Hello??

Sep 16, 2025 Last reply: 9 months ago 67 Replies

Power and ground tend to be ignored until one gains troubleshooting experience. On some of the automated test equipment I worked on we had to measure and control their currents, and in sensitive measurement circuits keep the ground current down to a few milliamps. There were separate analog, digital and "High Quality" measurement grounds joined by low value resistors and back-to-back diodes.

Nothing on the analog side exceeded 10 KHz, measurements were given a few milliseconds to settle, mostly because of capacitive dielectric absorption decay in the custom Teflon-insulated reed relays and coaxial cables made by WL Gore. I built an instrument to measure and display it at the level of picoamps. The project engineer had been a designer at Keithley and I learned a lot about precision automated measurement from him, which helped at Mitre where the engineers were experts in radio but not the computerized voltage measurement that digital radio introduced.

Microwave digital radio had the additional concern of the impedance of the power circuit which has to be treated as parts of controlled impedance transmission lines, the source and return path for signal currents. I was given a problem board to troubleshoot that another department's Ph.Ds had struggled with for two weeks. A glance at the circuit board inner layer prints showed the problem, they had used low frequency design rules in which the grounds for various circuit functions are separated into lobes and converge in a small area, to break up ground loops.

What they missed was the large current spike when a high speed and power 74S logic family bus carrying the A/D measurement output from the analog to the digital ground regions changes state. In that nanosecond the ground planes on both sides could have up to 3V momentarily between them, swamping the receiving inputs, before the ground return current could make it to and back from the common junction at about 6" per nanosecond, ~= c/2. The 15 minutes I needed to solve the problem was mostly spend setting up a convincing scope display of the "ground bounce."

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When I designed a microwave frequency digital radio I controlled interactions in the continuous inner layer power and ground planes by where each circuit was located relative to the power feed, and used multiple values of bypass caps whose self-resonant frequencies didn't overlap.
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"You can also easily [measure capacitor resonance] with a vector network analyzer." If you have and know how to use one.
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college I became totally lost during the lessons on Laplace transforms and the S plane. Later in night school we learned how to use rather than worship complex number math.

I snatched up a Keithley Micro-Ohmmeter at a flea market. It still worked fine but the 1980's HPIB data output had become obsolete, the company had changed to USB. It can easily show the resistance of an inch of 10 AWG wire, and of course switches, breakers and rusted ground screws. My other problem detector is a thermal imager that reveals heating from IR drops. 5A through

10AWG wire shows up clearly, 2A is visible. Bad connections glow like light bulbs.
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I've wanted something like that (thermal imaging) since my working days. Best I could do back then was a temp probe in a blob of silicone grease on suspect components.

Would still like one but have no particular need right now. Nowadays I try hard to have patience with items like this. It's better to wait until really need it and then buy current or recent offerings. Prices and abilities for these items keep getting better at a rapid pace.

I have a cheap infrared temp gun. It's helpful and will be good enough for now...

I've wanted something like that (thermal imaging) since my working days. Best I could do back then was a temp probe in a blob of silicone grease on suspect components.

Would still like one but have no particular need right now. Nowadays I try hard to have patience with items like this. It's better to wait until really need it and then buy current or recent offerings. Prices and abilities for these items keep getting better at a rapid pace.

I have a cheap infrared temp gun. It's helpful and will be good enough for now...

Thanks, I'll keep that in mind if the need comes up or I can't resist buying one any longer👍️

You were forced to overspecify everything... ?

"The pigs all had their snouts in the trough". By this everyone can get paid for doing nothing.

A crucial point which had been in mind and I didn't mention:

I have to be "a happening person". Someone it is for others to want to engage with.

In a declining economy ("Project Ukraine" has made any previous woes many-fold worse) I see retrospectively it has been futile being "nice-guy" foot-slogging around companies - without being that strong happening person.

If I am to have anything, I have to recognise my strengths and abilities clearly and get doing a lot of those things.

"Jim Wilkins" snipped-for-privacy@gmail.com writes: ...

You were forced to overspecify everything... ?

"The pigs all had their snouts in the trough". By this everyone can get paid for doing nothing.

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Sometimes, depending on conditions. When trying something new available products are rarely a close match, and industry required what appeared to be overspecifying based on previous incidents, like a forklift puncturing an electrical cabinet. That resulted in the requirement that all internal hazardous voltage be run through grounded conduit so a short would pop a breaker, and regardless of power level any exposed wiring outside enclosures had to be too strong to break accidentally or intentionally by hand, 16AWG. The external panel controls had to be oil-tight to protect them from conductive or flammable coolant spray from whatever they were placed beside and soapy water wash-downs with a hose. Oil-tight switch controls were several times more expensive, and modular so their switching functions could be changed with a screwdriver, such as single pole single throw to double pole double throw. Lab equipment wasn't subject to those requirements but we met them anyway since we were prepared for them. Delivery is quicker if you have stock on hand and charge for its replacement. I do that for common hardware at home too.

Idiot-proofing encourages hiring cheaper idiots as operators. The history of infantry weapons and tactics demonstrates this when compared to artillery which required more careful handling. An example today is singers dropping a fragile and expensive professional microphone. Air hose nozzles became vented and less effective because some idiot worker once pushed a high pressure nozzle against another and punctured the skin.

Automotive electronics can be subject to nearly the temperature stress of fighter jets, for example a snowplow in Alaska (or NH) starting cold and ramming at full power into a snowbank, or being splashed with icy water. As an apprentice I helped assemble a large expensive machine that rapidly cycled a batch of GM HEI ignition modules between hot and cold limits while testing their proper operation. If a loose or corroded battery clamp disconnects the alternator can generate around 100V until the energy stored in the rotor has dissipated and the voltage regulator regains control of rotor current.

Aviation electronics had to at least stay in place during a shock of somewhat over 30 g's (?) so they wouldn't fly into the cockpit during a rough belly landing. That one was a mechanical engineer's problem to solve, as was adequate cooling airflow at altitude which seemed excessive on the ground. Some WW2 aircraft engines fed supercharged air into the distributor to avoid sparks jumping at high altitude.

Submarines were/are? tested to the pressure equivalent of 10,000' altitude. Diesels pull a vacuum in the hull if the snorkel closes from a large wave. The radar stealth coating on WW2 U-boot Schnorchels didn't hide them from the latest secret Allied radar, the boats were out until the war's end but ineffective after spring 1943. Those are examples of conditions one might not expect or design for.

New equipment intended to test other new equipment sometimes needed modification as the specs changed, using components with higher ratings was a valuable hedge. An example I can mention is the Apollo spacecraft flight control computer that had more computation to do during the actual moon landing than had been expected or tested for. It's supposed failure was a watchdog timer lamp that flashed because the program couldn't cycle through all tasks in a pre-specified time which had been initially assumed to be more than adequate, and could be changed in hardware if the programmers knew to ask. The program loop's final task was to reset the timer that kept the light off, presumably unless the computer crashed. I heard that from the Mitre engineer who had helped design and build the computer. He was on other tasks when the computer was being tested.

I don't intentionally overspecify on home projects that I can easily change unless the available material is more capable than needed or I don't know the worst condition, such as the starting shock load of my electric hoist or the maximum starting (locked rotor) current for an electric motor running from a DC-AC inverter. Measured results vary widely depending on the random phase at connection and the inverter's surge capacity is also unknown, and indeterminate until I buy one.

I designed the tractor bucket loader for an impact that would lift the rear wheels off the ground, but didn't know the weight capacity of the front tires and axles so I machined an adjustable hydraulic pressure relief valve and crept the pressure up until a tire failed. I collect used test equipment to be able to measure these things.

A crucial point which had been in mind and I didn't mention:

I have to be "a happening person". Someone it is for others to want to engage with.

In a declining economy ("Project Ukraine" has made any previous woes many-fold worse) I see retrospectively it has been futile being "nice-guy" foot-slogging around companies - without being that strong happening person.

If I am to have anything, I have to recognise my strengths and abilities clearly and get doing a lot of those things.

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I became the go-to person for challenging tasks by solving difficult problems, unproven claims on my resume meant nothing, even that I wrote it on a computer I had designed, built and programmed. Likewise a little bag of home-machined parts lit up the interviewing engineers more than any written claim. Perhaps you could have your business card laser-etched on thin stainless and rim one or two with a neat TIG bead.

I was very impressed by your bridge success, though an interviewer might see less of the justified complaining about the inspectors. I wouldn't want to be hired for ability to negotiate with unions, I saw how that affected my father and brother.

What I meant was - not well explained - they overspecify the path to any goal.

My discoveries and successes have been through "feeling my way along" - sensing what Nature is revealing and adapting. Life is what happens when you are making other plans - have a plan yes but adapt it rapidly with what you find as a result of driving on determinedly on the plan-so-far.

My perception of a lot of "go nowhere machines" of organisations is to immediately specify everything. Superficially it sounds right - but if you have any experience of science, you know it fundamentally absolutely doesn't work that way.

My understanding is that in the USA there was a lot of discretionary funding of good ideas. eg. the Internet happened because of "long-haired hippies" asked to find a communication system which was impossible to disrupt and provided funds to "give it a try" to ideas emerging. Then there's been competions like which produced the "Reindahl" (sic.) -

128bit-key - cryptographic algorithm and self-driving logistics vehicles.

Etc.

Surely have related before - I once was treated to the distressing sight of a colleague curling over the desk his face red, blood vessels pulsing on his temples, making and anguished acting-out of strangulation -- because disguised in jest I was trying to steer them away from thing "ISO54321 / EN0123 / ISO....." approaching the investigation of a problem / discrepancy in Non-Destructive Testing. Fortunately three days later they were looking at exactly what I had been conjuring-up as if teasing them - and they realised that was a non-random connection.

Have a given a better impression of what I mean?

That certainly happens here too, notably with military weapons systems subject to congressional oversight (meddling) and interservice rivalry (scarce resources). Uncertainty of what opponents will do makes it worse. It's been like that since when the argument was over the proper length, weight and use of spears. I studied but avoided personal experience with that subject, specializing in communications, a field that lacks the glory to attract large egos.

I made a point to seek out small lean innovative companies that didn't have "too many chiefs and too few indians".

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The disadvantage of startups is that they don't survive the stress of recessions and jealous competitors' frivolous lawsuits, but I'm self-reliant enough to not need a steady job.

Mitre turned out for me to be like a large assortment of small groups, I considered it a do-your-own-thing artists' colony environment for theoretically inclined engineers, who fortunately left me alone to decide how to build their ideas. Segway was in some ways similar, engineers were free to individually explore new ideas that might lead to a product, or not. The production reject bin was intentionally beside the door to the lab.

In college I participated as technical assistant in an actual artists' colony of actors and a film maker, a lite imitation of Andy Warhol's Factory. That other unfettered extreme is only as productive as the individual talents allow. They may be even less collaborative than large corporations. Theatre resolves it by making the producer the boss of business decisions and the director autocratic on artistic matters.

The semiconductor test equipment company was a good example of right-sizing a project. The customers knew and clearly specified what they needed and one hardware and one software project manager converted that into closely matching design specs, then parceled out relatively independent parts of it to individual engineers and programmers while they managed by controlling the interconnections, the Black Box model, and digging deeper into any difficulties. I handled the smaller details like calibration hardware and software.

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This came out during that project and mirrored it.
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Long ago I decided I should become the multi-talented assistant to a brilliant scientist or engineer, and I've more or less done that.

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I bought a used 2013 Impala a few years ago. Owner before me had a JVC KW-V250BT aftermarket radio installed in it. It has provision for a backup camera, RCA jack and reverse switch input. I toyed with the idea of using it but decided I wouldn't really use it enough to hassle with it.

Personally I'd skip the reverse switch and just add a switch somewhere convenient so it could be used whenever. Camera units were less than $50 but of unknown quality.

Manual for it can be found here:

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Download should be maybe ~2mb. Has some basic specs and install info.

It needs a special module so the vehicles door, trunk, blinkers... can still make beeping noises that had once went to the factory radio/sound system. You lose your clock too if the unit is turned off. The touch screen works with regular gloves on. It has very few actual buttons and isn't easy to turn off (sub menu item). Interface acts kinda slow IMO. Would be an older model now, probably been replaced with another (copy right 2018 on manual). Has a LOT of features that I suspect you'd have no use for but I'll let you decide that😉️

It does sound REALLY nice playing my mp3 music collection from a 32gb Memory stick plugged into its USB-A on the front👍️

For GPS + Nav I'd use my phone with a decent dash mount if it was necessary. I rarely go anyplace nowadays that NAV would be helpful...

<snip>

I bought a used 2013 Impala a few years ago. Owner before me had a JVC KW-V250BT aftermarket radio installed in it. It has provision for a backup camera, RCA jack and reverse switch input. I toyed with the idea of using it but decided I wouldn't really use it enough to hassle with it.

Personally I'd skip the reverse switch and just add a switch somewhere convenient so it could be used whenever. Camera units were less than $50 but of unknown quality.

Manual for it can be found here:

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Download should be maybe ~2mb. Has some basic specs and install info.

It needs a special module so the vehicles door, trunk, blinkers... can still make beeping noises that had once went to the factory radio/sound system. You lose your clock too if the unit is turned off. The touch screen works with regular gloves on. It has very few actual buttons and isn't easy to turn off (sub menu item). Interface acts kinda slow IMO. Would be an older model now, probably been replaced with another (copy right 2018 on manual). Has a LOT of features that I suspect you'd have no use for but I'll let you decide that😉️

It does sound REALLY nice playing my mp3 music collection from a 32gb Memory stick plugged into its USB-A on the front👍️

For GPS + Nav I'd use my phone with a decent dash mount if it was necessary. I rarely go anyplace nowadays that NAV would be helpful...

My understanding is that in the USA there was a lot of discretionary funding of good ideas. eg. the Internet happened because of "long-haired hippies" asked to find a communication system which was impossible to disrupt and provided funds to "give it a try" to ideas emerging.

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'Angel' private investors are standard practice in theatre, Mel Brooks' comedy "The Producers" describes an attempt to scam them that backfires.
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In business instead of a one-time share of the show's profits the investors get a share of company ownership, a private parallel to publically traded stock. I was too wary to invest and worked for wages instead, which was the right decision.

I kept a group of color printer company angel investors happily contributing yet another quarter's expenses for over a year by copying their business card logo, cleaning up and enlarging the image and delivering a stack of paper with letterheads and graphics during the meeting.

After the electronic tech work was finished I became the font (letter shapes and sizes) designer; the dot grid (240/") was different from that of a laser printer (300/") and we couldn't just copy it though that is legal. I never guessed I'd become a graphic artist. Knowing the special letters of the French and German (and some Runic) alphabets helped me.

The print quality was good enough for fancy wedding invitations and the colors brilliant, especially when printed in reverse on acetate. Meanwhile we struggled to keep a printer operating for as long as a week. These were full color ink jet printers around 1985. The process which sprayed droplets of molten plastic ink inspired 3D printing. It was capable of printing on aluminum offset press plates and even paper towels, the only thing it couldn't do was stay unclogged, despite alcohol and compressed air plumbing and a vigorous ink jet purge that could put abstract art on a tee shirt 2 feet away. The joke was that it lacked only a Diesel generator.

Indications of the small company attitude were the sign "Last one out please lock the door" for those choosing to work late on something interesting, and the roaming pet dogs on weekends.

The design spec was that the damned thing had to work reliably eventually. All else was optional, added if it was easy (raised Braille) or proved essential.

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"In 1986, Howtek launched the Pixelmaster solid ink-jetting printer, which opened the door to printing three-dimensional plastic inks and led to a 1992

3D patent, US5136515A."

Robert Howard also invented cable TV, to serve an apartment building he owned from a single antenna. He was as likely as Trump to summarily fire people so I avoided him.

Individuals can invest in government projects, the mechanism is the Municipal Bond which has the advantage of the return being partly or fully tax-free. I've supported school, roads and housing construction.

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are safe as long as the government has the guns to collect the taxes.

Naturally any opportunity the "rich" take advantage of and the "underprivileged" don't must be inherently racist and evil. The alternative of "Investing" in government projects through lottery tickets doesn't count.

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Suspect you already know this...

The old motor assemblies like what was on my standard wiper 1982 Chevy K10 had a set of "park contacts" inside them. Parking being completed wiper in the down position after turning them off.

-- Leon Fisk Grand Rapids MI

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The wiper motor and replaced column switch passed the factory manual test procedures, which leaves the intermittent and low speed wiper control module, Motorcraft 17C476, unavailable new, delulu expensive and questionable used. It contains an unpotted circuit board that's not too complex so the detective work begins.

Crawling under the dash to remove it reminds me I'm getting old. My feet and legs were upright in the cab rear window, I wonder what passers-by thought. Foam sheet snow sleds are nice pads to lie on under trucks and are cheap in spring. They even make gravel tolerable.

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Classy "creeper", I usually settle for corrugated card board😆️

I've been know to repair modules like that too. A lot of times it's just something loose, especially with that ones age. I'm sure your roads are nice and smooth too (cough, cough)😉️

I'm doing the same (tethering to cell) but have two phones. Provider gives me 20gb data per phone per month. One is my primary phone and the other a spare. If one has problems or system doesn't act right I can try the other phone.

I usually check out maps and directions on the desktop computer. Maybe take a screen shot or make a pdf for the phone in case I can't remember all of it.

Fiber has come through since I had to resort to cell phone data but prices for it suck. Would more than double what I'm currently paying. I watched it go in and have zero confidence in how they installed it and how they market their product offerings😑️

I forgot to mention that the JVC radio doesn't interface with the steering wheel radio controls either. I never got to use the OEM radio that way so I don't miss it. I suspect the owner before had it installed to use their iPhone hands-free via Bluetooth through the radio system. I've never bothered to set it up with my phone. Not something I'd use.

Whoever installed mine didn't put all the dash screws back in nor did they remember to plug-in the Driver Information Center control button panel back in. So you couldn't use the trip meters, oil change life, tire pressures... I wouldn't trust a car audio store to install anything😆️

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Classy "creeper", I usually settle for corrugated card board😆️

I've been know to repair modules like that too. A lot of times it's just something loose, especially with that ones age. I'm sure your roads are nice and smooth too (cough, cough)😉️

-- Leon Fisk Grand Rapids MI

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Cardboard is easier to slide on, I flatten and save large boxes for that reason. Off pavement the hard solid plastic bonded to the bottom of the foam doesn't soak through and pads small stones better.

The repair appears to have been quick and easy, a relay coil pin had visibly broken loose from the solder on the single-sided board. The failure was intermittent so time will tell. It measured connected, perhaps due to handling or being in the cool basement. The component lead forming intentionally allowed for thermal expansion and contraction, the small diodes had half loops in one end, but the relay was tight on the board.

Very often I found that solder opens were the failure cause on boards. I tested the soldering on fine pitch high pin count quad flat packs by sliding an open safety pin from my key chain down the row. An unsoldered pin pinged at a lower pitch.

In the 80's solder shorts on the inner planes of multilayer boards were a problem, the board fab houses were painfully adapting from less dense commercial to the nearly mil-spec requirements of computers. Often shorts could be opened on a bare board by connecting a large cap charged to ~20V to

+5 and Gnd. If it wasn't under outer layer copper the fault would flash as it cleared. This was a diagnostic, those boards wouldn't be completed. By the 90's the quality had considerably improved such that visual inspection found nothing.

Actually Maine and NH roads are quite well maintained outside of cities. Pavement cracks are carefully sealed to keep water from freezing and expanding underneath. The less densely populated areas of Mass aren't far behind us. I've ridden on much worse in NY.

What I meant was - not well explained - they overspecify the path to any goal.

My discoveries and successes have been through "feeling my way along" - sensing what Nature is revealing and adapting. Life is what happens when you are making other plans - have a plan yes but adapt it rapidly with what you find as a result of driving on determinedly on the plan-so-far.

My perception of a lot of "go nowhere machines" of organisations is to immediately specify everything. Superficially it sounds right - but if you have any experience of science, you know it fundamentally absolutely doesn't work that way.

------------------------------------------- In my experience allowing a non-technically-educated supplier to make choices was dangerous, there was a good reason if we wanted something difficult so the job was carefully specified. The US military learned the need for specs when under Ulysses Grant they ordered soap at so much per bar and the supplier made the bars smaller and smaller. Grant could have deservedly suffered the ridicule Gilbert and Sullivan applied to Sir Garnet Wolseley had they lived here.

I know less outside high tech. I think I see your point, though, that people who aren't really qualified for the challenges of their jobs become very self-defensive and tend to seek the protection of standards or specs to shield them from being called wrong, whether or not those should apply. That happened in the non-technical departments of high tech firms, for instance in benefits, accounting and human relations, they were visibly nervous and defensive talking to us and demonstrated their memorization (if not understanding) of company policy and the complex retirement plan. Even the computer IT people feared us technicians who appeared as if we could have effortlessly taken over their jobs if we didn't mind the downgrade.

The engineers treated me as a near equal after I solved an engineering math problem in my head for them, 10,000,000 bits sent at 2400 bits per second takes 4,166.67 seconds, which is 1 hour, 9 minutes and 26.67 seconds. That's how long I tied up a satellite channel without finding a single error in the returned data stream. I knew what the real problem was but if I told them they would have dragged me back into cryptography which I was happy to avoid.

I found a credible unclassified alternative that exonerated where the problem wasn't, with credit for an accomplishment. Similarly I spent the last few days testing the more accessible areas that might contribute to a problem in my truck and only after they passed all tests I unbolted the seat and awkwardly crawled under the dash to reach the likely and actual culprit. At 34 years old any or all could be failing. Once under there I found why the truck was losing power, the throttle cable had stretched. Tomorrow an individual (bracket) may suffer on the milling machine for the good of the whole (truck).

Rijndael, BTW.

Several years ago when second son had mid-back length ponytail, he was wishing he had used cardboard instead of my yard sale creeper to go under his one ton when no one else was home and his hair got caught in the casters. Since then, every time I trim my beard, I put the 1/4" comb on the clipper and give him a once over.

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