OT: Suggestions needed

I notice that no one is advocating the use of high carbon forged lathe tools in place of coated carbide insert tooling. I notice that no one is advocating the replacement of titanium with wrought iron. All of us would run from the doctor's office if his "cure" was always to apply leaches or draw off a pint or three of blood, no matter what your complaint or symptoms.

Why then do we accept, and indeed most of us insist on, the continuing application of the same old patent medicines and quack remedies for our cultural, societal and economic aches and pains? At some point the majority must stop work long enough to take a deep breath and a long, hard look around and say -- "This ain't working."

Does anyone have a suggestion that does not involve "more of the same only better?"

We are rapidly running out of time and money as individuals and as a society....

Unka George (George McDuffee)

There is something to be said for government by a great aristocracy which has furnished leaders to the nation in peace and war for generations; even a democrat like myself must admit this. But there is absolutely nothing to be said for government by a plutocracy, for government by men very powerful in certain lines and gifted with the "money touch," but with ideals which in their essence are merely those of so many glorified pawnbrokers.

Theodore Roosevelt (1858-1919), U.S. Republican (later Progressive) politician, president. Letter, 15 Nov. 1913.

Reply to
F. George McDuffee
Loading thread data ...

| Does anyone have a suggestion that does not involve "more of the | same only better?" | | We are rapidly running out of time and money as individuals and | as a society....

However corny it might sound, we need to find people who espouse those principles we hold highest - people to whom those principles are more important than their lives, their fortunes, or their sacred honor.

After finding them, we need to act to ensure that they, and not lesser persons, are elected to the highest positions of leadership.

I don't think there's any other way.

-- Morris Dovey DeSoto Solar DeSoto, Iowa USA

formatting link

Reply to
Morris Dovey

George, you plunged right to the center of a point I have beat around before. These time call for our government to be staffed with honorable and intelligent people. That is not what we are offered as candidates.

How do we make that po>

Reply to
Fred R

Fred R"

Reply to
Morris Dovey

Do you really think any independent candidate can win a major election?

I don't.

That is why I think "We" need to take back control of the nomination process itself, an even more difficult job.

Reply to
Fred R

The other problem faced by third parties is that Bill Clinton got elected because of Ross Perot which caused all the right leaning folks to vow to never vote for a third party ever again and George Bush got elected because of Ralph Nader (he got almost 100,000 votes in Florida in 2000) which caused all the left leaning folks (OK, for Ralph it was probably far left) to vow to never vote for a third party ever again.

I think that is why third parties, particularly the Libertarian Party which is arguably the strongest, need to spend some time winning local and state elections to build popular acceptance instead of playing the all or nothing game in Washington.

Steve.

Reply to
SteveF

"F. George McDuffee" wrote

I will say it again: Let's Privatize the National Debt.

Every man, woman, and child in America is now $30,000 in hock to the bondholders. Let's officially split the check. Assign each American his own personal share of the debt, to service or pay down as he sees fit. After all, "people make better decisions with their own money".

We'd have a very entertaining fight to decide who should owe how much. Imagine Gunner arguing for his own share of the debt to go up by $1000 so that Paris Hilton can be spared inheritance tax on her daddy's money.

-- TP

Reply to
tonyp

Fred R"

Reply to
Morris Dovey

EXACTLY. Build the local support first, grow some folks to get them ready. If nothing else, some guy running for President who hasn't been a governor or senator, is going to have a serious uphill climb. SO get them into local elections. Get a few state reps and senators. Get a governor or two going. And _then_ go for the brass ring.

I'd love it if the libertarians would get their shit together on this, but I fear that the very nature of the party is what's keeping that from happening.

Reply to
Dave Hinz

========================= Problem is that figure is an "Enron" discount special. Actual number is far higher.

Unka George (George McDuffee)

There is something to be said for government by a great aristocracy which has furnished leaders to the nation in peace and war for generations; even a democrat like myself must admit this. But there is absolutely nothing to be said for government by a plutocracy, for government by men very powerful in certain lines and gifted with the "money touch," but with ideals which in their essence are merely those of so many glorified pawnbrokers.

Theodore Roosevelt (1858-1919), U.S. Republican (later Progressive) politician, president. Letter, 15 Nov. 1913.

Reply to
F. George McDuffee

Think of what "The Body" Jessie Ventura went through up in Minnesota. He had no support in either party, so what was he able to do?

So a libertarian gets > My personal take is that you'll get more yardage with an end run.

Reply to
Louis Ohland

| Morris Dovey wrote: | || My personal take is that you'll get more yardage with an end run. | | Think of what "The Body" Jessie Ventura went through up in | Minnesota. He had no support in either party, so what was he able | to do? | | So a libertarian gets in. Who will support a libertarian | president within congress?

Those who see something to gain by doing so - and those who see something to lose by not doing so. Both of these things have a lot to do with constituants.

Right now, I think a President who did a good job of communicating honestly with the American people and who could relate choices and actions to principle might get substantial support (although much of it might be given grudgingly given.)

-- Morris Dovey DeSoto Solar DeSoto, Iowa USA

formatting link

Reply to
Morris Dovey

"F. George McDuffee" wrote

So let's throw up our hands and do nothing about it, eh?

In any case, let's get the facts straight. The "actual number", which is "far higher" than $30K per person, is debt we are _projected_ to run up. The $30K is debt we have _already_ run up. There is a practical difference between the $30K balance you are carrying on your credit card, today, and the $50K you are _planning_ to borrow, tomorrow. You _can_ decide, when you actually look at your bill, that you need to reduce your future spending.

But if you _never_ see the bill you have already run up, where's your incentive to do anything different in the future?

-- TP

Reply to
tonyp

The other thing the Libertarian Party needs to do...is limit the Free Dope and Open Borders bunch.

They are the reasons many people shy away from the LP..cause there are simply too many wackjobs wandering around loose in the LP.

Gunner

"If thy pride is sorely vexed when others disparage your offering, be as lamb's wool is to cold rain and the Gore-tex of Odin's raiment is to gullshit in the gale, for thy angst shall vex them not at all. Yea, they shall scorn thee all the more. Rejoice in sharing what you have to share without expectation of adoration, knowing that sharing your treasure does not diminish your treasure but enriches it."

- Onni 1:33

Reply to
Gunner

Indeed. The LP wants change from the top down..and frankly..thats never going to happen. Grassroots is where you start to build a viable party.

Gunner

"If thy pride is sorely vexed when others disparage your offering, be as lamb's wool is to cold rain and the Gore-tex of Odin's raiment is to gullshit in the gale, for thy angst shall vex them not at all. Yea, they shall scorn thee all the more. Rejoice in sharing what you have to share without expectation of adoration, knowing that sharing your treasure does not diminish your treasure but enriches it."

- Onni 1:33

Reply to
Gunner

Okay, so I'm late and catching up, but Gunner wrote on Tue, 13 Jun 2006 02:22:30 GMT in rec.crafts.metalworking :

Electing a mayor (and the tough part - re-electing them) is going to put pressure on the LP like none before. You are going to have to make a very, very persuasive case that filling potholes is not the city's job. Or that social services are to be done by "someone else". Selling off city property to finance the city is not a viable long term plan.

tschus pyotr

Reply to
pyotr filipivich

PolyTech Forum website is not affiliated with any of the manufacturers or service providers discussed here. All logos and trade names are the property of their respective owners.