Advice Needed: Doing Zagi right...

Hi Guys,
I've been out of RC for 5 years and I saw some park flyers locally flying Zagis and doing a little combat. I thought that looked like a
blast and I'd like to get involved.
I don't mind paying extra for better stuff, I'd prefer to do it "right" the first time than buy and waste money upgrading soon thereafter.
If you were starting over would you get a ZAGI combo or would you piece it together using better components? A different brand/model plane? What gear would you guys recommend? (I need everything including radio) Thanks in advance for any thoughts!! John
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This would depend on a couple of factors! What is your budget? What deal can you get on a combo pack vs individual components. If you plan on staying with park flyers then individual probably is the best way to go. If you plan on getting into IC powered planes then a better model of radio upgrade would be recommended! Have fun!

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wrote:

Let's say $500-$600 more or less to get started. If I can get away with less that would be a good thing of couse :-)

I'll probably stay electric since the good flying fields are all far from my house, but several large parks are close by. I would like several different planes. Plus I really want to do combat mostly.
I thought some of the new radios with digital trim and multi plane memory looked kinda cool, but wasn't sure if they were good or needed for Zagi style flying. Do the benefits they offer justify the extra cost.
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JHenry wrote:

Might as well get a computer radio so the elevon mixing is there without having to get an external one.
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says...

If I'm competing with someone, I like the odds to be fair. If you show up to a race with an OS, and the other guy has a Nelson, there's not a whole lot of fun to be had by either person.
Ask these guys if they are flying stock Zagi's, and which model. I think the 400X is still the most common. It flies well stock, but is much improved with a brushless motor. But you aren't going to find them happy to compete with you if you are running circles around them.
As far as the radio, the 3 channels that trick rc sells aren't going to do you a lot of good on anything else. I'd personally buy at least a 4 channel radio, and make sure it has elevon mixing. If it says v tail mixing, that's ok too. You might find the best value in a 6 channel radio, because not many 4 channels have the mixing. Sites such as servocity.com have packages that will work. Remember that you will only need two servos, and they need to be smaller than the stock sizes. The HS 81 MG is a good servo to use. I haven't seen any combo's with the Metal geared servos, so you may have to buy the components seperately to get the best value. Got a budget? On the cheap end, I would get the laser 4 transmitter (55 bucks) and hs 81 mg's from servocity, and an r4p receiver from balsapr.com, about $25 with crystal
Last but not least, you will need a charger and extra batteries. Trick's price on the 1400's is good. You might save a buck or two at some of the other sites, after you figure in the connector. For the charger, there's many options from about 50 bucks up to about 130 for the Triton. If you've got a budget, you can get some good advice here on which to go with.
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JHenry wrote:

I think with hindsight I would go for
Zagi electric, but sling out the motor. Mega 16/15/4 (or /3 if you want to live very dangerously) Castle creations Phoenix 25 ESC (or 35 for serious mayhem) 8xKAN 1050 cells, or 8x 4/5 FAUP cells, or even 3s3p 1200 LIPO for serious mayhem...

Not if you like the zagi experience.

won't comment on radio. What the other guys around use that works. Maybe a BERG reciever. Hitech HS55 servos for reliable light weight. Maybe the next servo up if very fast model?

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Get a Zagi 400X. If you think you will go further into the hobby, get at least a Hitec Flash 5X radio system with the micro flight pack (HS81 servos, 555 receiver, etc.). Upgrade the servos at time of purchase to HS81 metal geared servos. Trust me. The Zagi 400X equipped with the above will be plenty fast enough. Once you master it, upgrade to the 4014 cobalt motor/prop combo that Zagi sells. You can use the same battery pack and speed controller as came with your stock 400X.
--
Dan
KE6ERB
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The Zagi XT is a riot to fly. Mine has a bad habit of snapping on tight loops. Has a mind of its own on which way it will snap though so it keeps your adrenaline flowing.
Sherman
Fubar of The HillPeople wrote:

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Friends don't let friends fly Zagis!

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| Friends don't let friends fly Zagis!
Fortunately, my friends let me fly whatever I want. And vice versa.
I've had a lot of fun with my Zagis and similar planes ...
| | > Hi Guys, | > | > I've been out of RC for 5 years and I saw some park flyers locally | > flying Zagis and doing a little combat. I thought that looked like a | > blast and I'd like to get involved. | > | > I don't mind paying extra for better stuff, I'd prefer to do it | > "right" the first time than buy and waste money upgrading soon | > thereafter.
Skip the usual Hitec 555. Get a FMA M5 receiver from www.radicalrc.com instead (it's lighter and better, same price.) Get a pair of HS-81MG metal gear servos from www.servocity.com. (Metal gears will handle much more abuse than nylon ones. And you're likely to abuse them.)
Use any transmitter you want, but it does need to have mixing. (Or you could buy a mixer to put in your plane, but few do that.) Getting something with at least 4 channels would be wise, because you could use it with other planes as well. But if you're on a budget, Hitec sells a decent 3 channel transmitter with mixing.
Stay away from the Hitec Feather receiver -- it's crap. The FMA M5 costs about the same and is a far better receiver. (The Hitec 555 is good, but it's larger than the M5 and not quite as good.)
A `lost plane alarm' like the Hobbico Air-Alert ($15 at towerhobbies.com) is cheap insurance. Since these planes tend to be very tough, you'll try things you wouldn't dare with another plane, and you'll lose it. The beepers can make this MUCH easier -- it's amazing how hard a plane can be to find in a patch of trees! Don't forget to put your name and number somewhere on your plane and battery packs (for an electric), just in case ...
| > If you were starting over would you get a ZAGI combo or would you | > piece it together using better components? A different brand/model | > plane? What gear would you guys recommend? (I need everything | > including radio)
www.combatwings.com makes some really good Zagi-like planes. They're probably a little better than the comparable Zagi planes. I've got an XR (glider) and a XE2 (electric) and both are very good. (I've also had a Zagi 400 and 400x.)
Whatever you get, cover it in Ultracote rather than packing tape. It looks much better and will have less drag.
Having the servo arms go down into the wing rather than up out of it looks better and is more resistant to damage. (The control rod will then go through a tube and come out of the foam near the elevon.) I'm sure one of the modification pages talks about doing this ...
If you get a Zagi 400x, don't mount the radio in front of the battery like the instructions say -- mount it off to the side instead, or under the tray. Bury it in the foam. Otherwise, in a crash your battery will smash your receiver.
http://www.yourzagi.com/build.htm#adhesives is your friend. EPS foam will dissolve if you use the wrong type of glue on it!
If you're going electric (rather than glider) a brushless motor will really improve the performance of your plane. But it'll cost a good deal more.
There's literally dozens of pages out there on zagi modifications, and most of them apply to other foam flying wings as well. Put `zagi modifications' into google and see what you get. http://www.yourzagi.com is a good one to start with ...
--
Doug McLaren, snipped-for-privacy@frenzy.com
Heavy, adj.: Seduced by the chocolate side of the force.
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JHenry wrote:

Go mad, get a 3s2p LIPO pack and an astro 109 charger..

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says...

Sure, if you tell us what plane/motor combo you decided on :)
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Right now I'm leaning toward the XE2 with a Phoenix 25 and either a Himaxx 2025-4200 or Mega 16/15/4 (or 3). Not sure about the size on the Himaxx, it appears to be sorta new and I haven't seen anyone using it on a wing. They are only about $50. A lot of people seem to have a Mega on their Zagi though.
Also, does the Triton battery charger handle LiPoly well. I can't really figure out why someone would buy a dediated LiPoly charger for the same price as the Triton when it handles all 3 types.
Am I missing something there?
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You might check out Astroflight. They offer the 803Z specially tuned pusher system for the Zagi. List is $180.
www.astroflight.com
David

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| >Sure, if you tell us what plane/motor combo you decided on :) | | Right now I'm leaning toward the XE2 with a Phoenix 25 and either a | Himaxx 2025-4200 or Mega 16/15/4 (or 3). Not sure about the size on | the Himaxx, it appears to be sorta new and I haven't seen anyone using | it on a wing. They are only about $50. A lot of people seem to have a | Mega on their Zagi though.
The Zagi 400x and XE2 are very similar, so whatever works well on one will probably work well om the other.
One note about the XE2 -- I got two of the 1500 mAh AUL packs that they suggest -- they can't really handle the power demands of the Astroflight 020 I have on it. A full throttle flight will get the battery so hot that the shrink wrap will shrink further.
I opened up a slot where some air can flow over the battery, and it helped, but even so -- this battery really can't handle the current draw of my brushless motor (which will draw about 20-25 amps at full throttle on the ground with a 6x3 prop.) The next battery packs I buy will probably be made of the the 1700 AU cells that Zagi sells (of course, they'll need to be arranged differently.) I may also try some Li-Poly cells, though I've never tried them before -- perhaps the right 3s2p pack will work ...
| Also, does the Triton battery charger handle LiPoly well. I can't | really figure out why someone would buy a dediated LiPoly charger for | the same price as the Triton when it handles all 3 types.
I've never tried a LiPoly cell on my Triton, but I have no reason to believe it doesn't handle them well. | Am I missing something there?
I doubt it. Actually, you can probably get cheaper LiPoly-only chargers than the Triton -- but I'd suggest the Triton anyways. I use mine on my receiver packs, transmitter packs, power packs, cordless phones, power tools, you name it.
--
Doug McLaren, snipped-for-privacy@frenzy.com
The probability of someone watching you is proportional to the
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I cut a small square hole in the flat plastic on the ends of the KR-1700AU Zagi packs I have - that allows some airflow through the center of the pack. Helped mine stay somewhat cooler.
David
On Fri, 19 Dec 2003 05:01:58 GMT, snipped-for-privacy@frenzy.com (Doug McLaren) wrote:

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JHenry wrote:

Murphy's Law. "The battery you plug into the charger will not be the one (type) you have the charger set up for."
Woomph!

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Check out this site for your wing; www.combatwings.com
The combo gives you everything except the radio. If combat is your thing, then a HiTec 3 channel will easily do the job and it isn't expensive. Check it out.

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