The Latest on Amalgams and Thermoelectrics

One thing that my posts to sci.med.dentistry have achieved over the years is that the regular contributors to this newsgroup no longer
bother to assert that dissimilar metals in contact with each other need an electrolyte to be present in order for them to generate an electric current.
For the benefit of any newcomers who might still believe in this falsehood, an elementary description of the thermoelectric effect can be found at:
http://book.boot.users.btopenworld.com/thermo2.htm
The general principle is that when dissimilar metals are placed in contact with each other and the points of contact are at different temperatures an electrical current flows, and the current continues to flow for as long as the temperature difference is maintained. (Remember that a typical dental amalgam is an inhomogeneous mixture of dissimilar metals in its own right - and that it has been common practice for dentists to screw metal alloy retaining pins into the root sockets of patients' teeth and encase the heads of the pins in amalgam.)
The important thing to remember is that this effect occurs without any electrolysis taking place. There is no "electrochemistry" occurring at all. There isn't any requirement for an "electrolyte" to be present. It is entirely a thermoelectric effect.
Anyway, the latest news is that Professor L I Anatychuk of the Institute of Thermoelectricity in the Ukraine, one of the world's greatest living authorities on thermoelectric phenomena, believes that the thermoelectric behavior of a piece of metal is enough on its own to stimulate neurological synapses in animal tissue. (See: "Seebeck or Volta?", L.I.Anatychuk, Journal of Thermoelectricity, No.1, 1994)
However, in spite of this it appears that there isn't anyone anywhwre in the world who knows what the thermoelectric properties of metal dental restorations are.
Attached below is a series of entreaties which have been submitted to the website of the International Thermoelctric Society on this topic - so far without any comment or contestation in return.
I thought that newsgroup members might be interested to read them.
Keith P Walsh
**************************************************************** Academician, Professor L. Anatychuk from Ukraine, scientist, engineer, the author of books and scientific works, editor of "Journal of Thermoelectricity", organizer and President of the International Thermoelectric Academy is well known to thermoelectric community.
On July 15 Dr. Anatychuk celebrates his 70-th jubilee and 50-th anniversary of scientific and pedagogical activity in the field of thermoelectricity.
On the eve of this glorious jubilee, President of Ukraine Viktor Yuschenko awarded Dr. L.Anatychuk with the Order "For Meritorious Service" of first degree. A Decree on this deed of esteem has been officially announced on the site of President of Ukraine http://www.president.gov.ua
Dr. L.I. Anatychuk had been already awarded with 4 Orders, among them 2 Orders "For Meritorious Service" of second and third degree. Now by the Decree of President Yuschenko the two Orders "For Meritorious Service" have been supplemented by the Order "For Meritorious Service" of first degree. Thus, Dr. Anatychuk becomes full holder of three Orders "For Meritorious Service". In the Decree it is noted that these awards are for the "achievements in science, technology and education".
Congratulations to Dr. L.I.Anatychuk! Well done!
E-mail of the hero of anniversary snipped-for-privacy@inst.cv.ua .
The upcoming events on the occasion of the jubilee festivities and International Forum on Thermoelectricity on July 15 -19, 2007 in Chernivtsi, Ukraine, will be highlighted in further zts.com news.
-- O. Luste, snipped-for-privacy@inst.cv.ua
580 reads report as spam Has the esteemed Professor Submitted by kpw on Thu, 2007-08-23 07:11. Has the esteemed Professor Anatychuk ever measured the thermoelectric properties of the inhomogeneous mixtures of dissimilar metals commonly used in restorative dentistry?
Or does he just guess 'em like everyone else?
Keith P Walsh

edit reply report as spam A few years ago the Submitted by kpw on Tue, 2007-09-11 12:26. A few years ago the organisation "Health Canada" issued the following statement via the website of the Canadian Dental Association regarding the placement of metal amalgam dental fillings:
"It should be noted that Health Canada has taken the position that new amalgam fillings should not be placed in contact with existing metal devices in the mouth"
I wrote to the Canadian Dental Association regarding this statement with the following query:
"Is this recommendation intended to apply to metal alloy retaining pins screwed into the root sockets of a patient's tooth?"
And I received the following reply from Dr Philip Neufeld of Health Canada:
"Dear Mr. Walsh:
Health Canada's position statement on amalgam recommended against placing amalgam fillings in patients who have existing metal devices because this results in having dissimilar metals in the mouth. Dissimilar metals set up galvanic currents which can cause two problems. First, they accelerate the corrosion of the amalgam. This leads to pitting, crevice formation, and marginal leaks, shortening the life of the filling. The corrosion also increases the rate of mercury vapour release.
Second, galvanic currents can cause a tingling sensation or a metallic taste in the mouth which are annoying to the patient. Sometimes the currents can cause inflammation or sores on the gums, tongue or the inside of the cheek in contact with the metals.
However, it is unlikely that a metal retaining pin implanted into the tooth or the jaw bone would cause galvanic currents. In order for galvanic currents to be created, the pin would have to be in contact with an electrolyte such as saliva or extracellular fluids, and such retaining pins are usually not exposed. Health Canada recognizes that although it is preferable to avoid dissimilar metals in the mouth, there may be situations where there is no practical alternative. Dental practitioners are therefore expected to take these factors into consideration in making decisions on treatment.
Yours sincerely,
Philip Neufeld, Ph.D."
This left me with the distinct impression that Dr Neufeld was being completely negligent of any possible thermoelectric effects.
Not only is dental amalgam an inhomogeneous mixture of dissimilar metals in its own right, but our knowledge of thermoelectric effects tells us that, in addition to any thermoelectric activity which might arise from temperature gradients in the amalgam itself, any arrangement whereby an amalgam filling is placed in contact with a metal retaining pin screwed into a patient's tooth might also be reasonably expected to provide further potential for the generation of thermoelectric emf and eddy currents along the contours of the interface between the amalgam and the retaining pin.
But as we have seen, it appears that dentists in Canada are totally ignorant of any thermoelectric behavior that such dental restorations may produce.
Are dentists in other countries any less ignorant?
Well maybe not.
Self-styled "dentist to the stars" Philip Wander of Manchester in England, who specialises in the removal of amalgams, at least warns of the problems which can arise as a result of the electrical potentials generated by amalgam dental restorations:
"Nevertheless, as potentially damaging as mercury in the mouth is the

have seen momentary sparks of up to one volt - enough to light a small torch or flashlight. It's worth remembering that the currents generated by amalgams are formed very close to the brain, which ordinarily operated at far lower potentials (only a few millivolts). The brain lies only a few millietres from the jaw bone, where the roots of the teeth are inserted, just on the other side of the thin cranial bone and the meninges (the three membranes enveloping the brain and spinal cord). This kind of current can cause mental dysfunction, which I often find in clinical practice."
See:
http://www.wanderdental.co.uk/mercuryfreedentistry.html
However I suspect that even he wouldn't know the extent to which the voltages he talks about are generated by thermoelectric phenomena.
Interestingly though, one of Dr Wander's celebrity patients appears to have been Ukrainian soccer star Andrei Kanchelskis. More amazingly, if you search Dr Wander's website you will discover that Kanchelskis even brought his own mother-in-law over to England from the Ukraine to have her teeth sorted out too.
It appears that dentists in the Ukraine may be just as ignorant as those in Canada.
What's the point of a country having the world's greatest authority on the science of thermoelectricity if the dentists in that country are still totally clueless as to the thermoelectric behavior of the inhomogeneous mixtures of dissimilar metals that they place in their patients' mouths?
I'd say that if Professor Anatychuk could redress this ignorance then perhaps he really would deserve a medal!
Keith P Walsh

edit reply report as spam Thermoelectricians, It Submitted by kpw on Fri, 2007-09-28 07:34. Thermoelectricians,
It appears that there isn't anyone anywhere in the world who knows what the thermoelectric properties of a typical dental amalgam are.
And amalagam fillings are placed in children's teeth.
It's idiotic.
If it turned out that the thermoelectric potentials generated by amalgam dental fillings are large enough to dissipate electrical energy through the nerves in people's heads, then the reputation of every thermoelectrician in the world, including that of Professor L. I. Anatychuk, would not be worth a fig.
Perhaps this explains why it appears that there isn't anyone anywhere in the world who knows what the thermoelectric properties of a typical dental amalgam are.
Keith P Walsh

edit reply report as spam Old Professor Anatychuk Submitted by kpw on Thu, 2007-11-22 09:27. Old Professor Anatychuk appears to believe that the thermoelectric behavior of a piece of metal is able to stimulate neurological synapses in animal tissue (see "Seebeck or Volta?", L.I.Anatychuk., Journal of Thermoelectricity, No.1, 1994)
Of course, there are no muscles which might be caused to jump in the upper and lower mandibles of the human head. However there are sensitive organs nearby.
It makes me wonder whether people with metal fillings in their teeth ever complain of ringing in their ears?
And if they do, do any of them refuse to believe that their condition was caused by listening to loud rock music?
Well, it appears that the painter Vincent van Gogh complained quite desperately of ringing in his ears. Of course, no-one told him he was suffering from "tinnitus", because they hadn't thought of a name for this condition back then. They just told him he was crazy.
One thing's for certain, Vincent van Gogh never attended a Led Zeppelin show. Although apparently he did have rather bad teeth.
You know, the widespread adoption of metal amalgams for use in restorative dentistry was quickly followed by the rise to promonence of psychiatric "medicine" in our societies. And presumed "explanations" such as "manic depression" or "schizophrenia" are not explanations at all. Like "tinnitus", they are simply terms which have been used to describe particular groups of symptoms.
So come on thermoelectricians. Measure the thermoelectric behavior of metal amalgam dental fillings. You never know, members of the dental profession might be most grateful (but I suspect only if you can tell them what they would wish to hear - otherwise they might prefer that you keep it to yourselves).
And you might even be confirming the great Professor Anatychuk's theories.
Keith P Walsh
PS, a typical dental amalgam is an inhomogeneous mixture of dissimilar metals in its own right (see: http://book.boot.users.btopenworld.com/setting.htm )
Not only that, but it has been common practice for dentists to screw metal alloy retaining pins into the root sockets of their patients' teeth and encase the heads of the pins in metal amalgams.
However, in spite of these facts it appears that there isn't anyone anywhere in the world who knows what the thermoelectric behaviors of metal dental restorations are.
It's idiotic.

edit reply report as spam One last thing. If you go Submitted by kpw on Sun, 2007-11-25 08:29. One last thing.
If you go to:
http://book.boot.users.btopenworld.com/intro.htm
- you will find a series of letters asking questions about the electrical behavior of metal dental restorations in which the writer clearly recognises the link between the thermoelectric effect and Alessandro Volta's frog's leg experiment. (It was actually Luigi Galvani who demonstrated the frog's leg effect first, but he made the unforgiveable mistake of suggesting a wrong explanation for it, so his contribution is often dismissed - in much the same way that Thomas Johann Seebeck's contribution in stumbling across the Seebeck effect is also dismissed by some people.)
These letters were all written in 1992, more than a year before the publication of Professor Anatychuk's paper, "Seebeck or Volta?", in the Journal of Thermoelectricity.
Of course, I'm not suggesting that the Ukrainian government is giving its award to the wrong person.
But I wonder who wrote those letters?
Any guesses?
Keith P Walsh

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Keith P Walsh wrote: <snip>

<snip>
Keith, If you want to know what the thermoelectric properties of metal dental restorations are, then purchase some dental amalgam material, fabricate some test samples, build a test fixture, rent some electrical equipment, and run some tests.
You could have had your answer ten years ago if you had just gotten off your lazy butt and ran your own experiments...
We look forward to reading your results.
--

Paul D Oosterhout
I work for SAIC (but I don't speak for SAIC)
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Same old head in the sand.
How can you be so complacent about your own ignorance?
Keith P Walsh
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oups.com:

How are the dissimilar metals in Amalgams at different temperatures?
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Greggie Gibson wrote:

There could be (and usually is) a temperature gradient across a dental filling -- or pretty much anything else. Only a few things like the contents of a Thermos bottle that hasn't been opened recently would be at a uniform temperature.
That said, Walsh is clearly delusional with regard to his dental amalgam theory. His theory could be adequately tested by simple experiments, yet he seems to have no interest in performing these experiments, even though he has been offered assistance in designing these experiments by experts in sci newsgroups. No, he'd just prefer to beat his well-worn drum.
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Electrical current with the power to destroy Two dissimilar metals in a saliva environment will produce electrical current by galvanic action, and become a battery of sorts. The five metals frequently found in most amalgam formulations produce an even more complex battery. The electrical currents produced by amalgam are far greater in magnitude than the sensitive electrical currents the brain operates on, and are far greater than the current that activates acupuncture meridians.
These abnormal electrical currents can cause or contribute to a wide variety of symptoms and disease. Amalgam removal in patients who have conditions related to galvanic electrical generation sometimes produces almost immediate improvements.
= Electrical potentials of restorations in subjects without oral complaints.
Muller AW, Van Loon LA, Davidson CL.
Department of Dental Materials Science, Faculty of Dentistry, University of Amsterdam, The Netherlands.
The electrical potentials of 183 amalgam and 11 precious metal restorations, and one set of brackets, were measured. None of the 28 subjects had galvanism, leukoplakia, oral lichen planus, or toxic or allergic reactions to restorations. The potentials of the amalgam restorations increased with age, from about -350 mV NHE at 30 days, to about +100 mV NHE after more than 1000 days. In most subjects potential differences of more than 50 mV were present between restorations; this phenomenon is therefore assumed to be common in healthy populations.
MeSH Terms: Corrosion Crowns Dental Amalgam/chemistry* Dental Restoration, Permanent* Denture, Partial* Electric Conductivity Electrodes Electrophysiology Gold Alloys/chemistry* Human Mouth/physiology Orthodontic Appliances Time Factors Substances: Dental Amalgam Gold Alloys PMID: 2231160 [PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE]
******Consider : the central and peripheral nervous systems function onelectricity, even cellular metabolism functions on electricity - this meansthat all central and peripheral nervous system activity and cellular metabolismwill be affected by the batteries and electric currents in your mouth. Scienceto date has not investigated this area very much, but there are notions that ifthe current is over 3 microamperes or 100 millivolts, then treatment isrecommended. My wholistic sense tells me that any microamperes or millivoltsare bad news. There has been some research on patients with symptoms of Bell'spalsy, tinnitus, vision disturbance, chronic headaches, trigeminal neuralgia,idiopathic neuromuscular pathologies of head and neck, bruxism and severedepression. When the amalgam was removed the abnormal electrical potentialwithin the dental restoration was no longer negatively influencing the nerve.The nerve returned to its normal state and the symptoms went away. It's prettybad already but let's add computers, mobile phones, overhead power cables,microwave ovens and fridges - an assortment of sources of electro-magneticwaves which assault our bodies. If we are already 'live' then these things willadd a sort of induced voltage, upping the amount of electrical disturbance bysome unknown factor.*******
= http://www.wholisticresearch.com/info/artshow.php3?artid
Finally there are the galvanic currents. Galvanic currents are electrical charges originating in the metal fillings - heavy metal (mercury) and salt water (saliva) equals a battery, so that each amalgam filled tooth produces a small current of electricity. This current can be measured in millivolts or microamperes. Several fillings mean that the mouth becomes 'live' with electrical voltages. These voltages establish circuits which are constant and a person lives with them and does not notice them - except! - chew some silver paper and see what happens! The silver paper disrupts the established circuits and new circuits are rapidly formed, broken and reformed and discomfort is experienced. The pain from biting on a filling with silver paper is an electric shock.
Many people experience static electricity problems and it is commonly assumed that the current jumps from the car/filing cabinet/etc to the person but it actually happens the other way around - the teeth batteries produce the current which builds in the body and goes to ground on contact with a good conductor, jolting the body. In my experience everyone who suffers with problems with static electricity finds that after the amalgams are removed this problem goes away completely. So, what's a little static jolt now and again, other than a little nuisance?
Consider : the body is 70% water which is a good conductor of electricity, this means that the electrical disturbance originating in the mouth is dispersed throughout the entire body.
Consider : the central and peripheral nervous systems function on electricity, even cellular metabolism functions on electricity - this means that all central and peripheral nervous system activity and cellular metabolism will be affected by the batteries and electric currents in your mouth. Science to date has not investigated this area very much, but there are notions that if the current is over 3 microamperes or 100 millivolts, then treatment is recommended. My wholistic sense tells me that any microamperes or millivolts are bad news. There has been some research on patients with symptoms of Bell's palsy, tinnitus, vision disturbance, chronic headaches, trigeminal neuralgia, idiopathic neuromuscular pathologies of head and neck, bruxism and severe depression. When the amalgam was removed the abnormal electrical potential within the dental restoration was no longer negatively influencing the nerve. The nerve returned to its normal state and the symptoms went away. It's pretty bad already but let's add computers, mobile phones, overhead power cables, microwave ovens and fridges - an assortment of sources of electro-magnetic waves which assault our bodies. If we are already 'live' then these things will add a sort of induced voltage, upping the amount of electrical disturbance by some unknown factor.
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To make a battery, the dissimilar metals have to be contiguous. That isn't going to happen in an amalgam.
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Mark Thorson wrote:

pud
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wrote:
in

Greggie,
Thank you for your question.
In Nature temperature difference is ubiquitous.
A good example of how a temperature difference can occur across a metal dental filling is when someone bites into ice-cream.
Human body temperature is 37 degrees celsius, and ice-cream is usually at a temperature of around 0 degrees celsius when it is eaten. So in this circumstance a temperature difference of around 37 degrees celsius will immediately occur across the filling.
If you go to:
http://www.elektrotechnik.hs-magdeburg.de/Mitarbeiter/hinken/news/N6.htm
- you will see a graphical representation of the thermoelectric eddy current and associated electromagnetic field which are generated whenever an element of one electrical conductor is completely encased within another and subjected to a thermal gradient (figure d is particularly instructive).
Now, a typical dental amalgam may be accurately described as an inhomogeneous mixture of dissimilar metals in which a great many elements of one electrically conductive material are all completely enclosed within a matrix of another, dissimilar, electrically conductive material. See:
http://book.boot.users.btopenworld.com/setting.htm
So, according to the scientific principle established above, when a temperature difference is established across an amalgam dental filling then thermoelectric eddy currents MUST flow around the "unreacted" alloy inclusions in the amalgam.
As far as I know, experiments to determine whether or not the associated electromagnetic fields can be detected outside the surface of the fillings have not been carried out. (And if Mark Thorson tells you he has offered to buy me the equipment necessary to do this myself don't believe him - he hasn't.)
Do you think it's possible that these electromagnetic fields are in fact detected by the nerves in peoples' heads?
And have you ever heard of an "ice-cream headache"? I have, and I didn't make it up myself.
Best regards,
Keith P Walsh
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So what does this mean? How would/could this affect a persons health?

Your brain is electrifying and amalgams is metal... Mercury in amalgams is a great conductor of electricity.
This is interesting.

AKA brain freeze!

in
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Thank you for your question too.
Forgive me for answering it by asking you one.
It has been demonstrated experimentally that metal amalgam dental fillings generate electrical potentials with magnitudes up to 350 millivolts, see:
http://book.boot.users.btopenworld.com/dutch.htm
And the resting potential of the human neurological synapse is only 70 millivolts.
Of course, there are no muscles in the upper and lower mandibles of the human head which might be caused to jump. However there are sensitive organs nearby.
It makes me wonder whether people with metal fillings in their teeth ever complain of ringing in their ears?
And if they do, do any of them refuse to accept that their condition was caused by listening to loud rock music?
Well, it appears that the painter Vincent van Gogh complained quite desperately of ringing in his ears. Of course, no-one told him he was suffering from "tinnitus", because they hadn't thought of a name for this condition back then. They just told him he was crazy.
One thing's for certain, Vincent van Gogh never attended a Led Zeppelin show. Although apparently he did have rather bad teeth.
The widespread adoption of metal amalgams for use in restorative dentistry was quickly followed by the rise to prominence of psychiatric "medicine" in our societies. And presumed "explanations" such as "manic depression" or "schizophrenia" are not explanations at all. Like "tinnitus", they are simply terms which have been used to denote particular sets of symptoms.
How do you think anyone would know that the real cause of problems such as these is not the dissipation of electrical energy through the nerves in people's heads by the amalgam fillings in their teeth?
Keith P Walsh
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On Tue, 4 Dec 2007 11:48:52 -0800 (PST), Keith P Walsh

the best response to Mr Walsh's ravings is stil:
Organization: The Noble Krell Subject: Re: 40,000 V vs. 350 mV Date: Wed, 21 Sep 2005 15:44:25 -0700
Walsh - you are a spamming trolling idiot with a psychotic dental amalgam fixation. Have all your teeth pulled, shove them up your ass individually or in groups, then FOaD.
--
Uncle Al
http://www.mazepath.com/uncleal /
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When it comes to understanding the thermoelectric properties of dental amalgams Uncle Al is just as ignorant as you or anyone else.
On the other hand, Professor L I Anatychuk of the Institute of Thermoelectricity in the Ukraine appears to believe that the thermoelectric behavior of a piece of metal is enough on its own to stimulate neurological synapses in animal tissue. (See: "Seebeck or Volta?", L.I.Anatychuk, Journal of Thermoelectricity, No.1, 1994)
Would you disagree with him?
And if so, on what grounds?
Keith P Walsh
PS, a rational and scientific response would be appreciated.
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On Tue, 4 Dec 2007 22:42:03 -0800 (PST), Keith P Walsh

Ignorance is not the case with you is it Walsh. You are at the base of it all just a spamming troll, surfacing every few months to unleash your dental amalgam ravings on several NG's.

Rational scientific responses just don't cut it with you do they Keith. If there was anything rational or scientific about you, you would have long long ago (how long have you been posting your ravings?) taken the advice of so many here and you would have either done the experiments yourself or would have hooked up with someone capable.
Alas that is not your goal is it you spamming troll. No it is only to create a stir here amongst the new and uninitiated.
What was your favorite posting of a few years ago?
..and they continue to put mercury in children's mouths ...
It seems that mercury long ago got into your blood stream and has been affecting you all these years.
M.A. Sonjariv
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However there are

Mainly your brain-stem.
Somethings that can be caused by your brain-stem not working properly
Diseases of the brain-stem can result to abnormalities in the function of cranial nerves, which may lead to visual disturbances, pupil abnormalities, changes in sensation, muscle weakness, hearing problems, vertigo, swallowing and speech difficulty, voice change, and co-ordination problems. Also your heart and breathing.

By removing the amalgams and chelating afterwards the residue of heavy metals, if the symptoms disappeared you have your cure!
Donna

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Has this been tested? A filling is both very small in relation to a mouthful of ice-cream and is also embedded in a tooth.

magdeburg.de/Mitarbeiter/hinken
That's cool but it's an idealized computer model. What happens when you have literally hundreds if not thousands of encased bits of metal and also they are not totally encased but also exposed to the exterior of the encasing metal?

But that isn't really the case. Imagine that one of the metals in the amalgam is represented by black beans and the other by white beans. When you put it together you don't get gray beans but a random and inhomogenous mixture that is NOT enclosed within the matrix.
See:

But as there are so many places where the temperature difference can happen and there is an equal chance that half of the bits causing eddy currents will have opposite charges, there is an equal and likely chance that the net thermoelectric eddy currents will be zero.

Well of course you should do the experiments or pay to have them done, but I don't see how this inhomogenous mixture can create anything but a zero eddy current.

I don't think it's likely that these electromagnetic fields are in fact detected by nerves.
But here's one for you. Scientists are rebuilding coral reefs by the application of continuos low voltage to the reefs. Seems to me you have an analagous situation here and that if indeed the amalgam was generating any current at all, it would be helping to rebuild the tooth.
In addition, the long term application of a low voltage eddy current would have the net effect of deteriorating the filling and depositing material in the tooth cavity. Are there any published reports of fillings that are removed having any pitting action, or the cavities being coated with some metallic residue?

Yes I have and it has nothing to do with eddy currents, but if you get one, stick your thumb in the middle of your forehead and push hard. This works.

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wrote:

Zero eh?
Can you think of an experimental procedure which might be carried out in order to confirm this?
The principle of thermoelectric eddy current is used to identify inclusions of dissimilar metals in metal objects.
The object is subjected to a temperature difference and the electromagnetic fields generated by any thermoelectric eddy currents arising within the material are detected by sensitive measuring instruments placed at the surface.
I'd say that if a piece of dental amalgam was subjected to a thermal gradient, and the most sensitive instrument available was unable to detect any electromagnetic effect at the surface of the amalgam, then this would tend to suggest that you are right.
Wouldn't you agree?
Keith P Walsh
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wrote in

Yes
which is slightly different than an amalgam

Then whoever is doing this should be able to take a typical filling and subject it to the same test and give you a definitve result.

Absolutely
Absolutely. Of course you are overstating the temperature gradient possible in a mouth. Plus the fact that teeth are especially good conductors...and how does a filling "touch" a nerve?

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On Dec 6, 6:02 am, "It's all a bit strange"

OK now we've come to the most important point, are you ready?
It takes a bit of intelligence to grasp it, but I reckon if you take a deep breath and think very carefully you'll get it.
It's this -
It should be neither necessary nor possible for you and I to be speculating about the result of this experiment.
Why is that?
Well it's because this experiment should already have been carried out, and the results should be readily available to us.
And why is that??
Well that's because metal amalgam dental fillings are placed in children's teeth - that's why.
You see it shouldn't be possible for either you or I to think of any experiment to measure any aspect of the electrical behavior of metal dental restorations which has not already been carried out.
Do you get it?
I'd be interested to hear your reaction.
Remember, if you want to be a scientist you have to give a scientific answer. You are not allowed to simply make up excuses for your own ignorance.
There is a gap in our scientific knowledge of the world which is represented by a complete ignorance of the thermoelectric behavior of metal dental restorations.
Some people think that this gap is a pin-hole which can be safely ignored. But it isn't, it's a gaping chasm into which the well-being of countless thousands of dentists' patients has been discarded over the last two centuries. At least, neither you nor any other member of this newsgroup can say that it isn't, because the experimental investigations necessary to make that judgement have never been carried out. Well at least they don't appear to have been - the only alternative is that they have and the results have not been made available. Can you suggest why that should be?
I think I can.
Keith P Walsh
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Keith P Walsh wrote: <snip>

Keith, Nobody wants to do the experiments because most people (myself included) do not expect to find anything interesting. It is my contention that an amalgam of electrically conductive metals will make a very poor thermoelectric battery because it has numerous internal electrical short circuits running all through it.
But thats just my opinion. I don't have any experimental evidence to support my contention.
Now if I was really passionate about the health of children, I wouldn't want a group of biased, industry-funded researchers to work on this problem. They would probably just bias their report and to sweep the whole issue under the rug.
Instead, I would undertake this noble work myself! And I wouldn't let anyone stop me until I had the answer!
--

Paul D Oosterhout
I work for SAIC (but I don't speak for SAIC)
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