Emerson Electric

So the ex-communist is making a go of it in this capitalistic system and paying taxes and you are leeching off the system, getting free government services and free healthcare. Kind of ironic.

Continue, as they have been doing for at least 50 years, making crummy motors in Mexico:

Emerson Motor Technologies' operations in Monterrey, Mexico, has reached 50 years of service. Founded in 1955, the Motores U.S. de Mexico facility started with just 18 employees and now employs over 1,000 people.

"We are extremely proud of the administration, staff and employees at our Motores U.S. de Mexico plant for their tireless commitment to producing high quality U.S. motor products year after year after year," said Jim Lindemann, chairman of Emerson Motor Co. "They continue to demonstrate excellence in customer service by ensuring that our distributors, OEMs and end-user customers have a consistent, high quality supply of U.S. Motors products available to ...

The Emerson burner motor on a Beckett oil burner is a good example of the "high quality supply of U.S. Motors products"

Most Americans are not as prejudiced against other countries as you are. Many believe that buying products from third world countries helps those countries to develop economies that pay a decent wage.

TMT apparently wants Americans to only buy products made in America. Does this describe TMT?

"A bigot is a person obstinately or intolerantly devoted to his or her own opinions and prejudices.

The correct use of the term requires the elements of obstinacy, irrationality, and animosity toward those of differing devotion.

The origin of the word bigot and bigoterie in English dates back to at least 1598, via Middle French, and started with the sense of "religious hypocrite". Forms of bigotry may have a related ideology or world views."

Dan

========= This goes to the heart of the free enterprise system in that a consumer can make a rational choice only if they know what the total product/service cost is.

Unka' George [George McDuffee]

------------------------------------------- He that will not apply new remedies, must expect new evils: for Time is the greatest innovator: and if Time, of course, alter things to the worse, and wisdom and counsel shall not alter them to the better, what shall be the end?

Francis Bacon (1561-1626), English philosopher, essayist, statesman. Essays, "Of Innovations" (1597-1625).

Perhaps you missed the part of gummer's post where he demonstrated yet again that he should have paid more attention in grade school. He said he's been paying taxes for 45 years, which would make him 11 when he started. So he'd have readers believe that he was so civic-minded that he paid taxes on his paper route and lemonade stand income. Or maybe he's talking about the taxes on his smokes? Anyway, it seems that he paid so much back then that 2 decades ago he decided that it would only be fair if he skipped out on his property taxes in perpetuity.

Even funnier is this thread.

's ranch "acreage" (which turns out to be ~56' X 126' according to the dimensions on his county's online map) has grown yet again! Only a week or so ago he claimed to "lease" some lots other than the one he lives on. But now land baron gummer declares: "I own a quarter of an entire block". Never mind that it would take 7 of the average lots on his street to make a single acre. But then, perhaps he "owns" some larger parcels in Beverly Hills as well. :-)

Wayne

Typical ad hominem argument.

Dan

Too_Many_Tools wrote in news:832a013f-8d27-4706- snipped-for-privacy@t18g2000vbj.googlegroups.com:

Sorry to have to burst your bubble but this has been an ongoing thing since the 1920s at least - when companies started importing cheap products to replace those that the Unionized Workers' salary demands had made unprofitable.

GWB wasn't even born yet, you idiot!

Also the part where he fantasizes that all the people he disagrees with will be mass murdered in three years. That doesn't help either.

Well, his time horizon keeps shifting, so I am not too worried about it.

i

You mean Bush and the Republican Congress.

TMT

Yep, but they weren't ALL Republicans.

============= The unfortunate truth is that no matter how much money is collected in taxes, the historical record shows that government over time *ALWAYS* spends more than it collects, regardless of the form of government and sources/amounts of tax revenue.

Unka George

(George McDuffee)

The past is a foreign country; they do things differently there. L. P. Hartley (1895-1972), British author. The Go-Between, Prologue (1953).

funding is an

 They want the

============= As indicated in another thread, this in most cases is called "cost externalization." As long as any business is allowed to shift their costs to someone else, they will do so in order to maximize their profits. This is the nature of business and does not [necessarily] imply the existence of a plot or conspiracy.

The shift from small scale local operations/organizations to multinational corporations has greatly amplified and exacerbated the problem of "cost externalization" and the parallel problem of "transfer pricing" where profits are shifted to the jurisdictions with the lowest or no taxes, and the costs are shifted to the areas with the highest cost and tax deductions.

The basic/root problem appears to be that the economy/financial system has become so complex that no one understands it, and it is therefore impossible to regulate and control. What must be done is obvious, but doing it may well be impossible, i.e. the genie is out of the bottle and he ain't going back.

Unka George

(George McDuffee)

The past is a foreign country; they do things differently there. L. P. Hartley (1895-1972), British author. The Go-Between, Prologue (1953).

=========== Another "sounds good, but," statement.

The problem in this case is determining the "cost" of the product. To be sure a definite sum is required when the item or service is purchased, but with the proliferation of "cost externalization," "transfer pricing," and governmental subsidies at several levels/stages, it is no longer possible in most cases to even roughly estimate the actual total "life cycle" cost of a product/service to the end user.

Unka George

(George McDuffee)

The past is a foreign country; they do things differently there. L. P. Hartley (1895-1972), British author. The Go-Between, Prologue (1953).

your post made me wonder, what's the next step? where do we go from here? corporations felt they had to move off shore to remain competitive. how long is it going to take before their competitiveness diminishes even being off shore? where are they going to go when that happens? they're just going to keep skipping around the globe to continually exploit low cost labor? at some point is there going to be a world wide labor union? i remember reading something about japan establishing shrimp farms in philippines. for a while the filipinos were making good money and were happy, then japan established shrimp farms in vietnam and the bottom fell out of shrimp prices. the filipinos had to work like dogs to make a profit. is it ever going to be possible for nations to collude to favor workers? or nations getting together to protect their local environment (example, bophal, india).

b.w.

And herein is the core problem.

It does not appear to me that this is due to any capitalistic or illumanati cabals, but rather the extremely rapid growth and development of the transnational corporation (which is increasingly "off shore" at all points and answerable to no governmental authority), which in turn is largely based on the quantum jumps in communications and computers.

To me at least, the current socio-economic and governmental systems have gone "rogue" and are completely unsustainable/unjustifiable, however in fairness this may well be due to the complete obsolescence of existing legal and regulatory frameworks, and the outstripping of any social/cultural experence/models by the leaps in corporate organization and communications, i.e. gross incompetence and simple impotence rather than venality.

Roughly the same thing occurred in European culture with the introduction of distilled alcohol. This *SMALL* change in technology utilization resulted in chaos in most countries. For some examples see

was not limited to the UK and the term "schnapps teufel" was widely know in the German speaking areas.

The socital-economic-cultural changes caused by just the improvements in communications and corporate organization are far more pervasive, and appear to compare with the introduction of "mass production" and/or the rise of the nation-state.

FWIW -- It should be noted that a successful parasite does not kill its host least it die also. A much more successful and durable relationship is symbiosis where both parties contribute to the long life, well being and vigor of the host.

Unka George (George McDuffee) ............................. Every gun that is fired, every warship launched, every rocket fired, signifies, in the final sense, a theft from those who hunger and are not fed, those who are cold and are not clothed. The world in arms is not spending money alone. It is spending the sweat of its labourers, the genius of its scientists, the hopes of its children.

Dwight D. Eisenhower (1890-1969), U.S. general, Republican politician, president. Speech, April 1953, Washington, D.C.

Many years ago I played a pick-up round of golf with a guy who turned out to work for one of the big electronic chip companies. He talked about having worked in Korea, The Philippines, now in Indonesia and went on to say that likely he would be moving back to the States one day.

I asked him about this work history and he told me that the company set up in a backward country where salaries were cheap and moved after some years when the local economy grew. He said that one day they would run out of these developing countries and move back to the U.S. I asked how they could do that if their business depended on cheap costs and he replied "robots".

Think about it for a bit, if low salaries are the answer.... why not eliminate the cost item entirely...

Regards,

J.B.

Let the Record show that Gunner Asch on or about Thu, 17 Dec 2009 09:53:37 -0800 did write/type or cause to appear in rec.crafts.metalworking the following:

"The development of a true AI system can be expected in about five years. Always has been, always will be."

That is a "shifting horizon". "Less than three years", "Within three years", "some time in the next two to three years" - those aren't so much shifting as broadly defined. I recall learning that distinction, so to speak, way back when, when the projecting were presented as "close order of 50 years." 'That means more than five, less that 500 years?' "Much less."

The alternative, is to give a date. "By 2012" "By 2020" "By Friday." (didn't say which Friday, did I?)

toodles

- pyotr filipivich We will drink no whiskey before its nine. It's eight fifty eight. Close enough!

Emmerson made both of my 'Craftsman' table saws.