M090

Currently we all have M070. Mine's the only computer with Vista. I'm wondering about compatibility the other computers in my section that run ProE on XP Pro. Should we all upgrade to the new M090 and is it compatible with XP as well as Vista? We usually have a policy of staying on the same date code.

Currently we all have M070. Mine's the only computer with Vista. I'm wondering about compatibility the other computers in my section that run ProE on XP Pro. Should we all upgrade to the new M090 and is it compatible with XP as well as Vista? We usually have a policy of staying on the same date code.
Nice deal from Dell on the M90: Comes with a choice of Vista or XP, depends on how much you value maintenance and support, cuz there are no PTC-certified Vista configurations of the M90 (or anything else, that I could find). However, if you bought the machines with XP, I'd be expecting some kind of upgrade offer in 6 months. As to the machines, I'm still in doubt as to what 2 duo core machines buys you with Pro/e and 2.33 ghz is not a lot of raw processing power, so, unless apps are capable of using the mulitprocessor support effectively, you've left it to Windows to parcel out the tasks to the processors. Here, the most multithreaded app processing wins. And Pro/e is such a lame, 80s linear program you can't even print and save a file at the same time nor do any real multi-tasking nor multi-threading. Please, someone explain how Pro/e benefits from all this extra capability of 2 dual core processors!??! Well, while the offer above, on most notebook computers, would be high end, it's out of sight on a desktop replacement. If I were in business, I'd buy every one I needed without hesitation. But get it with XP, on the understanding from Dell, that you can upgrade to Vista, sometime in the future, at a nominal fee.
David Janes

messagenews: snipped-for-privacy@q69g2000hsb.googlegroups.com... M90: and support, cuz there are no PTC-certified Vista configurations of the M90 (or anything else, that I could find). However, if you bought the machines with XP, I'd be expecting some kind of upgrade offer in 6 months. As to the machines, I'm still in doubt as to what 2 duo core machines buys you with Pro/e and 2.33 ghz is not a lot of raw processing power, so, unless apps are capable of using the mulitprocessor support effectively, you've left it to Windows to parcel out the tasks to the processors. Here, the most multithreaded app processing wins. And Pro/e is such a lame, 80s linear program you can't even print and save a file at the same time nor do any real multi-tasking nor multi-threading. Please, someone explain how Pro/e benefits from all this extra capability of 2 dual core processors!??! Well, while the offer above, on most notebook computers, would be high end, it's out of sight on a desktop replacement. If I were in business, I'd buy every one I needed without hesitation. But get it with XP, on the understanding from Dell, that you can upgrade to Vista, sometime in the future, at a nominal fee. Now I've just had an email from PTC saying that M090 does not support Vista Enterprise, only Vista Business and Ultimate. Yet Enterprise is a package aimed at businesses, so they can spread payments for multiple licences.

Now I've just had an email from PTC saying that M090 does not support Vista Enterprise, only Vista Business and Ultimate. Yet Enterprise is a package aimed at businesses, so they can spread payments for multiple licences.
Well, I sympathize, I truly do. But, has it occured to you (or them) that you might have made a mistake by buying an unsupported, uncertified system, especially, when the only supporting/certifying agency that matters is PTC? Only now are they "saying" that it's supported on Business/Ultimate, but does the website say that? These are the currently CERTIFIED platforms, NO Vista mentioned: you believe the website or a voice on the phone? Should lawyers be involved? How much money's at stake?
David Janes

messagenews: snipped-for-privacy@k79g2000hse.googlegroups.com... messagenews: snipped-for-privacy@q69g2000hsb.googlegroups.com... M90: > maintenance and support, cuz there are no PTC-certified Vista configurations of the M90 (or anything else, that I could find). However, if you bought the machines with XP, I'd be expecting some kind of upgrade offer in 6 months. As to the machines, I'm still in doubt as to what 2 duo core machines buys you with Pro/e and 2.33 ghz is not a lot of raw processing power, so, unless apps are capable of using the mulitprocessor support effectively, you've left it to Windows to parcel out the tasks to the processors. Here, the most multithreaded app processing wins. And Pro/e is such a lame, 80s linear program you can't even print and save a file at the same time nor do any real multi-tasking nor multi-threading. Please, someone explain how Pro/e benefits from all this extra capability of 2 dual core processors!??! Well, while the offer above, on most notebook computers, would be high end, it's out of sight on a desktop replacement. If I were in business, I'd buy every one I needed without hesitation. But get it with XP, on the understanding from Dell, that you can upgrade to Vista, sometime in the future, at a nominal fee. might have made a mistake by buying an unsupported, uncertified system, especially, when the only supporting/certifying agency that matters is PTC? Only now are they "saying" that it's supported on Business/Ultimate, but does the website say that? These are the currently CERTIFIED platforms, NO Vista mentioned: Do you believe the website or a voice on the phone? Should lawyers be involved? How much money's at stake? The website does say that. It's here:
"Starting with Wildfire 3.0 M090, Windows Vista Business and Vista Ultimate will be supported in both 32 and 64 bit versions. Because PTC's hardware and graphics partners continue to address issues with the Vista platform, certified configurations for Vista will not be available until summer 2007. For additional information about supported platforms when they become available, visit the Platform Support page: "

The website does say that. It's here:
"Starting with Wildfire 3.0 M090, Windows Vista Business and Vista Ultimate will be supported in both 32 and 64 bit versions. Because PTC's hardware and graphics partners continue to address issues with the Vista platform, certified configurations for Vista will not be available until summer 2007. For additional information about supported platforms when they become available, visit the Platform Support page: " Well, it's Summer, '07, so I guess, technically, they got till almost October. The thing I love about that TPI is how many caveats they issue, cya-time. And what's this shit about 'contact GPU vendor for latest OGL drivers'? OpenGL is a system supported function, like GDI. I've never heard of (though I often wondered why not) GPU makers distributing their own OGL drivers. Maybe Vista will do the community a favor by making it take responsibility for OGL support.
So, the main thing I get out of it is wait a couple years, XP's doin' just fine and the benefits of Vista are dubious, (not one has been mentioned, so far). And that's the best that can be said for it. So, aside from some general, personal user benefits, what would be the benefits to a Pro/e setup? Sorry, call me skeptical, but I can't see why anyone would want to upgrade to Vista for a Pro/e setup!
David Janes

messagenews: snipped-for-privacy@n60g2000hse.googlegroups.com... messagenews: snipped-for-privacy@k79g2000hse.googlegroups.com... messagenews: snipped-for-privacy@q69g2000hsb.googlegroups.com... M90: > > maintenance and support, cuz there are no PTC-certified Vista configurations of the M90 (or anything else, that I could find). However, if you bought the machines with XP, I'd be expecting some kind of upgrade offer in 6 months. As to the machines, I'm still in doubt as to what 2 duo core machines buys you with Pro/e and 2.33 ghz is not a lot of raw processing power, so, unless apps are capable of using the mulitprocessor support effectively, you've left it to Windows to parcel out the tasks to the processors. Here, the most multithreaded app processing wins. And Pro/e is such a lame, 80s linear program you can't even print and save a file at the same time nor do any real multi-tasking nor multi-threading. Please, someone explain how Pro/e benefits from all this extra capability of 2 dual core processors!??! Well, while the offer above, on most notebook computers, would be high end, it's out of sight on a desktop replacement. If I were in business, I'd buy every one I needed without hesitation. But get it with XP, on the understanding from Dell, that you can upgrade to Vista, sometime in the future, at a nominal fee. you might have made a mistake by buying an unsupported, uncertified system, especially, when the only supporting/certifying agency that matters is PTC? Only now are they "saying" that it's supported on Business/Ultimate, but does the website say that? These are the currently CERTIFIED platforms, NO Vista mentioned: > Do you believe the website or a voice on the phone? Should lawyers be involved? How much money's at stake? The thing I love about that TPI is how many caveats they issue, cya-time. And what's this shit about 'contact GPU vendor for latest OGL drivers'? OpenGL is a system supported function, like GDI. I've never heard of (though I often wondered why not) GPU makers distributing their own OGL drivers. Maybe Vista will do the community a favor by making it take responsibility for OGL support. fine and the benefits of Vista are dubious, (not one has been mentioned, so far). And that's the best that can be said for it. So, aside from some general, personal user benefits, what would be the benefits to a Pro/e setup? Sorry, call me skeptical, but I can't see why anyone would want to upgrade to Vista for a Pro/e setup! I can't see it either. I would have been happy with XP but our IT guy wanted to put it on :-( Vista is apparently better from a security standpoint. Not that I think we had troubles before, and anyway, most of our workstations here are still on XP and the rest are Macs.
It hasn't helped. My workstation is totally locked up now and all I did was try to save a file.

I can't see it either. I would have been happy with XP but our IT guy wanted to put it on :-( Vista is apparently better from a security standpoint. Not that I think we had troubles before, and anyway, most of our workstations here are still on XP and the rest are Macs.
It hasn't helped. My workstation is totally locked up now and all I did was try to save a file.
Well, you're about as secure, now, as you can possibly get, locked up, nothing in, nothing out, absolutely no danger of penetration there, no danger of getting any work done, either. Might as well push the off button and go home, tell your boss to see the big brains in IT about why you can't get any work done. I mean, can you imagine having enough money that you could pay $4k for a machine to get work done and then just watch it sit idle. And then the people, who made the decision that resulted in idling a perfectly good machine, just skate. And the real talent just sits on its hand.
David Janes

The website does say that. It's here:
"Starting with Wildfire 3.0 M090, Windows Vista Business and Vista Ultimate will be supported in both 32 and 64 bit versions. Because PTC's hardware and graphics partners continue to address issues with the Vista platform, certified configurations for Vista will not be available until summer 2007. For additional information about supported platforms when they become available, visit the Platform Support page: " Well, I still say that it sounds like a good six months before anyone should consider putting Pro/e on a Vista machine (and expect to get any work done.)
David Janes

Our IT guys have put in another hard on my workstation and set up XP on it, then reinstalled ProE and my other applications. They wanted to keep my old setup in case XP didn't improve things. And it hasn't! I'm still going slow (at times). Another guy has M090 on an XP workstation, an older workstation with less grunt than mine and it still goes faster than mine.
So we've come to the conclusion that the problem is the graphics driver. We put an Nvidia driver for the Vista setup and even though it's now on XP we're still using that driver. I don't quite get it, but Nvidia uses DirectX, which I believe is M$'s attempt to oust OpenGL. OGL is embedded in DirectX rather than used directly and the release that DirectX uses is much older then the current OGL version. Something like that. So we're going to try a different graphics card next week.
So the moral of the story is: stay the hell away from Vista for a long time.

Yep,... and we know everyone will forget how slow Vista was/is in a 1-2 years and yet we will waste/spend more to manage the M$ hog. It's called bend over progress... (thank you sir may I have another....)
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in, nothing out, absolutely no danger of penetration there, no danger of getting any work done, either. Might as well push the off button and go home, tell your boss to see the big brains in IT about why you can't get any work done. I mean, can you imagine having enough money that you could pay $4k for a machine to get work done and then just watch it sit idle. And then the people, who made the decision that resulted in idling a perfectly good machine, just skate. And the real talent just sits on its hand.

Actually I'm wondering if the way I construct assemblies is affecting my display. Most of my parts have a merge feature as the first feature, which references back to a master part. I've always modeled this way since before copy geom came along, and as I don't have it in my Pro/Assembly package it seems to be the only way to parametrically reference a master part without making mulitple copy features. The preselect display sure goes haywire with a merge feature in the part. All the surfaces and curves that aren't even displayed all flash momentarily when my cursor moves over the model. Does anybody else hate that preselect function?
nothing in, nothing out, absolutely no danger of penetration there, no danger of getting any work done, either. Might as well push the off button and go home, tell your boss to see the big brains in IT about why you can't get any work done. I mean, can you imagine having enough money that you could pay $4k for a machine to get work done and then just watch it sit idle. And then the people, who made the decision that resulted in idling a perfectly good machine, just skate. And the real talent just sits on its hand.

Actually I'm wondering if the way I construct assemblies is affecting my display. Most of my parts have a merge feature as the first feature, which references back to a master part. I've always modeled this way since before copy geom came along, and as I don't have it in my Pro/Assembly package it seems to be the only way to parametrically reference a master part without making mulitple copy features. The preselect display sure goes haywire with a merge feature in the part. All the surfaces and curves that aren't even displayed all flash momentarily when my cursor moves over the model. Does anybody else hate that preselect function?
Only when I pass over something like a shrinkwrap or large skeleton part and the display just B

It maybe possible to some degree but personally, I'd suggest you switch to copy geometry, it's more flexible.
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messagenews: snipped-for-privacy@k79g2000hse.googlegroups.com... the display just B--OO--GGGG----SSS D--O--W--NNNNNN. Actually, I put the shrinkwrap in there to SIMPLIFY display/regen (so maybe it simplified regen and complicated display!?!) So, maybe just (temporarily) turn off pre-select? And how do you turn off preselect? I can switch to "Annotation" but that only last until the next select, then it goes back to "Smart".

Wish I could do copy Geom, but it's not included in my package.

Edit/select/preferences
gram>> "graminator" wrote in messagenews: snipped-for-privacy@k79g2000hse.googlegroups.com... the display just B--OO--GGGG----SSS D--O--W--NNNNNN. Actually, I put the shrinkwrap in there to SIMPLIFY display/regen (so maybe it simplified regen and complicated display!?!) So, maybe just (temporarily) turn off pre-select?