UP logo license: letter response

We had a Big Boy here (Sacramento) for the opening of the Calif. RR Museum in '81. Got to catch it and also a Daylight as they came into town from Roseville.

Fancy talk for "We made some new commercials."

Doesn't the UP own just about every inch of rail west of Cleveland that CP doesn't? Why would they need to advertise. In a lot of places they're the only game in town.

On a modeling-related note, Consolidated Freightways near the Milwaukee airport is having a bankruptcy sale. Did the firm go under? I haven't seen CF trucks in quite a while.

Jay CNS&M Wireheads of the world, unite!

No Big Boy in Sacramento. 'T'was a Challenger. As far as I know, UP doesn't have a Big Boy that is operational in their stable anymore. I have heard that there are several private Big Boy restoration projects. Any one have further info?

+GF+

The DRGW coal cars with the "Mainline Through The Rockies" logo looked like fresh paint.

I doubt it...there's still plenty of old paint jobs out there with old, faded logos. Just because the paint isn't fresh doesn't mean they're public domain...

Also, when UP finally hauls someone into court for trademark violation, it's going to be the defendant's responsibility to prove that UP hasn't been protecting their trademark, not UP's responsibility to prove that it has. After all, the simple act of taking someone to court is proof that UP is protecting its trademark.

--Dan

The Age of Steam Museum in Dallas has a Big Boy and what a magnificent machine it is. There was talk about restoring it back to operating condition but I've heard nothing about it for some time now. Bruce

Come, on, William (Wilhelm?), don't sugar coat it. Tell us what you really think :)

Ed

in article snipped-for-privacy@nap.mtholyoke.edu, snipped-for-privacy@mtholyoke.edu at snipped-for-privacy@mtholyoke.edu wrote on 10/8/03 11:46 AM:

Mr. Kaiser's letter deleted...the above says it all!@\

There are still several locos in the D&RGW & SP schemes running out of Sacramento. Old, fading, etc. but still active....

+GF+

The same for that automobile dealership who put their logo on your car!

--Dan

I seriously doubt that. I think you would find that it was the Challenger. That would have been one of its trip running on coal though. There are only a few Big Boys about all of which are static displays. Well I guess the "static" one here in Denver moved from the old museum site to the new one but even that trip (about 3 miles) took over six months. They removed the drive rods and pulled it.

Quote from Union Pacific, "If you restored it where would you run it?" There is only a few stretches of 60 miles or so in the middle of nowhere that they could run. The UP has a hard enough time running the 8444 without tearing their curved rails to shreds, which is why they don't take it to Seattle anymore. Last time it cost them several hundred thousand dollars fixing track that it tore up.

But now they are only considering their own track. I've been wondering about the BNSF from Dodge City Kansas to Raton New Mexico. The old race track. They used to use 2-10-2 helpers so I would think the curves are plenty big enough for an 8 coupled and the track itself used to be class

5 (HO code 100!). I understand they've downgraded to class 4, but it has potential.

Bruce Fav> The Age of Steam Museum in Dallas has a Big Boy and what a magnificent

Yep, it was. Ah, well, 22 years ago . . . at least I remembered it was articulated.

Information on the 8 surviving Big Boys and where they are parked is here:

also links to other BB information.

Another nice quote: "Steve Lee (head of UP's steam program) has also stated that it wouldn't make much sense for UP to restore a Big Boy, as there are only two places on the entire system that are large enough to turn a Big Boy, and those places are only a few miles apart. "

A few years ago, a guy claimed that he had backing to make a movie with a Big Boy, and that the movie would fund the restoration of an engine. He even had a website going on it. And claimed some preliminary work was done accessing the state of the unit choosen. However, he never came through and the whole project, such that is was?, died.

Dave.

Lets see, the UP letter stated "From a legal perspective, we are obligated to protect our trademarks in all areas or risk losing the right to protect them. This includes the trademarks of our historic and constituent railroads, most of which we still use as transportation marks."

Sounds to me that their (UP) legal eagle decided that some other legal eagle might at some point have a legal case to abuse their trademark. This can turn into a "which came first, the chicken or the egg" argument.

As far as your assertion that "Its a marketing decision by UP", if it is so be it. It's their right to do so, and its your right to boycott any company's product that pays their royalty / signs their agreement.

Its also your right to publically bitch about their policy in this newsgroup. And it's my right to rant and rave about the letcherous legal bastards that are running this country into the ground, one of which whose legal assessment of their need to protect their trademarks you don't agree with.

Best regards, Jerry Zeman

I don't know how anyone could ever tell those dirty, smelly old black things apart anyway . . .

CTucker Internalcombustion, NY

Yeah, well, your car went belly up, dinnit Cyclops?

The alternative up.rr's request, on their licensing of their logo is to have ALL model manufacturers regardless of scale stop producing u.p.rr models this also includes MICROSCALE u.p.rr decals. Also have all model rr dealers sell off their u.prr store stock or send it back to the manufacturer. most dealers would rather sell than send back. If this is done/should happen it would hurt u.p.rr and not just in the licensing courts but financially..

Steve!!

We do not attack America's icons*, leave ours alone!!

Steve Magee Newcastle NSW Aust Connosieur of Barossa and Hunter Valley Reds, Holdens and Vegemite.

• - except your newest Governor, of course. :)

You can always tell someone who has only heard about Vegemite, but never actually tried it. It is actually quite delicious eaten on whole grain bread. Tim-Tams on the side. Lambingtons after tea.

Actually made some lambingtons recently. I rather enjoyed them. Now, where did I put those Witchetty Grubs..?................F>

Uh, no that's not the alternative. The alternative is a flat, reasonable annual fee that is affordable by all manufacturers. We seem to be going around in circles - there seems to be a belief that the UP can't protect their trademark without charging a percentage of gross sales. That's just not true, as other RRs have come up with more reasonable agreements and protected their trademarks.

I think its interesting that the letter from UP *did* allude to the fact that, uh, some manufacturers might be free to negotiate their own deal. Ya think? :-) Again, look at those who have already signed - do you really think they've agreed to hand over their tooling to UP in the event that the UP, on a whim, cancels their license? Right.

Andy

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- Pre-Interstate Urban Archaeology

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