I thought about just emailing the RCM premier expert on bullet
casting, but maybe somebody else has something to add.
Ammo prices are climbing outa sight. So i want to get into casting my
own 9mm and .308. My interest peaked when I learned my 1919 and MG42
will eat unplated bullets. I always knew the Uzis and Suomis would eat
anything.
What all equipment will I need? What should i expect to spend to make
10K of each bullet? (If i can't break even at 10K, I'll keep buying
from Berry and Pats)
Karl
You've probably already thought about this, but figure out the total
weight of your 10K worth of bullets, figure out how much you'll need to
spend on the lead, decide on what seems to be a reasonable wastage figure
(10%? 5%?), then figure out if you're saving anything right there. If
not, then you know why prices are high, and you know the value of
proceeding.
Figure out how much you want/don't want the EPA breathing down your neck
because you're using Oh So Terrible Toxic Lead while you're at it.
thaought I'd get way more interest in this topic. guess i should've
said I'm doing this because bamma is runing everything and has to be
stopped
Seriously, I'm hoping to use an old forklift battery for the lead.
from what little i've read looks like (expensive) linotype is the
preferred source.
Karl
The forklift battery will certainly give you a good deal of basic lead,
but I think you will need to find a source for the proper alloying
metals to get the hardness and whatnot for basic lead bullets. If you
perhaps get fancy and make jacketed bullets the lead alloy is probably
less important. I hear soft copper tubing works well for jackets.
As for commercial ammo prices, as far as I've seen they have been pretty
stable for the past year or two after the shortage ended. Everyone likes
to hype up Obummer as the reason for higher ammo prices, but in reality
the brass, copper and lead metals markets have much more to do with it.
Years ago I was in the market for a couple 'hundred pounds of lead and
figured that I could get it from the old batteries that are left at the
dump. I took one home, cut it up, and found this weird spongy stuff
inside. Undaunted, I put the spongy stuff in a crucible and melted it.
The yield was pathetic! Mostly a heap of dross.
A total waste of effort.
YMMV, maybe
Bob
DO NOT USE BATTERY LEAD!!!!!!!!!
Here's your shopping list:
_____________________________________________________
From midwayusa.com:
Lee 6-Cavity Bullet Mold TL356-124-2R 9mm Luger, 38 Super, 380 ACP (356
Diameter) 124 Grain Tumble Lube 2 Ogive Radius
Product #: 476412 $39.49
Lee Commercial Bullet Mold Handles for 6-Cavity Lee Bullet Molds
Product #: 117892 $11.49 on sale
Lee Pro 4 20 Lb Furnace 110 Volt
Product #: 645810 $58.49
Frankford Arsenal CleanCast Lead Fluxing Compound 1 lb
Product #: 593033 $9.99
Lee Alox Bullet Lube 4 oz Liquid
Product #: 466811 $5.89
Lee "Modern Reloading 2nd Edition, Revised" Reloading Manual
Product #: 639649 $18.29
Lee 4-Cavity Ingot Mold with Handle
Product #: 361222 $9.99 on sale
TOTAL:$153.63 plus shipping
____________________________________________________
From eBay:
Lead ingots made from wheel weights will cost about $65.00 delivered for
50 pounds Or, find a friendly tire shop.
_________________________________________________________
In addition you will need some bench space, a 5 gallon bucket full of
cold water, a tin can to put the dross in, a big spoon or ladle, and a
few other things you already have. Great book, read it!
Grand total: $218.63 plus some freight = 2,282 124 gr bullets at about
$0.095 each. After the initial investment all bullets will cost $0.028 each
Let me know how I can help.
thanks Tom,
Don't i need a sizing die?
To run .308, the bullets need to be hard, they reference linotype or
alloying the wheel weights. Do you know about this?
Is working in front of a fan enough to keep the lead fumes safely
away?
Karl
1. Good supply of wheel weights and in the case of the MGs...a fair
supply of Linotype alloy
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2. a natural gas source or a 20lb bottle of propane
3. Old gas burner..the bigger the better
4. Make it yourself bottom pour pot capable of handling a minimum of
20 lbs of molten lead alloy
5. a double or quad cavity mold for each bullet you intend to cast,
(with handles)
6 bullet sizing/lubricator. In the case of many bullets at a time..Id
suggest a Star luber. Else Lyman/RCBS etc etc
7.Dies for each caliber for the luber
Lubricant. For the MGs..Id strongly recommend Hard lubes and a heater
to mount your luber/sizer on.
8. Lots of time, or a neighbor kid you can pay cheap to sit and cast
bullets.
Not much else. Oh..a neck expander die to put a small bell (very
small) on the case mouths..but that can be made from a threaded rod on
a lathe
Gunner
Liberals - Cosmopolitan critics, men who are the friends
of every country save their own. Benjamin Disraeli
Personally...Id stay away from battery lead. But then..forklift
batteries are far bigger than automotive batteries
Wheel weights are much better btw..they come close enough to #2 alloy
as is.
Gunner
Liberals - Cosmopolitan critics, men who are the friends
of every country save their own. Benjamin Disraeli
With the Lee molds you usually don't need to size, especially for
pistol. Lee makes a good cheap set-up for sizing if needed. I like
tumble lube, others don't. Linotype dropped in cold water will be
about the hardest you can get. You will have to keep your rifle loads
lower than jacketed. Wheel weights are just fine for pistols. If the
boolit is too hard it won't obturate and it'll lead the barrel, too soft
and it leads the barrel. Same with too fast and too slow. But, once
your load is dialed in you are in One-Hole City! WAY better than
factory and only $2.50 a box of 50. (if you get free wheel weights)
I have an exhaust fan in my laundry room that I think is sufficient. I
get my blood-lead levels checked twice a year, is was high once but is
back to normal just by using latex gloves. I cast and shoot 1k/month.
Get the book first, it's a cheap investment and is a great first loading
book, you WILL buy a couple more over time.
Look at the forum:
We got us another convert to the silver stream!
(look at my recommendations, I went a slightly different route.)
But for GOD'S sake, don't let him fuck with batteries!
Indeed. A buddy of mine snagged some 2000 lbs of old batteries,
busted them up with sledge hammers, remelted the lead..and got about
25lbs of lead out of the deal....with a couple wheelbarrows of
nasty..nasty slag to deal with.
I warned him..but no..he wouldnt listen....shrug.
Gunner
Liberals - Cosmopolitan critics, men who are the friends
of every country save their own. Benjamin Disraeli
Karl Townsend fired this volley in
news: snipped-for-privacy@4ax.com:
It's counter-intuitive, but don't have the fan behind you, or even behind
at an angle. Have it blow R-L or L-R across your pot.
As far as concerns "lead fumes" -- WHAT lead fumes? At correct casting
temperatures, no significant or harmful amount of anything lead-bearing
will get into the air that you don't throw into the air with your tools.
The flux fumes may or may not be injurious, depending upon what you use.
Chronic breathing of even simple animal grease smoke ain't all that good
for you.
LLoyd
While I do most of my major bullet metal preparation outdoors...I do
cast indoors. I simply installed a bathroom fart fan in a piece of
paneling that I place in a window behind the casting area and turn it
on. Sucks any fumes and toxins right outdoors. And helps keep a bit
of a breeze blowing around me. Not much of one..but enough to help
keep me cool(er)
Gunner
Liberals - Cosmopolitan critics, men who are the friends
of every country save their own. Benjamin Disraeli
I really should have added, and didn't, that it's skin contact and
absorption through ingesting lead residues that is your real hazard when
casting.
Unless you were to convert lead into a gas or some super-fine aerosol
that will float in air (don't know how you'd do that, actually), there
are no "lead fumes". But flux fumes? Lotsa!
LLoyd
Gunner on Sun, 30 Sep 2012 23:52:55 -0700 typed
in rec.crafts.metalworking the following:
Dang - that lead "slag" should be refinable. - I mean there is a
several hundred pounds of material there. It can't all be plastic
case and the like.
I'm sure there is a way to process the lead in batteries - right.
(I suspect that you need to completely neutralize the acid, and clean
out the non-lead compounds. Both of which may require a level of
chemical processing beyond the back yard salvager.)
tschus
pyotr
--
pyotr
Go not to the Net for answers, for it will tell you Yes and no. And
you are a bloody fool, only an ignorant cretin would even ask the
question, forty two, 47, the second door, and how many blonde lawyers
does it take to change a lightbulb.
pyotr filipivich fired this volley in
news: snipped-for-privacy@4ax.com:
Problem is, there's so much "unwantium" in batteries that you can't
smelt, that it will might make up 75% of the weight or better.
Cadmium compounds (not good!), calcium compounds (not so bad), lead
sulfide and oxide which aren't likely to reduce at the temperatures you
have available, and other "stuff" like glass insulator mats... About the
only meltable lead is the posts, connector straps, and those flimsy
"screens" of lead that hold all the other smeared-in pastes of compounds
they make the electrodes from.
Lead compounds are heavy, too... so it makes it appear you've got a
treasure-trove, when what you have is a recycling mess!
LLoyd
"Lloyd E. Sponenburgh" on Mon, 01 Oct
2012 15:33:06 -0500 typed in rec.crafts.metalworking the following:
Oh -boogers.
--
pyotr
Go not to the Net for answers, for it will tell you Yes and no. And
you are a bloody fool, only an ignorant cretin would even ask the
question, forty two, 47, the second door, and how many blonde lawyers
does it take to change a lightbulb.
It's the lead oxides and the dross that floats to the top that's the
nasty. It's water soluble and can be absorbed through the skin. Doc
told me to wear gloves.
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