Major diameter of external thread

The nominal size of a thread is the major diameter of the internal thread, or the nut. In other words the tap's major diameter. This is the same for metric and imperial threads.

When cutting an external thread on the lathe, the stock must first be turned to the proper diameter.

When watching machinists on Youtube, even the very experienced ones, they all turn their stock to the nominal size, and they all end up with a tight fit. Not understanding what has gone wrong, they will often call it a "machinist's fit" and ignore the problem.

I have searched and searched, but I have not been able to find a table or formula that tells me the proper size to turn the stock to before cutting external threads on the lathe.

What am I missing?

Reply to
Robert Roland
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Reply to
John B.

The nominal size of a thread is the major diameter of the internal thread, or the nut. In other words the tap's major diameter. This is the same for metric and imperial threads.

When cutting an external thread on the lathe, the stock must first be turned to the proper diameter.

When watching machinists on Youtube, even the very experienced ones, they all turn their stock to the nominal size, and they all end up with a tight fit. Not understanding what has gone wrong, they will often call it a "machinist's fit" and ignore the problem.

I have searched and searched, but I have not been able to find a table or formula that tells me the proper size to turn the stock to before cutting external threads on the lathe.

What am I missing?

RoRo

---------------------- If the threads fit there isn't a problem.

According to Machinery's Handbook the Unified tip truncation is 0.125X the vee thread height and the pitch diameter is 0.375X below it. Your answer could be figured from the depths of sharp vee and Unified threads and the pitch diameters, which are in different tables. Then add the tolerance for the class of fit. I'd put the data in a spreadsheet and then compute and print the 29 degree infeed for each pitch on a copy of the threading gearbox chart.

It looks to me like the OD can be the nominal size in the maximum material condition so that's how I cut them, and commercial nuts and tapped threads fit. Custom parts don't have to be universally interchangeable and I think a closer fit with greater root diameter is stronger. The OD of several of my

4-flute 1/4-20 taps averages 0.252" and the tap must be my gauge, not the book value.
Reply to
Jim Wilkins

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Cheers,

John B.

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There's your answer, thanks John. The diameter can be the nominal value for a 3A fit and only 0.001 or so less for 2A. If you want to virtue signal you could use half way between the min and max.

Reply to
Jim Wilkins

"Jim Wilkins" snipped-for-privacy@gmail.com on Sat, 9 Sep 2023 07:47:34 -0400 typed in rec.crafts.metalworking the following:

A thing to remember is that there are also three levels (iirc) of fit - loose (smallest bolt, largest hole), "normal" - what we're all used too, and tight (largest bolt and smallest hole). [I'd have to stop and go look up the technical terms, it has been a while.]

Reply to
pyotr filipivich

A thing to remember is that there are also three levels (iirc) of fit - loose (smallest bolt, largest hole), "normal" - what we're all used too, and tight (largest bolt and smallest hole). [I'd have to stop and go look up the technical terms, it has been a while.] pyotr filipivich

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Threads cut on a lathe are almost certainly for a specific task, not general sale, and can be as tight or loose as the task requires, regardless of the established tolerance classes.

Reply to
Jim Wilkins

"Jim Wilkins" snipped-for-privacy@gmail.com on Sat, 9 Sep 2023 12:26:36 -0400 typed in rec.crafts.metalworking the following:

Ayup.

Just make sure they're correct form.

Instructor knew of a situation where the large nuts to secure an industrial pressure cooker would not come off (ruining the batch of whatever). Turns out the threads were at 55 degrees, and had fit going on, but the pressure / heat / etc had made them deform and seize. Oops.

Reply to
pyotr filipivich

"Jim Wilkins" snipped-for-privacy@gmail.com on Sat, 9 Sep 2023 12:26:36 -0400 typed in rec.crafts.metalworking the following:

Ayup.

Just make sure they're correct form.

Instructor knew of a situation where the large nuts to secure an industrial pressure cooker would not come off (ruining the batch of whatever). Turns out the threads were at 55 degrees, and had fit going on, but the pressure / heat / etc had made them deform and seize. Oops. pyotr filipivich

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Whitworth, just different enough to cause trouble. I have an old horizontal bench mill with a 1/2"-12tpi drawbar thread.

Whitworth made a survey of the threads British shops used and took the average for the angle, instead of designing scientifically like Briggs and Sellers in the USA.

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Reply to
Jim Wilkins

Awsome. Thanks.

Reply to
Robert Roland

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