On 21 Feb 2007 04:00:50 GMT, with neither quill nor qualm, snipped-for-privacy@kcwc.com (Curt Welch) quickly quoth:
Mine take only about 30 seconds to warm up after the 3-second two-stage ON sequence (1/4 to 3/4 brightness.) It's a strange phenomenon, isn't it? Kinda like sitting a room when the sun comes out from behind a cloud. Those I'm using were built by Feit Electric. I also got a couple 17w CFLs and find them much more yellow, more like a 75w incan.
-- If it weren't for jumping to conclusions, some of us wouldn't get any exercise.
On Wed, 21 Feb 2007 04:11:56 GMT, with neither quill nor qualm, "Dave Lyon" quickly quoth:
Make that a few million light bulbs. It won't affect GW at all (man doesn't), but it will stretch our power supplies and lower our out- of-pocket costs every month from now on.
The last article I read (WSJ) said they believe that most scientists now think we are causing GW(kumbaya) or GAK. If that's true, we're in a heap of trouble because most scientists must now be braindead and/or on the payroll of folks who'll profit by implementing any replacement technologies or research.
Yeah, and we'll just burn more natural gas to create electricity for powering all the new electric cars and use more natural gas to create hydrogen--from our limited supply of fresh water--to power the fuel cell cars. (What are these people THINKING?)
-- If it weren't for jumping to conclusions, some of us wouldn't get any exercise.
On 21 Feb 2007 06:09:35 GMT, with neither quill nor qualm, snipped-for-privacy@kcwc.com (Curt Welch) quickly quoth:
Yeah, and 1 whole degree celcius in a century will drown us all. ;)
Global Alarmism(kumbaya) (GAK) is the thing which is getting worse, Curt. Real stats show that the global alarmist stats are now being revised downward each time there is a breakthrough in monitoring efficiency and when they include other variables into the modeling which should have been there in the first place. Models are just that, and alarmists have been skewing those to fit their terror for decades now. Read a few more books and you'll see the pattern, Curt, and maybe the truth will dawn on you. _Hard Green_ would be a good start. Huber is a realistic environmentalist who wants to dispel the myths.
Man is but a flee on the back of the Earth. Mother Nature hardly notices us. Yes, I believe we should tread more lightly on the Earth but nothing we're doing is causing GAK. (GAK is a myth, mild global warming is the reality.)
WE'RE ALL GONNA DIE! AYIEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE!
True, it's a smart step and I for one enjoy the whiter/bluer light. I'm saving about $5 a month from 6 most-used fixtures. They paid for themselves in 6 weeks. Good ROI!
The people you accuse of having an agenda are the realists. They don't believe the alarmism. They accept that Global Warming is a reality but know that it is CONSIDERABLY less scary than you'd have us think. And there's not a damned thing in the world we can do to stop or slow it. We're not big enough to take on Mother Nature. And once it has stopped itself, it'll turn around and move toward another Ice Age again. Then it'll repeat the cycle. Ma Nature is patient and does this every 20k years, a lot longer than man has been tracking her.
I can either buy 4 incans or 1 CFL for a buck. The CFL should outlast the incans by about a 20:1 ratio. There is no question which is more efficient, and they're now extremely cheap to outfit.
-- If it weren't for jumping to conclusions, some of us wouldn't get any exercise.
In article , Curt Welch wrote: : :The slow turn on effect for the larger lights can be a real pain at time. :The family likes to joke about it. The recessed lights in the kitchen are :the most noticeable. You turn them on to try and read something but then :you have to wait a couple of minutes for it to get bright enough to do any :good.
The 100W (equiv) CF lamps I bought fairly recently are instant start at full brightness. Not sure where I bought them, probably H-D or Menard's. Logo on the base is "Commercial Electric (TM)". Actually, in the bedroom I much preferred the slow-start variety.
Yes, most people agree that it's real. After all, I haven't seen an ice age around in quite a while. The argument is in what is causing it. I suppose we caused the end of the ice age too? I tried to get the cavemen to stop burning their fires all night, they just wouldn't listen to reason.
I am not convinced that the above is true. I will try to check it, it is easy. The fluorescent layer on the glass does not stop emitting light at the very moment when the gas stops producing UV.
If she has any of the 4' tube fixtures about..simply buy "grow lights" from HD or Kmart etc. They are tuned to the same wave lengths as sunlight, or at the least..the bands most suitable for plant growth.
They work pretty well for my snow belt family and friends.
Gunner
"Liberalism is a philosophy of consolation for Western civilization as it commits suicide"
Hi, The current new generation of fluorescences ( T-8's), use electronic controls and pulse at about 20,000 Hz. They are also much closer to sunlight in color, and more efficient. The U of AZ is paying for the switch with the money saved by reduced power consumption. In many places they were replacing 4-5 year old fixtures which were state of the art at the time.
I have had two 4' fluorescents with solid-state ballast over my lathe for over 20 years and have never observed any stroboscopic effect. The ceiling light nearest my mill is a 23-watt CF but I do have two incandescant task lights on the mill as well. I intend to make a
100-lumen LED (Luxeon K2) tasklight for the mill because the dang incandescant jobs sometimes get in the way. The collimated LED light will be about a 1" x 1" cylinder on the end of a slender gooseneck. The incandescant puts out about 800 lumens, but it sprays it all over the place while the LED can be collimated into a 6" dia region -- so light in the region of interest will actually be whiter and brighter than with a 50-watt (hot!) quartz-halogen.
But so what, there is nothing magic about the 100W number. And at least in traffic light usage, a 20W cluster (actual consumed power) is equivalent to a 100W incandescent. [5 W for turn signals, but that is not a fair comparison)
. . .
A naked LED MAY be able to claim those sorts of hours, but not cluster assemblage, as you will see if you start paying attention to traffic lights. LED cluster can also have color rendering problems (as compared to sunlight or incandescent) just like fluorescent do.
It would have to be a hefty tax to make me a "convert". THe fact is despite the claims on the package, they DO NOT LAST in typical service, they MAY be fine when left on for long periods, but when switch frequently, I would say less than a year is my average. By frequently I mean the sort of service a bathroom light sees.
No, I don't think the world started 5000 years ago.
Maybe you should explain which of all those words and their related concepts is the "stupid" part and why you say it's stupid so we can have a discussion about the issues instead of just playing a name calling game?
Or maybe we should just drop it since it's OT here.
Yeah, I didn't even understand they were doing it when I first started using them. For the slow ones, it really does create an effect that makes you feel like the sun is coming up. Some styles seem to take a lot longer to get bright than others. I don't know if it's because they have different types of electronics in them or whether it's just something simple like an issue of how long it takes to heat up. The higher wattage closed reflector style bulbs are the ones that take the longest for me. The lower open spiral type seem to reach about 80% brightness in seconds.
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