Going to attempt to make a sen tomorrow

Hi Alvin,

This is a story how mis-adventure is the mother of invention.

I was getting the shi... upset, with a piece of malee burl, a really hard wood, but worth the effort. I was hand carving and getting nowhere. There was sweat dripping in my eyes, and in frustration I ripped off my goggles (which were fogging up).

The problem was I still holding onto the extremely sharp thin chisel. The first thought was "I bet that's going to p*ss blood".

Surprisingly it didn't, the blade is thin and razor sharp, so there isn't even a scar, of course it would have been a different story if I'd poked myself 1/4" back and scewered my temple... I got lucky. I only had to deal with the shock of doing it.

Anyway, determined "not" to become a statistic... I thought there has to be a better and faster way to machine wood. I remembered that you can modify a drill press to be a rudimentary wood lathe... so why not a rudimentary mill.

Off to the hardware store and a couple of packets of 1/4" shank router bits later (I bought two packets because there was more variety). My piece of handle material in a machine vice, put in a suitable router bit. Adjusted the speed of the drill press to the fastest setting. Moved the work up to the depth I wanted.

Before I switched on I was thinking "this is probably going to tear my hand off!". So I switched on and carefully started my first cut... okay things were going smoothly, I maintained that level of care until I had finished the first cavity. The next scale was faster.

So gentlemen a drill press "can" be used as a wood mill :-)

Regards Charles P.S. Aw you should use a 4 lb demolition hammer ;-) P.P.S. Oh, forgot to mention cutlers rivets look like cr*p if you don't use a step drill.

snipped-for-privacy@XX.com wrote:

Cool. :) I like stories. :)

My lastest-favorite wood working method is to use a brand spanking new sanding disc on a little hand grinder.

The only thing I've found that'll cut the "end grain" on a new knife handle (like it means business) and not burn or chip it.

Got a 10lb ;) and just bought an old 16lb head.

The 10lb worked fine re-arching the ~5/16" thick leaf springs but wouldn't "move enough" the 5/8" thick overload spring and that's the one I really wanted to modify the most.

Maybe this group won't think I'm nuts? ;)

...have you noticed how the "corner" of the new hammer heads (in the last 30 years or so) are cut back (champhered?) too stinkin much?

While digging through my favorite used tool store's hammer heads, it was so obvious the change that's been made over the last 50 years.

That's just something that's been bothering me for decades and 'til now, been suffering in silence. ;)

The 16lb head is one of the good old-ones and isn't used-up neither.

And a certain size hole in the metal part for the cutler's rivets to hold too.

You can have my share of 'em. ;)

Alvin in AZ ps- the re-arching job turned out real good, right at the maximum change I wanted, not a lift, just a "put 31 years back in 'em" pps- 25 miles on my new ring and pinion (not broke in yet by any means) and my RTV smearing ability's not what I thought it was, it leaks gear oil near the top, of all places :)

Hammer. Good plane irons are forged hollow. Only the modern low-end stuff is ground hollow. This is also why "tapping out the back" is no longer recommended practice on modern irons - grind the edges down instead.

My sen is M2 HSS, ground from power hacksaw blade and otherwise un-heat-treated. The steel you're using it on is pretty soft at the time.

Finally finished the sen and gouge, they cut annealed spring like butter, also shaved a 50 cent piece, cut the quick off my fingers, and cut various other items.

I didn't bother to temper the items, so if I drop them they'll either chip or shatter. Who cares they work :-)

Regards Charles P.S. They sure look ugly :-)

Chilla wrote:

To paraphrase the immortal Forrest Gump: Ugly is as ugly does. If they does, they ain't ugly. :)

You might want to draw them a little though, maybe a very dark straw, so they're not so hard they break if you really have to pull on them sometime.

They sound like ya done good.

I was thinking about tempering it a little, and I might with the next ones I make.

Oh have you heard this Forrest Gumpism (have no idea where it comes from, definitely not the movie). Personally I find it a little dark.

"Life is like virginity. One prick can take it away"

Regards Charles

Yeah, that's a bit dark alright.

A friend of mine in high school coined this daffy definition: "Virgin: A bubble on the stream of life. One prick and it's gone forever."

But this is supposed to be a family program. :)

Cool. :)

My friend sez- "the ugly ones are the good ones"

Which steel is it again?

Maybe no tempering necessary if is, or acts like, a medium carbon steel like 4340.

Notice how 500F (for and hour) which produces dark straw is weaker?

JH's "dark straw" is, of course, done in seconds.

I don't know what the resulting difference is! :/

Industry doesn't use "skilled methods" like that, so I have no information on the results. :/

Anybody got any information on that?

Alvin in AZ

Got somewhere you could post some photos?

The tools were going to be made from 5160, but I had some old files laying around so it's either O1 or W2. It's definitely red short, so my best guess is that it's probably O1.

Regards Charles

I manage several Yahoo! lists so I could post them there. However I have been asked many times... "Where's your website? I wanna see your stuff!".

Okay I'll make one tonight.

Regards Charles

After spark testing close to 100 files (not including rasps) I've never seen one that looked even close to O1.

If you got that "hot short" part right (I don't doubt you) then it might have some Cr or V in it?

If it weren't so expensive (how much is postage to Oz?) I'd send you some "known samples". It's easy as anything when you got known samples to compare sparks to.

Tempering a re-heat treated old file in boiling water for 1/2 hour will strengthen it up quite a bit and make it slightly harder, both. No kidding. :) BTDT and read it too. ;)

Alvin in AZ

Cool. :)

If you put a picture of your face on there, make sure and warn us ahead of time, ok? That goes for everbody with a personal website.

Somethings just need to be sneeked up on slow, that could otherwise be too disturbiing if seen un-expected-like. :/

Also could have children around that might see it by accident. :(

Alvin in AZ

Very old files, it's probably mystery metal that only a tech analysis can determine, and at $80 a test it's not worth it for small quantities.

Postage is a royal pain to here, and vise versa, but I appreciate the offer. I'll get around to getting a selection of common knife steels some point, so don't worry about it.

I'll try the boiling water, never heard of that before. Have heard of quenching mild steel in brine for limited hardness. I'll definitely give it a go.

Thanks regards Charles

Yep, that's a new one on me too. I always thought the boiling point was way too low to draw a temper.

Learn something new every day I guess. :)

I wonder what would happen with a cryo treat, maybe liquid nitrogen or helium temps, and then that draw would yield.

Like a subzero quench like they use for hardenning and tempering stainless steel?

Charles

Depending on the carbon content and other alloying it can actaully make the steel harder.

http:/