Shaping Machines (newbie question)

Hi All,
This weekend I'm heading off down to Margate (England) to pick up a small, bench-top, shaping machine. Hand operated. My question to the
group is are there any good books or websites I should be reading to get to grips with this machine?
I'm a metal-working newbie, really. Not a complete beginner; I can MIG weld, saw, drill, tap & have done some basic lathework, so I'm not going to lose an ear to this thing straight off, but I'd be grateful for some advice from y'all. Stuff about tooling, operating hints etc.
I can see the next question: "but what does ye want to use it fer, young'un?". Well, I don't know. Turning perfectly good metal stock into scrap? Fixing broken teeth on my Southbend 9"'s bullwheel? (yeah, I forked up). Making flat surfaces on things that weren't flat enough before?
Thanks in advance,
Zed
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see: Super machines for one off gears, dovetails, etc. You can make the required cutter from a 89 cent HSS lathe tool. Milling machines can do much of the same work faster [one exception is inside splines] but require expensive and sometimes hard-to-find special formed cutters.
Free info http://my.tbaytel.net/jstudio / http://www.google.com/url?sa=U&start=3&q=http://www.green-trust.org/junkyardprojects/FreeHomeWorkshopPlans/Shaper.pdf&e 342 http://home.att.net/~kayfisher/shaper_faq.html http://www.angelfire.com/sc3/shapeaholic/index.html http://www.lathes.co.uk/ [scroll about 2/3 down for shaper section]
not free info [highly reccommend lidsay books] http://www.lindsaybks.com/bks/prshap/index.html They also have several shaper books in their catalog that are not on their web site - Snorri book is very good. or if you want to build your own http://www.lindsaybks.com/dgjp/djgbk/series/index.html
If you don't mind me asking -- what did it cost and can can you bring two back? Picture on the web anywhere? If you have a digital camera see http://metalworking.com/ for information on how to post. Most newsgroups won't accept graphics files. ============================On 6 Sep 2005 06:16:58 -0700, snipped-for-privacy@gmail.com wrote:

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Thanks muchly George, some great sites there, keep me reading for a bit. I have dropped a picture into the Dropbox under 'zed berts shaper' jpg and txt file.
Paying about 60 for it. Don't think theres two going, least down in Chatham-innit ;-) But there are a few around.
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    Hmm ... rather interesting design.
    I *think* that it is missing an actuating lever. It looks as though one belongs between the big stripper bolt to the right of the slide and the one behind the clapper box on top of the slide. I think that it would be two parts, hinged between them, or perhaps with an elongated hole (through slot) for one of the two stripper bolts.
    Also -- it looks to me as though the angle-plate base is designed to bolt down to a heavy-duty workbench, and the ram, cross-slide and (missing) lever assembly should be bolted to the table *behind* it. The T-slots should be used to secure the vise and/or the workpiece directly. (And you probably will need a provision for height adjustment of the assembly -- unless that the thing expects you to bolt another table with vise and workpiece to the front T-slots and *that* will provide the vertical adjustment.
    The clapper and toolpost look somewhat unusual, too. Is that blue tool in a groove, or is there just a hole behind the back end of it giving that impression? You want to be able to angle the tool (separately from the travel of the clapper dovetails) so the tool lifts cleanly free on the backstroke.
    Still -- it looks like an interesting way to go if you don't have a powered one -- and perhaps even a nice thing to have even if you *do* have a powered one, depending on the delicacy of the work being done.
    Are there any instructions with it? Those should help you to see what the lever and link should look like. (Or does he have them around somewhere, and just not mounted for the purpose of making it take up less room?

    I think that you will have a fun tool out of this.
    Enjoy,         DoN.
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Hi Don,
The lever assembly has been removed but is available. Probably takes up a lot of space in shop with that sticking out. Shouldn't be problem to post another pic when I get it home and on my bench.
I think it is a blue tool in the holder, looks like part a set of standard lathe tools you can get over here. Traditional shaper tools are cranked in some-way, is that correct? But ought not to be problem using readily available lathe tool bits?
I was thinking of mounting a vice on an angle plate using hex-bolts (maybe coach-bolts as there are some already on it) and then using the shaper to make up some proper t-nuts to fit.
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On 8 Sep 2005 06:31:41 -0700, snipped-for-privacy@gmail.com wrote:

Hi Bert,
Curiosity led me to do a google search and I found this:
http://www.lathes.co.uk/adeptshaper/
Your image in the dropbox looks really similar to these small Adept shapers. Neat stuff. When you find out the name/model, please post a follow up with it will ya?
--
Leon Fisk
Grand Rapids MI/Zone 5b
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I've got it home & on the bench. It seems to be the remains of an 'Arrow' shaper, at least looking at lathes.co.uk.
I've posted some more pics in the dropbox.
Does anyone have more detail on the link used for the handle? I've got the handle that came with it, that the previous owner made, but it seems awkward.
Cheers,
Zed
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On 18 Sep 2005 14:25:52 -0700, snipped-for-privacy@gmail.com wrote:

From the looks of it I'd say that there definitely needs to be a link between the fixed pull point and the handle. That would bring the handle more inline with 90 deg for maximum pull power.
Wayne Cook Shamrock, TX http://members.dslextreme.com/users/waynecook/index.htm
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The handle does hit the handwheel Don, but mounting it the otherway round makes it impossible to get a good pull. The handwheel seems to be something that's been chucked on at some point, I don't think it's original. A smaller wheel or some-sort of ball-ended handle, as per a lathe cross-slide may be in order.
LOL yes it's not a comfortable handle to hold!
Looking at other hand-power shapers on lathes.co.uk, they all have the handle pulling across the machine, but they do seem to have some sort of flexible link as you say, Wayne. But I havn't seen a clear enough pic to understand how it works. Does anyone have a pic or a drawing? Is it like the hinge on a double-swing door?
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    Or a dogleg to raise the handle above the handwheel by enough to clear the knuckles of the pulling hand. Perhaps with an upright handle coming out of the top. Something like this (use a fixed pitch font like Courier to view without distortion):
/ \ / \ Turned | | Handgrip --> | | taper and polish | | like the crank | | handles on a | | lathe or mill | | / \ | | -----------------------------+ / | pivot / ---------------------------+ |<--- slot ------>| | / / V / / <---- Dogleg to clear handwheel. +------------------------------ / | | | | | / +---------------------------------

    Indeed so.

    I don't have either -- but I'll sketch out what I think it *should* be like. This time, it will be a top view:
| RAM | | | | _____ | | / \ | | | ( ) | | <--- Ram pivot | | | | | | | | | | link| | frame | | | | pivot | | | | | | | | | V | | _________________________________________________ | |/ | | ~~~~~~~ | / ( ) | | ( ) Hand Lever | \\____/ | | \__________________________________________________ ~~~~~~~~~~ | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | |
The length of the link should be enough to accommodate the radius of the end of the lever swung around the frame pivot so most of the pull is still straight along the ram. The link will swing from side to side a bit -- probably no more than +/- 30 degrees. The greater the angle, the more the thrust will be sideways instead of along the ram's travel distance.
    Play with a cardboard model (to full scale) to see what happens, and adjust the lengths to work with the fixed point of the frame pivot and the travel of the ram. Once you have something which looks good, make it in metal. This should eliminate the need for the sliding fit on that long slot in your existing handlever. (You could even make a trial set using wood, to see how it feels driving the ram with it.
    Good Luck,         DoN.
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    Hmm ... are you sure that it doesn't go the other way around? Would it hit the handwheel? (That looks rather large.) If so, perhaps the original handle should have a dog-leg in it to clear the handwheel. And it *certainly* should have the end shaped to make a much more comfortable handle. (Hmm ... or perhaps be drilled so a round handle can be put in vertically above the lever.)
    Good luck,         DoN.
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On 18 Sep 2005 14:25:52 -0700, snipped-for-privacy@gmail.com wrote:

Hi Zed,
Take a look at this Adept page:
http://www.lathes.co.uk/adeptshaper/index.html
Especially this image:
http://www.lathes.co.uk/adeptshaper/img0.gif
I think you may need a similar setup for the handle, except it would be on the left side of your shaper.
--
Leon Fisk
Grand Rapids MI/Zone 5b
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Cheers Don & Leon! All good stuff. Looking at the pics & your drawings, and looking at my machine, it seems mine is backwards!
So, off with the ram, turn the base round and it's much better now :-) frame pivot point is rear left instead of front right.
Had a check through the stock pile, and found some nice bits of strap pre-drilled with some nicely spaced holes. Just need to chop them to an approximate length and start experimenting!
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OK. So,
Do any of you clever people know the name for that particular feeling you get when the sawing machine stops, you carefully remove the work, wipe the chips off, nicely de-burr the ends, and then realise you have, with care & precision, marked it out one hole too short? And that you have neatly transformed one long piece of stock, full of potential, into two shorter, much less useful, bits of scrap?
Still, tomorrow is another day. The stock was free from a skip (dumpster) diving excerise, and, maybe, I have learned something.
I think what I learned is I need to employ a midget to follow me around my workshop shouting 'measure twice, cut once!'.
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On 20 Sep 2005 14:56:56 -0700, snipped-for-privacy@gmail.com wrote:

Order the t-shirt from Scott Logan. http://store.lathe.com/tandvi.html
Pete Keillor
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On Tue, 20 Sep 2005 19:58:47 -0400, with neither quill nor qualm, Pete

$18 + $8ish UPS? Wow, mine are only $10 + $3 s/h. (But I don't have that particular saying.)
The sign in my shop says "Measure Once, Curse Twice." I'm thinking of redoing it to "Measure Once, Curse Repeatedly."
---------------------------------------------------------------- * Blessed are those who can * Humorous T-shirts Online * laugh at themselves, for they * Comprehensive Website Dev. * shall never cease to be amused * http://www.diversify.com ----------------------------------------------------------------
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On Wed, 21 Sep 2005 13:31:57 -0700, Larry Jaques

How about "Cut once, curse repeatedly"
Sigh
Gunner, who cut it 3 times and its still too damned short

"Pax Americana is a philosophy. Hardly an empire. Making sure other people play nice and dont kill each other (and us) off in job lots is hardly empire building, particularly when you give them self determination under "play nice" rules.
Think of it as having your older brother knock the shit out of you for torturing the cat." Gunner
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............. and reach for the welder. BT,DT.
PDW
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On Fri, 23 Sep 2005 10:26:39 +0100, Peter Wiley

Or the splice strips if it was the last 2x4 in the rack....sigh
Gunner
"Pax Americana is a philosophy. Hardly an empire. Making sure other people play nice and dont kill each other (and us) off in job lots is hardly empire building, particularly when you give them self determination under "play nice" rules.
Think of it as having your older brother knock the shit out of you for torturing the cat." Gunner
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On 20 Sep 2005 14:56:56 -0700, snipped-for-privacy@gmail.com wrote:

Or a nice engraved plaque that must be moved to activate the power switch. Gerry :-)} London, Canada
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