Disassembling a leaded cast iron pumbing joint?

snipped-for-privacy@c3net.net fired this volley in news:1187353010.771327.257170 @r34g2000hsd.googlegroups.com:

The stub pipe isn't "bonded", but is tightly shrink-fit by the lead grommet.

Cutting from the inside, punching with a punch or cold chisel from the outside, crushing, and wiggling are all used to get a leaded joint loose.

Heat may or may not be your friend, depending upon the mechanical abuse the Y coupling has put up with in the past. It might crack. You shouldn't apply as much heat as necessary to melt the lead outright, but you can plunge a red hot rod down through the grommet to give yourself a weak spot for some looseness and freedom of motion.

Ordinarily, I'd expect some careful wiggling of the stub to loosen the grommet from the flange, allowing the stub to come out with the leading still intact on it. If you're afraid to do that, use a sawzall to make two or three cuts vertically, and remove the piece in three pieces.

You'll still end up having to deform the lead to get it out of the flange.

(it seems like this would be a great job for a plasma cutter. You could both melt and blow away the liquid lead in one operation. never tried it, though)

LLoyd

Old cast iron pipes can rot, so to speak. I won't get into a horrible experience I had with rotten cast iron. The point is, be careful with it, although the thickness of the hubs should keep you safe. Just don't be pounding on anything with a 3# sledge.

I would try getting the lead out by drilling a bunch of holes in it. IIRC, it's only about an inch deep, with the oakum caulking under it. You could pretty much drill all the lead out faster than making one cut with the sawzall. The problem with the sawzall is finishing the cut down where the stub meets the hub.

I like Lloyd's idea of red-hot rod to melt lead. Use to finish off after drilling, if necessary.

HTH, Bob

Maybe drill a small pilot hole in the lead, screw in the screw from a dent-puller (slide-hammer), and pull out a chunck of the lead/oakum?

If you can get the threads to bite into the oakum, you might pull the whole ring out by doing this in a few spots.

Dave

Oakum is Hemp, but don't smoke this batch.

I've removed those just by heating and melting the lead out, the oakum will smoke a bit

do what jim wilkins said - I have done this a couple of times on my house - basically cut/pried/melted the lead cap off the oakum packing, then pried/pulled the oakum out, then pull the pipe out - when I reinstalled, I used plumber's epoxy clay like stuff and PVC - so far (20 years) no leaks

The lead is soft, all you have to do is cut it in a couple of spots and it isn't thick, it's cast over the top of oakum. My granddad had an old Craftsman screwdriver he used for driving through the lead, cut it in a couple of spots and it should peel right out. It's a mechanical joint, after the lead was cast, the plumber used specially shaped caulking chisels to tighten things up by tapping on the top of the cast lead. I've still got all the stuff for doing that. Took the screwdriver back to Sears, though, he'd about pounded the shank through the handle. They gave me a new one.

Stan

Stan, do you also have a 'plumbers torch' or what used to be called a 'pot'. When I was a teenager in the 50's I bought one at Sears so I could melt lead for a few pipe joints I was working on. After that it was for fishing sinkers, soldiers, fun etc.

I'm surprised that I have never seen a use 'pot' for sale ever since the early sixties. I attend flea markets and garage sales frequently and have NEVER seen one.

Ivan Vegvary

Have a couple I use for melting down scrap lead for bullets and making up alloys. One is gas-fired, like a giant blow torch, the other is propane fired. You don't run across them very often, I got my propane one from a scrapper. The gasoline-fired one came from my granddad. It can also be used for heating up soldering coppers. MSC used to have the propane fired ones, they're now a ground unit with rubber hose instead of the bottle mounted one that I have. Takes a special tank valve. Really, one of the fish/turkey fryer burners puts out at least as much or more heat and is a lot more available. A lot less exciting to start up than that gasoline jobbie, that's definitely not something to start up in the basement although I've seen my granddad do it. All of them are noisy. I've got about a ton of wheelweights to get melted, way too hot the last couple of months.

The 'pots' are the iron crucibles, you can run across those at auctions sometimes or a real hardware store might have one on a bottom shelf with the pig lead, oakum and lead wool. Right now I'm using a cast -iron pot with legs on it, my dad called it a Dutch oven. Don't think it is, though, the bottom isn't flat and there's no provision for a lid. Holds about 70 lbs of wheelweights. Think it's just an old pot that was made to be used in the coals on a hearth. One of the burners will melt a load in it in about 10 minutes from cold.

For most poured joints, my granddad didn't bother with a pot, just melted the lead in a ladle and poured right from there. Nothing wrong with cast iron drains and lead joints except that the iron doesn't stay in good shape when buried for 100 years and it takes some skill to do the joints so they don't leak. Just about any moron can be taught to swab goop on plastic pipe and stuff it into fittings these days Sometimes they don't leak, too. But that's the reason you don't see much lead-working plumbing tools out there.

Stan

I bought one new from Pascal's Hardware in Ottawa in 1977 or 1978. I still melt lead over a propane camp stove, a coffee can wind shield speeds things up nicely. Most of my lead comes from old lead covered cables. Gerry :-)} London, Canada

Stan, thanks for your thoughtful and detailed reply.

Ivan Vegvary