Drill Sharpeners

membership is free! their maybe some charter memebers still here!

You m,ight be right, I think for a touch-up it might be like 30 secs. been there done it. with my eye closed. simple is ALWAYS the best. My

7yr old niece could use this & get good results. ITS A DRILL NOT A JIG GRINDER

Ya Ya, mine exec/vp is sviss. so is my interapid, etalon

ya no the swiss&germans, they make good $$stuff$$,(vince sham-wow) Herrmann has 10 ultrasonic apps on the new Mercedes E class

anybody still use the drill protractor gauge? I do, be lost w/o it on big drills.

Before the link

If you want benefits in time savings, dont waste it with optical comparisons for drill sharpening unless that's your main stay.

Anybody have a Deckel/Alexadria single lip cutter grinder (my favorite machine in the whole wide world) with a drill sharpening attachment? Seen it in the book years ago, but never used one.

sorry not time for downloads, gotta hand sharpen some carbide spade drills for 40+yr old face brick. Fucken shit is like glass! Damn who needs an outside spicket anyway, carry 5gal buckets outa the basement sink for wartering/carwashing good exersise, but ya need 2 to balance the load.

\|||/ (o o) ______.oOO-(_)-OOo.____________________ ~ Gil ~ the HOLDZEM=A9=AE king

How bout dat 5-axis Brierley? wow....

Seems to me a fadal w/ a 4/5 axis trunion could be used in place of a Brierly, no? If the program were properly written, I could see almost all drills (of a similar class/style) accommodated with just the changing of a diameter offset/tip angle.

If there were some downtime, set up the machine, load the program, and sharpen a day's worth of drills.

I have never used *any* drill sharpener, but sharpen them half-assed by hand, but see one poss. common problem: the initial loading of the drill relative to the flute direction at the tip.

I do this by hand by determining as perfect a symmetry by eye as possible -- easier to show than to describe.

So I guess if there is a Q to all this, it is How do you load the drill properly to begin with? Is there something that "locates" the flute angles/directions?

The drill fits into chuck and is clamped tight, chuck is inserted into the grinders arm, chuck pushed forward (gently) till drill stops against sapphire lens, turn chuck so drill flute is positioned above center in relation to comparator screen parallel lines, drill chuck is then clamped firmly in arm.

-- Tom

Drilling, Turning, Grinding, Threading and Milling your right it's simple stuff so what do we need all these catalogs and specialty tools for anyway.........LOL

-- Tom

membership is free! their maybe some charter memebers still here!

You m,ight be right, I think for a touch-up it might be like 30 secs. been there done it. with my eye closed. simple is ALWAYS the best. My

7yr old niece could use this & get good results. ITS A DRILL NOT A JIG GRINDER

Ya Ya, mine exec/vp is sviss. so is my interapid, etalon

ya no the swiss&germans, they make good $$stuff$$,(vince sham-wow) Herrmann has 10 ultrasonic apps on the new Mercedes E class

anybody still use the drill protractor gauge? I do, be lost w/o it on big drills.

Before the link

If you want benefits in time savings, dont waste it with optical comparisons for drill sharpening unless that's your main stay.

Anybody have a Deckel/Alexadria single lip cutter grinder (my favorite machine in the whole wide world) with a drill sharpening attachment? Seen it in the book years ago, but never used one.

sorry not time for downloads, gotta hand sharpen some carbide spade drills for 40+yr old face brick. Fucken shit is like glass! Damn who needs an outside spicket anyway, carry 5gal buckets outa the basement sink for wartering/carwashing good exersise, but ya need 2 to balance the load. ===============================

Yeah, but one bucket works yer various abdominals (transverse) and obliques

*much* more effectively. Two buckets just loads the shit out of yer spine. But true, you are balanced.

One 5 gal bucket of water is just about 40 lbs. The buckets of dirt'n'shit I haul are 60 and 80 lbs. Thank god fer dollies. :)

"Machine yer way to better Abs", eh?

membership is free! their maybe some charter memebers still here!

You m,ight be right, I think for a touch-up it might be like 30 secs. been there done it. with my eye closed. simple is ALWAYS the best. My

7yr old niece could use this & get good results. ITS A DRILL NOT A JIG GRINDER

Ya Ya, mine exec/vp is sviss. so is my interapid, etalon

ya no the swiss&germans, they make good $$stuff$$,(vince sham-wow) Herrmann has 10 ultrasonic apps on the new Mercedes E class

anybody still use the drill protractor gauge? I do, be lost w/o it on big drills.

******* I do. I worked right next to a drill sharpener, and I'll admit, it was neat. But damn, if the drills aren't abused, it takes just a few seconds to dust em off in a pedastal grinder, check em with a protractor drill gage, drills perfect in just 10-20 seconds time invested. I would suggest no matter what you use, scrape the edge with a penny. It kinda hones the edge making the drill last forever. I think that's more important than spending 1500 bucks to sharpen a drill. And don't use cheap drills. A good set of latrobe's will never need sharpening. You could drill 1000 holes thru stainless in a good drill and it not need sharpened. If drill sharpening is a big part of your life and your not drilling titanium...???You might be a rednek. lol

On the Meteor grinders, you look down the microscope and line up the leading edge of the drill with some crosshairs.

Nobody ? using Deckel/Alexadria/Kulman single lip cutter grinder (my favorite machine in the whole wide world) with a drill sharpening attachment?

should'nt have sold that beauty on e-bay when the company closed back in 02. Needed the $

Once a place has one of these & know how to use it they'll never get rid of it. I beleive some of the fancier ones had opitics?

Man what the hell happened to all the 1:1 Deckel guys? & Kellers? Was this just a midwest thing? Before CNC's were so readily available, we traced 3D everything of off beautiful accurate wood models. Those duplicators were going out as I came into this now feascle trade.

Nobody ? using Deckel/Alexadria/Kulman single lip cutter grinder (my favorite machine in the whole wide world) with a drill sharpening attachment?

should'nt have sold that beauty on e-bay when the company closed back in 02. Needed the $

Once a place has one of these & know how to use it they'll never get rid of it. I beleive some of the fancier ones had opitics?

Man what the hell happened to all the 1:1 Deckel guys? & Kellers? Was this just a midwest thing? Before CNC's were so readily available, we traced 3D everything of off beautiful accurate wood models. Those duplicators were going out as I came into this now feascle trade.

a dekel post hidden in a drilling subject. shame.

I learned this from some "old school" tool & die makers......after regrinding...a stiff wire brush is your best friend. 1- it takes the burr off. 2- when done right, it gives a slight hone to the edge (were talking HSS here). A razor sharp edge is not your friend when drilling. I cannot count how many solid carbide drills I went thru learning that lesson. The slight hone tends to help create a chip.....a razor edge tends to grab....sucking the drill into the material ever so slightly. HSS drills are much more forgiving than carbide....much tougher. When you look at a new "quality" carbide drill (Mitsubishi, Titex, Guhrig, SGS....a long list) you can visibility see the hone.....almost what you would consider negative rake. Only a select few regrind shops that I have used actually do this. I do not know of a machine that does a hone to an edge....most if not all are done by hand. A few years back I had the chance to tour Sumitomos facility. All drill hones were done by hand by some Jap chick. Sumitomo makes one hell of a drill BTW

"Nobody ? using Deckel/Alexadria/Kulman single lip cutter grinder (my favorite machine in the whole wide world) with a drill sharpening attachment?"

I've got an SOE with all of that stuff. It's not much you know. I've also got a GK-21 with every attachment thst was built in the thirties.

JC

I tried a Darex SP2500 very briefly. The SP2500 replaced the Darex M5. It's basically the same thing as the M5 and works the same way. The biggest difference is that the ground drill particles stay inside the SP2500. The SP2500 still requires the same amount of tweaking as the M5 when you change drill sizes. I think the biggest advantage of the SP2500 is a sales thing... it looks easier to operate even thought it's not any easier than the M5 and it looks more advanced. The reality is that they both use the same chucks and the same concept. Personally I'd rather have the guts exposed rather than hidden.

Jon Banquer San Diego, CA

We have a SP2500 at work also.. other than occasionally cleaning and dressing the wheel, there is no tweaking needed between sizes or uses...Admittly, I rarely, if ever use it on anything less than 1/4" nor over 3?4" but within those sizes, it's done.

Your mileage may vary...keep your stick on the ice...offer void where prohibited.

Mike

I believe that I am the O.P. to which you are addressing your opinions, above.

Let me just say that I started on my apprenticeship in 1946 and one of the first things we had to learn was how to grind or sharpen tools. Apparently this is a common trend in the trade as I don't believe I have ever worked with a Machinist who couldn't sharpen his own tools.

The discussion of knowledge and perfection is simply ridiculous when talking about drilling. Drills are not designed as precision tools.

Drill faster? How much faster? Any trained individual can sharpen a drill.

Do you somehow believe in miracles? Buy this Super Deluxe Drill Grinder and somehow your drills will cut faster then the recommended cutting speed for the material? (If you do then I've got this bridge. Buy it and it will get you to the other side of the river in half the time).

It appears to me that you are really not a Machinist and know little about the trade. Of course anyone can be mistaken so how about correcting our misconceptions and posting where and when you served your apprenticeship as a machinist.

(my bet is that you are just a machine operator)

I got to use one a few times, that's a sweet machine. I did a small and simple cavity for a prototype mold. That was the first and only cavity I ever cut. Did my patterns at 10:1, and machined features that were all but impossible to see with the naked eye. Of course, any CNC could do that easily. But I love mechanical things, and it was just a joy to use and neat to see things come out so perfectly. Helped a lot btw, that I had a talented mold maker offering advice, I didn't figure out everything on that machine by myself.

In case I ever win the lotto, might yours be for sale?

Jon

LOL I doubt it. I've got a KF-1 fully outfitted that I'd probably part with. That one even has it's original ratio arm and scroll attachment. You ought to be able to find piles of these things for peanuts in the midwest.

JC

whadaya mean shame? its a deckel! The original moldmakers (glorified machinist) machine! W/O them & Kellers those guys back in the 50's & 60's & even 70's when I started, would have had a bitch of time making 3D stuff. The deckel I'm refering to is a cutter grinder, made to go along with the 1:1 duplicator for making SL cutters of any shape, taper,ball,bull, lolly pop, + rib cutters, square or hex, + "gun reamers"+ square "do drills" & sharpen bottom's of ends up to 5/8"! not to mention using it as a half ass cylindrical grinder/indexer for small pins & just a plain ol pedestal grinder for hand sharpening. Now thats a versatile machine! FYI there were 2 models of them. A big stand alone & a bench top model. I was just curious about the drill sharpening attachment for it? Some times those add ons are just a pain in the ass?

\|||/ (o o) ______.oOO-(_)-OOo.____________________ ~ Gil ~ the Deckel king?

The machines are not hard to come by, but collecting all the attachments would take a while unless one lucked out and found one fully outfitted.

Jon

ya they are in back corners of every mold old shop now days collecting dust. The really interesting attachment for the KF-1 was the mirror image attachment. Saved my ass a few times. IE:You could take an exsiting cavity & make an electrode for a new cavity! The GK21 is a smaller 3D pantagraph with ratio's from 1.5 - 10:1 So if your model is off .001" your traced piece is off .0001! at 10:1. The spindle had an rpm of 10k? easily rebuild able with standard ball bearings & races. Great for engraving. Jewelers have a similar type for their engraving, but not spindle, just a point *scratcher* But as this post is about, the drill sharpening attachment for the SO machine?

\|||/ (o o) ______.oOO-(_)-OOo.____________________ ~ Gil ~ the HOLDZEM=A9=AE king

"ya they are in back corners of every mold old shop now days collecting dust. The really interesting attachment for the KF-1 was the mirror image attachment."

I've also got the ratio bar attachment.

"The GK21 is a smaller 3D pantagraph with ratio's from 1.5 - 10:1"

1.4 : 1

"So if your model is off .001" your traced piece is off .0001! at 10:1. The spindle had an rpm of 10k? "

20K in the high range.

"easily rebuild able with standard ball bearings & races."

You can still get OEM parts from Germany.

"Great for engraving. Jewelers have a similar type for their engraving, but not spindle, just a point *scratcher*"

That's the GK-12

"But as this post is about, the drill sharpening attachment for the SO machine?"

I said I had an SOE, which is the larger one, with the attachment and microscope. You can buy a good used SO in California for about four thousand and a beater for twenty five hundred.

JC