Hoist brake solenoid buzzes/fluckers instead of steadily pulling

Jeffrey Angus wrote:


Yeah, isn't it?
Hope you enjoy your dilemma..
Have a nice day.
Jamie
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Jeffrey Angus wrote:

What else do you expect from 'Skippy - V2.0'? He also thinks Electret microphones are crystal microphones, and that you can easily change the bandgap in LEDs to adjust the color. He's a real, no class clown on sci.electronics.design.
--
You can't have a sense of humor, if you have no sense.

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Not sure about the flamewar going on here, but it's actually not hard to get a LED to change colors. Get some liquid nitrogen and try it out.
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GeorgeD wrote:

I didn't look at the picture before how ever, that solenoid needs replacing!
Between the corrosion, most likely in the wire too, the laminates are most likely bad!
THat part of the equipment should be well closed to keep it much cleaner than that!
P.S.
I know of an area of our work place where a whole bunch of new solenoids are stored just for that hoist! We no longer have hoist of that type in operation. The solenoids are kept on hand for R&D material until they run out, they also make good look bolt retractors.
Jamie
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I put some penetrating oil on the screws, I will get it off and clean thoroughly. Thanks.
i
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On 11/13/2011 10:21 AM, Ignoramus22978 wrote:

I don't see the wires. How many wires does the solenoid have?
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Two.
i
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Ig, there is a case where a diode might be used, but you'd see it, and a switch to cut it in and out of circuit, if it were there.
The case is where a coil is wound "strong" for pull-in, then a diode is placed in series to lower the coil's average current during the hold phase.
However, that would be obvious, and external to the coil.
LLoyd
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On 11/13/2011 12:48 PM, Ignoramus22978 wrote:

I've also worked on solenoids like that that have a switch and a resistor for the "hold" circuit. Follow the wires. Same thing, if the resistor or that circuit is open the solenoid will chatter open and closed.
This is assuming the solenoid does chatter, as if it's being turned on and off rapidly, like a machine gun.
If it's just hanging up part way and buzzing then I'd agree with the people who said to clean it up or replace it.
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This is exactly what it does.

No, it chatters like a machine gun.
i
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On 11/13/2011 9:51 PM, Ignoramus22978 wrote:

Follow the solenoid wires to look for an end of stroke switch. If it has one it will be actuated and open when the solenoid is pulled in. Check that circuit for a resistor or something else to lower the solenoid voltage. The problem is that it gets power on the pull stroke but no power for the hold position.
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On Sun, 13 Nov 2011 09:21:30 -0600, Ignoramus22978

Clean off the corrosion before blundering forward. It's likely that the jerkiness is cuased by corrosion or rust on the moving parts of the solenoid. I suggest you tear it apart, clean off what can be easily removed, use a wire brush on everything else, coat is with some kind of sealer (clear acrylic), and make sure everything moves easily and correctly before reassembling. If that's too much, it looks like the solenoid can be removed with 4 screws and a cotter pin, so start cleaning there.
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150 Felker St #D http://www.LearnByDestroying.com
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On 11/13/2011 9:21 AM, Ignoramus22978 wrote:

That amount of surface rust and corrosion INSIDE a cover indicates it's been wet, or in a wet location.
That's a disc brake and should dis-engage when the hoist is in operation.
Do you have the wiring diagram for this hoist?
I know that label reads, "Caution dual voltage" as an indication it "might be wired for a different voltage than what you're using.
Despite all the random guessing, I'm assuming that is a very simple straight forward coil that pulls the release on the disc brake.
If that coil is set up for 480 volts and you're putting 240 across it, it IS going to buzz and chatter. It will do that without any missing diodes, open coils, hidden switches or two sets pull & hold windings.
If that coil is set up for "dual voltage" it should have more that two wires connecting to it. Or there should be a control transformer somewhere else in the housing to supply the correct voltage to a single voltage coil. Or a dropping resistor (not likely) to allow a 240 coil to be used on 480. And the instructions, as such, should have the connection for both voltages and everything you have to reconnect listed.
Jeff
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"Everything from Crackers to Coffins"

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On Nov 13, 8:00am, Ignoramus22978 <ignoramus22...@NOSPAM. 22978.invalid> wrote:

Have you thought of contacting the manufactirer?
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The hoist can be entirely rewired for 240/480. It actually WAS wired for 480 and I had to rewire. So, you are saying that to complete this transition to 240, I would have to replace the solenoid?
i
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On 11/13/2011 8:52 PM, Ignoramus22978 wrote:

Ok, let's back up a bit. WHEN was the last time the hoist worked like it should? When it was installed and operating on 480 v?
Or was it working at some point when re-wired for 240 v and THEN started to act up with the brake solenoid?
Jeff
--
"Everything from Crackers to Coffins"

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I bought it at auction.
I have never seen this hoist run.
At my place, I have 240v 3ph only. (well, I have a transformer that I could wire to get 460v, but it is sitting in the corner right now).
i
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Ignoramus22978 wrote:

Ok, so what is the original coil voltage suppose to be? 230 or 480?
You do know that many of those types of devices that allow you to rewire uses the same coil for both voltages? Normally the coil is spec'd out for 230V AC.. which will work in either case, it's just where you connect the wires to.
Jamie
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On Nov 14, 7:35pm, Jamie

Has the OP ever said if there are two or three or how many wires going to the solenoid????
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snipped-for-privacy@att.net wrote:

From what I can remember, it's a simple 2 wire solenoid.. That being the case, they should be connected to the # 1 & 2 wires of the motor relay output side M1,M2. If it was wired for 480, then the coil is connected to the #4 and #5 for example. That will get half the voltage when the motor operates. Standard for AC motors with add on brake on the back..
Jamie
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