle adjustable so that the beam intersects the surface of a correct charge at the centerline of the cartridge. If the level is too high or too low, the red dot will appear off center. Arrange a small mirror to make looking into the top of the cartridge easier when seated in front of the loader. Judge the charge level by eye with this device (much better s/w than anything but really expensive apps).
Reply to
Paul Hovnanian P.E.
I wonder if simply shaking each round near the ear and both listening and feeling how much mass is moving would suffice to detect grossly out of range powder loads.
The vision systems will have difficulty telling a very thin layer of powder from a full load unless there is some kind of probe rod involved.
Joe Gwinn
Reply to
Joseph Gwinn
Shaking each round would take a lot of time. But maybe you could roll the cartridges down a incline. The powder tumbling inside would take some energy. A cartridge without powder might fall a bit further out and one with a double load might fall short.
Would probably only work for rimless brass, if it works at all. But could be worth trying.
Dan
Reply to
dcaster
But would it work well enough? Tom said he had one short every 5,000 rounds or so.
I think that the powder weight is a small fraction of the weight of the entire round.
Joe Gwinn
Reply to
Joseph Gwinn
Joseph Gwinn wrote in news: snipped-for-privacy@news.giganews.com:
In a "hardball" 45 ACP round, you are looking at a 230 grain bullet and a couple grains of powder. The stuff often literally is a "powder", and it doesn't really rattle. Some rifle powder has larger grains, and you can hear it, but it depends a lot on the specific powder. Pistol powders are often small flat flakes, and they just don't rattle much.
Doug White
Reply to
Doug White
GACK!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
teeny weenie bitsy amount of powder.....
Gunner, 7.2gr Unique under a 200gr SWC
Reply to
Gunner Asch

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