Reply to Annealing Of Silver

Hi Crew,

Sorry about the delay in replying; the clutch went out on my poor Fiero last Friday (actually, not the clutch - I thought the throw-out arm had broken, but it turned out to be just the - now unavailable - slave cylinder bracket. From $$$$ to $$). So I've been sidetracked. I'll just reply to the comments en-masse.

We do this on a regular basis. There is also a Yahoo group devoted to > doing this "sca_moneyer". > > Annealing: > You want to heat it up to where it is just red, and then let it cool. > We usually get about 3 passes before you have to anneal, some times > 2. > > Punching > We used to use the stirrup punches, but they are not great. What > works better and are commonly available, are shim punches. I also > recently noticed one (quality unknown) at harbor freight "46628-3VGA". > ~ $12.00. > > Our group has had custom punches that are essentially the same thing, > (in a single size) made. > > A 2" diameter is HUGE for hand striking, 1" is pretty big but doable. > It depends of course upon how big a hammer you can manage. Some people > in our group prefer a 4 lb hammer swung two handed, I use an 8lb > sledge that I have cut town to about 1 foot. > > Striking a lot of coins also works best as a 3 man operation. A > placer, a die holder and a striker. > > Where are you located? > > jk >

Thanks for the link to the moneyers' group. That's exactly my intent.

I mis-typed the size; I was thinking of 1" dia. I've measured some of the real coins I have, and the sizes for the common denominations are closer to 3/4". A Venetian Gazetta (~1550) is 18 mm dia & 4.25 mm thick; an English penny (~1250) is 17.5 mm dia & 8.75 mm thick. With the metal being relatively thin, I hope the punching of the blanks will be somewhat easy (hah!). The HF punch & die only goes up to 5/8".

I've seen contemporary engravings of a one-man operation - cross-legged on the ground. I guess I'll find out.

I'm in the "mountains" of South Carolina, right next-door to the moonshiners.

Most slip rolls won't be stiff enough to roll down silver ingots. > Maybe a big industrial model might work. Jewelers use a rolling mill > that is considerably stiffer in construction than a typical small slip > roll. What is the thickness of your bars? I have a medium-sized > Durston rolling mill, and the max it can handle is about 6 mm thick. > It has a 4-1 reduction gear, and still requires a LOT of elbow grease > to roll wide ingots. It has 130 mm wide by 60mm diameter rolls, in a > heavy steel plate frame. Compare that construction to a typical slip > roll, and you can see the difference. > > The arch punch will only work on very thin metal -- coin blanks are > too thick, IMO. > > Regards, > > Bob >

I have an Akro Mills roller, only 6'' wide that I picked up at a school district auction. I've rolled some nickels down to about 5 mm, so I hope that it will handle the silver, as well. The nickels did require some real effort, though. Maybe I will have to start with some gentle hammer reduction, using my BAH. I don't know the thickness of the bars offhand. They are the typical 1 troy oz. commemorative bars that I bought at a coin show; some ugly, slightly tarnished zodiac designs for which I paid only 50 cents above market value.

Why do you want to use fine silver? It will wear very fast. Also when > annealing you need to protect it against fire staining/scaling. 99.9 > will not fire stain like sterling silver (95% silver 5% copper) but > will some. You can prevent by using a 50% mixture of alcohol > (denatured hardware stuff) and boric acid (roach kill). Apply the > mixture with brush, lite up and let alcohol burn off. Then using > ox/acty torch with large bushy flame and little on the acty heat to > dull red. Quench after about a minute so the silver does not tear or > crack when you pick it up. Use a pickle to clean the silver before you roll. >

Fine silver was the standard metal for coining in the Middle Ages. Any alloying was considered as nothing more than a debasement of the money (although that was real popular, too).

Thanks for the formula.

Can I ask you to post some pix when you have struck some coins? > (Of the dies, too - or better still, the whole process?) > > This sounds like a lot of fun. > > Jeff >

Sure, I intend to document this process. I probably won't get started until this summer.

Fun is the only reason I'm doing it!

There seems to be some disagreement on the particulars of annealing the silver. I guess I'll experiment with that.

Another question (I haven't had a chance to check the Yahoo group yet): What should I use for the dies? I had thought of some hardenable tool steel, but it would have to be somewhat forgiving about temperature; I am somewhat color blind (doesn't pose too much of a problem, though).

Again, thanks to everyone who replied. I can be contacted directly at jgandalfatmindspringdotcom (the displayed return addy is anti-spam phony).

Joe

Reply to
Joe
Loading thread data ...

It is. You can also use "arch punches or just cut them with shears, or make a special purpose punch like we do.

A god size for pennies.

Striking works better standing.

Meridies?

They work, but are not real fun. THe coins you are talking about are a LOT thinner than modern coins. ~20ga

We roll down ingots that we cast, but they start at ~1/8", and any where from 1" to 1.5" wide. IT does help to taper the leading edge.

A deal

Cold roll steel rod works just fine. THe group of people I do this with usually use that. Personally I tend to use Drill rod, because it has a more consistent diameter and IMHO does not rust as fast.

YOu do not need to harden your die, unless you are going to do a LOT (thousands) and even then it may be easier to just make a new die or touch up your old one.

jk

Reply to
jk

Atlantia (barely). Are you nearby? I just discovered that Meridies has a moneyers guild. Hmmm...

Thanks again for your input. Spring can't come soon enough for me, even in the (so-called) Sunny South.

Joe

Reply to
Joe

I was going to direct you to them. I know Atlantia has lots of SCA moneyers (or it did a few years ago), but I don't know who. I sent you an email with the notes I hand out for the class I teach at Pensic. Hopefully I got your munged email correctly.

jk

Reply to
jk

PolyTech Forum website is not affiliated with any of the manufacturers or service providers discussed here. All logos and trade names are the property of their respective owners.