Wow, fixed my ATC!! And the existential consequences thereof...

Awl--
Finally--FINALLY--got the gonads to delve into the, uh, bowels of my ash-resurrected Fadal, and fixed dat g-d ATC problem. Really quite simple,
thanks to SVL's usual erudite and astute input and help. It was, as he said, simply an alignment problem due to the head having dropped during shipping (removed Z-axis motor due to height clearance problems). The ATC works like new! Interestingly, the problem got un-usably bad after the last move to my place, but also had gotten "sticky" after a previous move--but just PITA sticky. Surely the same issue.
So after the girst move, when the ATC just got sticky, local Fadal came up to fix dat $450 blown fuse on the 4th axis (thank you very much), I said, Yo, whazzup wit dis 4th axis, bea? The fadal guy said, Oh, gotta be a bent ATC spindle, bup bup bup bup buhhhh.... expensive to fix, bup bup bup bup buhhhh..... gotta order the part, bup bup bup bup buhhh..... I said, Yeah, a'ight...
'Ceptin how do you *bend* a gotdamm ATC spindle???? So we just opted to deal w/ the stickiness, hoping God would intervene or sumpn, and in the meantime, just avoided the particularly offending carousel positions--ie, no tools there.
D'ya think he woulda checked the fukn ALIGNMENT at the cold-starting position, fer chrissakes?? D'ya think they woulda had me check my fukn VOLTAGE, fer chrissakes????? Oh, sorry, old thread.... bad memories....
Anyway, moving along existentially, I'm looking at the ball screw I'm twisting, to realign Z0 for the ATC, and I am shocked--and AMAZED (Jessica Hahn, anyone?)--at how *coarse* the thread is on these screws! Man, one turn, and I believe you move about 1/8 to 3/16"!! Wow!! Ahm thinkin, Man, you could get a *whole lot* more accuracy and resolution by just finer-ing up dat thread a little--w/ likely no loss in strength, just probably slower max. feeds/rapids. Mebbe dats how Haas gets their humongo rapids, by making the ball screws a 1-pitch!!??
More existentially, I'm thinking that local dealers have to get a little more on the ball, bruhs, ie, demonstrate a little more "pro-active pre-emptive initiative", and watch our machine-owning backs a little better. Altho I cannot say local fadal has ever ripped me or the previous owner off, and indeed they certainly could have, I *do* get the impression that this whole machine-owning affair is a little like a spider's web, where we, le Bugs, are at times "allowed" to fall into a variety of traps. And then get mercilessly billed, clear up to our duodenums.
I must also say that it seems that a lot depends on *who* you actually talk to at a dealer. Some individuals are simply more pro-active/sympathetic than others. Fortunately, one guy showed great sympathy for my pathetic pyrotechniked ass, and really did me a solid, ito of a referral.
But it could have must as easily gone the other way.
(BTW, at my aluminum supply house, WHO you order from in the *same gotdamm office* can make a 30% difference in your bill. How do I know? Cuz I got pissed one day, and phoned in the EXACT SAME quote to 3 diff. guys in the office.... Nearly fell offa my chair when I compared....)
So anyway, another day in my miserable life, but fortunately w/ a better-working VMC. Greatly appreciate everyone's help here. ---------------------------- Mr. P.V.'d formerly Droll Troll
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On Fri, 11 Mar 2005 22:23:05 +0000, Proctologically Violated©® wrote:

wow ... you only just found out that ALL metal stockists are scammers? thats amazing. I *know* I can get steel prices varying anything from "normal" to +100% around here ... you can tell all metal stockist are scammers because NONE (apart from shop4steel.com) will post prices ever. Not even in the shop.
Soon as you walk in the door, they are eyeing you up "wonder how much he'll pay" ... seriously they ALWAYS try and scam you for every penny ..ever been to s steel stockholder that has prices per-tonne quoted in plain sight? ha. course not .. they quote everyone different, depending on whether you look daft enough to pay their prices or not.
my local steel stockist (Underwoods of Worcester, UK) has tried to charge me over 850GBP/tonne for HR4 plate when the going rate is nearer 520. They must think I'm stupid.
For this reason NEVER think twice about screwing your steel stockist down to the last penny on price. shop around, be tight, demand free delivery, take several quotes and just order the cheapest lots from each one. Remember, do it to them before they do it to you. If you don't beat them down hard on price at every opportunity, they'll see you as a soft-touch.
In the case of your alloy salesmen moving 30% just on ringing 3 different guys in the same office .. that shows you the variation available without even trying .. if you cant beat it down to -50% off the top price by hard-dealing, I'll be suprised.
this message is a public service announcement for the benefit of all those stockholders who have ripped me off over the years.
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Sorry, tripped on m'story.
I said, Yo, Whazzup wit dis *ATC*, bea??
Dat's whut I said... ---------------------------- Mr. P.V.'d formerly Droll Troll

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wrote:

Cliff,
The ATC carousel is supported on a set of belleville springs....and it has a limit switch in order to process an estop and protect it in the case it does somehow get whacked hard.....
IOW.......whoever suggested it was bent was probly blowing smoke up PV's ass
Personally, I doubt I would allow that 'tech' to even enter upon the premises again.
You do have a point though......_dont fix it_ if it's_ not_ broken !!!
--
SVL



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At this point in my PV'd career, I'm grateful when it's just smoke. ---------------------------- Mr. P.V.'d formerly Droll Troll
wrote:

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Proctologically Violated©® wrote: <<Snip>>

<<Snip>>
I've not seen the screw in a Haas, but the pitch on the screw in our Milltronics is about 1. Maybe more, I didn't measure it.
--
Later,

Charlie
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Our Fadals all have inch screws, .200 pitch ( 5 tpi )...but they also use metric screws on some, (not sure what models /vintages)...
Curious, what is the max rapids on those milltronics and wondering if they're running glass scales with such a coarse pitch ???
--
SVL



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PrecisionMachinisT wrote: <<Snip>>

Max rapid is 800 ipm, and the only feedback is from the encoders on the motors.
How's the weather down yonder? Prevailing winds keeping you clean?
--
Later,

Charlie
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That's doing pretty good for that coarse of screws then.....I would guess there is some acceleration parameters that make em a bit jerky on short, high speed movements--but thats only a guess ( that else the servos are oversized quite a bit )

Beautiful--downright gorgeous even, but dry as a bone....the driveway is all dusty like it usually is August or something--whenever a car pulls in it takes a minute or so to clear....we're gonna be in trubble because of the low ( read: none ) snowpack in the cascades.....someone really needs to raise the electric rates down south so them leeches aint sucking our cheap hydropower ( thanks a lot, Governor Gray )........
=== Headlines in the local paper today went something like this :
"Belch confuses scientists"........luckily, no ash came this way...
Hopefully, that beast will settle down again, perhaps into an extended slumber..but in all truth, science really hasn't a clue as to what it might do next, or when.....
Im about 35 miles from the volcano as the crow flies, and so Im safe except for 'fallout'...you do realize that ( if the wind is just right ), you guys could get a whole bunch dumped on you almost as easily as us....
Cheers,
--
SVL



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I'm betting that Mt Rainier pops soon. When I working out in the Seattle area a few years back people made fun of me when I braced the hell out of rails I hung from the ceiling. I told them I did it for seismic reasons, that area is very active with volcanoes around. Hah Hah hah, we don't get no stinkin earthquakes, they said. Well that one that jolted them a couple of years ago changed their tune. It toppled some pallet racks, and slid some damn big molding machines across the floor!
Gary H. Lucas

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Gary H. Lucas wrote: <<Snip>>

It went on, and on, and on, and then it went on some more. I didn't see it happening, but my boss told me the coolant on the floor was actually splashed off the ceiling before it hit the floor. The roads haven't been the same since.
--
Later,

Charlie
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it
Charlie,
You werent old enough, nor were you even around the area for the one happened in ~ 1964 or 1966 or somesuch...
I was in a schoolbus headed to school and the driver pulled off the road and started yelling at all us kids to stop "rocking the bus"....this was in Shelton, maybe 60 miles from Mt Rainer....might have been shocks from that big Alaska quake, not sure.
=== Had an earthquake in Oregon in about 1992 ~1994, I was working graves shift at the ole lazy B with a girl named Theresa White...
(Nice gal, I wonder whatever became of her, and I wish her well if she ever reads this)...( Hi Theresa )....
Anyways....
We were busy changing pallets on the high speed machining centers when the 777 project was just getting underway--no robotic cell at that time, just a pair of twin pallet Mazak horizontals crammed in a corner of the 120 bldg........
She was operating the crane, and I was rigging the hook--the pallet / fixture tool weighed ~1500 lbs, and it was sitting on a wooden pallet, when all a sudden _everything_ took to _shaking_, and a low frequency audiable rumble started at the south end of the building, moving slowly to the north...metal roofing......
I got off of that wood pallet in a hurry, worried that the heavy tooling might upset on top of me...and she then noticed my alarmed state, and said "whats going on???"......
I said "earthquake".....and then she shot out of the building--inna heartbeat...left me standing there holding the hook, dumbfounded.....but by then it was all over...ten seconds tops........
No perceptable damage, a couple bridges along I-5 north of here have had kinduva "bump" since then is all I've really noticed.
--
SVL





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PrecisionMachinisT wrote:

The Alaska earthquake was on a Good Friday at about three in the afternoon, Alaska time. That'd be about six in the evening, your time. We lost two blocks of neighbors into the inlet but got a great view. Never did like them stinking neighbors, anyway. Mom says they're building new houses there now .... boy are people dumb. Or greedy. Or both ! that earthquake lasted for over three minutes. That's a loooooong time for an earthquake. 1964.
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Im thinking this was later then 1965 probly.
http://www.johnmartin.com/earthquakes/eqpapers/00000015.htm
--
SVL



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PrecisionMachinisT wrote:

We can adjust the accel/decell parameters to suit the job on the machine. Sometimes you can get away with a lot. The motors are pretty big. When you undo that last screw you better be ready.

<<Snip>>>
Yeah, That's why I'm glad I don't live in Yakima. Or east of Yellowstone. Hopefully we'll get some rain this summer to offset what we didn't get this winter. People who know me say it's my fault, but I claim no responsibility for anything other than a good guess.
--
Later,

Charlie
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Cliff wrote:

Hey, bud, Some of us like to take comfort in false rationalizations. <g> I expect that one to be world-changing if it occurs. Maybe the smart ones are the ones living at ground zero.
--
Later,

Charlie
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On Sat, 12 Mar 2005 09:28:47 -0800, "Charlie Gary"

When the Yellowstone Cauldera pops again....it will kill all the dinosaurs.
Gunner
"Considering the events of recent years, the world has a long way to go to regain its credibility and reputation with the US." unknown
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Hehe... If the US is ever attacked, I doubt I'll have to worry about it long. I'm about 70 miles or so from ORNL (Oak Ridge National Labratory) and <15 miles from one of only two suppliers of HMX and RDX very high explosives to the military. I can probably just kiss my ass goodbye.
--
Anthony

You can't 'idiot proof' anything....every time you try, they just make
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Anthony wrote:

You could be a general ! i think you're fighting the previous war :-) Hard to predict the future but it seems unlikely that we'll ever see the kind of war Eisenhower and his follow-ons prepared us for. Seems hard to believe that Kennedy was right after Eisenhower, doesn't it ?
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Charlie Gary wrote:

It snowed last night :-( Two days ago too hot to wear a sweatshirt, last night snow. Sheesh.
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