Clausing drill press followup

Lloyd E. Sponenburgh <lloydspinsidemindspring.com> wrote:


I checked the docs on the their compound slide and yeah, it doesn't have enough travel to cut a taper 2-1/2" long. boo. The head can be offset, but the tailstock can't move with it, so turning with one center isn't possible at weird angles. The old timers on youtube always do a final tuning and fit with a sharpie to make sure the fit is good.
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On Wednesday, March 4, 2015 at 6:08:07 PM UTC-5, Cydrome Leader wrote:

t

I would buy an arbor for the Clausing DP. That said, an unhardened arbor w ill work just fine. And you can make one. I made an arbor for a Jacobs sm all ball bearing chuck for use in my lathe. It is a bit longer than what y ou can buy. You can make the taper by cutting two diameters separated by t he right amount. Then just remove most of what needs to be removed with th e lathe. And then use a file while the piece is turning. Use some blue an d check it with the chuck to see where it is touching and then use the file some more. It isn't a fast way to do it, but it can be done. Do it betwe en centers.
Dan
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On Wed, 4 Mar 2015 22:13:13 +0000 (UTC), Cydrome Leader

How does your Sherline do with the tailstock set over that far? I'd think you were pushing it, unless you have a very good taper attachment.
Here's a soft, blank Morse taper arbor:
http://www.collistoolholder.com/cgi-bin/parts.cgi?typ ÊT_9_TYP_I
--
Ed Huntress

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Test your idea on a tapered arbor with a dial indicator in the toolpost. It ain't easy.
I have similar sizes of Albrecht and Jacobs Ball-Bearing chucks, and prefer the Jacobs.
-jsw
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    [ ... ]

    [ ... ]

    As I read it above, he is trying to get the arbor (remains) out of the chuck, not the spindle.

    He will probably find that quite useful, once he has the stub out of the chuck,
    Enjoy,         DoN.
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Correct. The spindle seems ok at this point, and separate from the chuck. Not having access to some rather basic tools in the right place for this sort of work is making thinks take some time.
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On Thu, 5 Mar 2015 21:02:59 +0000 (UTC), Cydrome Leader

see http://tinyurl.com/mobjnc7 wedges bottom of page
and http://tinyurl.com/kezd47a
most local mill supply stores should carry these as well as Enco, Wholesale Tool, Travers, etc.
--
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I think I've finished up with the chuck. It was packed with horrible green grease, everywhere which I removed. The part the jaws slide up and down on had some damage so I filed and stoned that down and they stopped binding and I was then able to test runout by tossing a piece of ground rod in my lathe and then having the chuck clamp down on that. I tested runout with an indicator running on the inside tape of the chuck body.
It was pretty bad. Ordered new jaws and the part that they slide around on and it appears the jaws are what mostly fixed that. There appears to still be several thousandths of runout, but the lathe chuck is a bit off too, so whatever for now.
New bearings should arrive tomorrow.
tests of the spindle itself, sitting on V-blocks show it isn't bent between where the bearings are. The runout there is barely 1 thousandth and once the bearings are preloaded, it going to be about zero is my guess.
The fat part of the spindle with the taper is different with around 5 thousandths rounout at one point as measure from the far end of OD, not the taper. This number was much higher with the old arbor installed indicating that a slightly bent arbor can really flex the spindle. I'll check real runout once I get a new arbor.
There are traces somebody has been here before I was, as the locking collar that puts a preload on the bearings was installed backwards and it looks like somebody took a torch to some parts of the spindle. Maybe to heat straighten it in the past?
The plan is to locate a couple outlets and combine them into a three phase run back to the breaker box. There appears to be dedicated outlets in my space that once ran computers so I hope this can be pullled off without running even more conduit in the ceilings. It's a bit busy up there to start with. A safety disconnect from ebay arrived, complete with somebody's lockout. Need to get some ~5 amp (a check on fusing an old 3/4HP, 3Ph 208 volt motors shows values around there) slow blow cartridge fuses and a used (aka cheap) 3 phase breaker that part will be set.
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Y'know... tapers being tapers, a few light whacks from the SIDE might just loosen that up enough to come out. If I were doing it, I wouldn't bang on it hard for fear of damaging the socket in the chuck, but I would give it a number of smart taps from all directions (and quite close to the chuck body) -- THEN try to extract it.
Ummm... You HAVE made sure there's not a retaining screw INSIDE the chuck holding that sucker in... yes? It's not common in taper-mounted chucks, but I've seen it.
LLoyd
LLoyd
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On Thu, 05 Mar 2015 18:39:21 -0600, "Lloyd E. Sponenburgh"

Having another hammer opposite the strike/against the back of the spindle will help counteract the hammer hit (saving the bearings) and make it more effective.

Good question. That's thinking "inside the chuck". <groan>
--
Stain and poly are their own punishment.

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It's OUT of the spindle. He's trying to get the taper out of the chuck.
Lloyd
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On Fri, 06 Mar 2015 05:35:36 -0600, "Lloyd E. Sponenburgh"

OK, I hadn't been following it from the start. The point I was trying to make is that a firm backup makes sure the strike is effective.
Heat & Freeze to break the connection?
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Larry Jaques wrote:

with what ya got . Cydrome , is this the drill press that had a bunch of runout ? Maybe caused by using the wrong taper on the spindle end of the mandrel , from a mention above about Clausing tapers ...
--
Snag



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A Brown & Sharpe #7 taper is almost identical to Morse #2.
-jsw
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Lloyd E. Sponenburgh <lloydspinsidemindspring.com> wrote:

I finally got it apart, will post photos later on. There were a few surprises.
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Hooray -- and, there almost always are 'surprises' when something doesn't come apart as it should <G>.
LLoyd
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I don't have time to post the photos yet, but here's what happened.
The oversized 3/8" hole I put though the Jacobs 33 side or the arbor that was sawed off the Morse side finally popped off with two 2 wrenches, a 7/16-14 grade 8 bolt and nut. I held the bolt and chuck body stationary a wrench and a clamp and then torqued the nut clockwise over a stack of washers. Had to really lay into it but it made a popping sound then still had to be turned more to get it out. I used a nut and bolt to keep most of the torque between the two wrenches. The only torque on the chuck was from friction between the nut and washer stack. That all got a touch of lithium grease.
The Jacobs side of the otherwise unhardened arbor was apparently ground and hardened, to a surpringly nice finish. The inside of the chuck body also had a perfect finished although it was blue/black in color like it was somehow tempered like a file handle. There was no signs it ever spun out, or anything else was heated. There is no damage of any type inside that taper that I can see.
The amount the arbor stub sticks out when hand pressed back into the chuck is 3/32" further out than when it was fully jammed into place. I have no idea how it was pushed in there so far, but it was. Hell, maybe that's why the entire thing ended up sort of bent in the first place.
I removed the quill and it seems one bearing has a tight spot, so I took all of that apart. It took a bit of light hammering and heat (to melt the old grease) to get the spindle and bearings apart. Will order new bearings, they're Fafnir 202KDD5, which is apparently really common in old drill presses and have a 5/8" bore and metric OD. Yeah- they're really metric OD with an inch bore. I can't figure out what the 5 at the end of part number is, but there are exact Fafnir replacements out there for about $15 each.
The spindle does have some weirdness, but I'll continue that tomorrow.
thank for all the tips.
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That combination of metric vs. imperial is common-enough. I haven't looked up the Fafnir numbers, but the 5 is probably the 'precision number' of the bearing.
LLoyd
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wrote:

Probably not the grade. More likely it designates an inch bore in an otherwise metric bearing. A 202KDD (no 5 suffix) is 15x35x11 mm.

Definitely not a material spec. DD on this bearing means "2 shields."

--
Ned Simmons

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At lease for this series, the 200k ones, DD is two shields, like ZZ these days. I did locate some Fafnir part number decoders, but there was no mention of what may be grades for this series.
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