Endmill Experiment

To All:
    I love comparative experiments, this is from a post in PM about a week ago by "StreetSpeed".
=============================================================http://www.practicalmachinist.com/vb/showthread.php?t9308
Aluminum Endmill Throwdown!! Destiny vs. Niagara vs. Gorilla vs. 2nd Shift Grinding
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Hey Folks,
So I had a large aluminum job (for me anyway) I was in the middle of so I decided I wanted to see what was out there that was gonna remove aluminum the quickest. The catch, is that I have 4 Haas VMCs at my shop, and while its nice that the big red sticker on the side says 20 HP theyre actually rated closer to 10(ish) for continuous usage. Itll put out 20hp for about 2 minutes, right before it explodes.
When Im buying endmills for a specific job, I tend to use Niagara. I get a good deal on them, and they seem to last awhile and perform better than most other tools. They also list speeds and feeds for tons of various materials, and theyre generally spot on and not inflated in order to simply sell more tools. Theyre also not exactly the cheapest tool out there, but you usually get what you pay for.
I ran the following .500 tools in 6061. .500 DOC, 95% step over, in a circular spiral pocketing cycle so the load meter would stay consistent and allow me to mess around. I adjusted the feed so that the load meter would stay consistent at 100%. Sure I coulda cranked it up to 150% or more, but I tend to try and keep things at 100%. Same tool holders, same gauge length. I was not at all concerned with tool life, so these werent long tests. I was simply trying to see which tool would make best use of my limited horsepower. I ran the tools at 2 speeds, and the lower speed yielded the best results. Love that Haas torque curve. Here are the results.
Niagara A345, TiCn Coating, $52 ea. ($69 list price) 10,000 RPM 78.6 ipm 7500 RPM 103 ipm MRR - 25.75 HP 6.4
Destiny Tools Viper, Stealth coating (Moly-S), $46 ea - 10,000 RPM 67.5 ipm 7500 RPM 89 ipm MRR- 22.25 ci/min HP 5.5 Bonus points awarded for coolest endmill name
Gorilla Silverback, ZrN coating, $45 ea - 10,000 RPM 94ipm 7500 RPM 121 ipm MRR - 30.25 ci/min HP 7.5 Bonus bling points for gold ZrN coating
2nd Shift Grinding, Unocoated, $39 ea. 10,000 RPM 62 ipm 7500 RPM 82 ipm MRR- 20.5 ci/min HP- 5.125
So there it is. In this case, Gorilla was the clear winner. Now if I actually had some power to play with, these tests may be completely different. The Niagara and Destiny tools make claims of .009 ipt for a full slot, where Gorilla makes no such claims. Highest I got was .0054 ipt with the Gorilla. Would the thing snap with a high chip load? I dont know, and at this point with my machines it doesnt much matter. But the Gorilla smoked the other tools hands down, its the cheapest, plus its a sexy gold color which the ladies love. Just perhaps something to consider next time youre looking for an efficient cutter for aluminum. Now, I have a Mazak salesman coming in an hour or so, so maybe before long Ill do these tests all over again on a REAL machine. ============================================================
--
BottleBob
http://home.earthlink.net/~bottlbob
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I could probably easily double his best - even on a HAAS. I didn't see anythng, however, regarding coolant.
JC
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John R. Carroll wrote:

John:
    With a rusty HSS single flute router bit, right? LOL
--
BottleBob
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Running backwards<G>
JC
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On Apr 23, 1:58am, "John R. Carroll"

======================================> >>>http://www.practicalmachinist.com/vb/showthread.php?t=179308

I've actually used square rib cutters running in reverse -work better- in graphite- I too have had excellent results with Gorilla. After ya brake'em, square off the shank end for the best single point fly cutter that cannot be bought.
\|||/ (o o) ______.oOO-(_)-OOo.____________________ ~ Gil ~ the HOLDZEM king
http://users.cin.net/~milgil/Mvc-234fa.jpg
like BB said <g> these damn things are everywhere! I think my plan is working? sending some out to an AMC guy in Florida today. FREE! but donations are accepted thru paypal. Got em in Europe, Australia, maybe Iraq next?
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So,,,, I gotta ask, 2 or 3 flute? Coolant type? Thru spindle coolant or flush type? Solid holder or ER, or shrink type? Would a coarse pitch rougher have the same type of results for sheer MRR?
Lots of variables to consider before making a clear and concise decision.
"D"
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We had a discussion here a while back where I described what it would take to get 400 IPM feed rates on a POS HAAS or FADAL. Not a bad thread all in all.
JC
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"I've actually used square rib cutters running in reverse -work better- in graphite-"
Me too but usually on Deckel's or as draft cutters.
"I too have had excellent results with Gorilla. After ya brake'em, square off the shank end for the best single point fly cutter that cannot be bought."
OK but before you break then you can swap them out, regrind and recoat them cheaply. That's what I do for worn ends.
JC
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Effing great stuff.
The moral being, you don't always get what you pay for.
In fact, if you read Consumer's Report, and plot prices vs "scores", you'll find that there is near-zero correlation between price and score, for many many things, cars and appliances in partic.
In fact, within some categories, you can find a ***negative correlation*** between price and score!!
How can that be??
From previous PV asssertions, that highly marketed shit products *necessarily* have to charge more, to cover the hyooge costs of marketing/advertising.
For example, you think those effing gecko/GEICO commercials are cheap??
GEICO is ***THE WORST*** insurance co on the planet. They will fuck you so hard, so fast, and so furiously, you'll have to pick a card to figger out which hole to shit from.
Inyway, seems that to some extent this zero correlation applies, even in machine stuff.
--

Mr. PV'd

Mae West (yer fav Congressman) to the Gangster (yer fav Lobbyist):
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BottleBob wrote:

Back in my aluminum sculpting days, I'd run Dataflute 1/2" dia w/ cnr .125r at .150" doc - 10k rpm x 250 ipm. Note: this is with 2.25" of stickout. For us that was the clincher: it was easy to run the shorter tools fast in almost any brand but we found the Dataflutes for longer stickouts. The types of parts required the longer tools for clearance.
-- Bill
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