old techniques still in use?

Stan sez:

"You gotta remember that what they were chipping was grey cast iron for the most part or cutting keyways in wrought iron shafts. Most cast iron these days is alloyed to one degree or another, a whole different proposition, and soft wrought iron isn't a current structural material. I've worked on some old tools made out of the old grey stuff. Very soft, you could cut it with a pocket knife. So chiseling parallel grooves in a surface with a cape chisel and peeling off the lands with a wide chisel to get a surface down to size probably wasn't the ordeal it might seem at this remove in time. Grey cast iron was the pine wood of the industrial revolution."

Very good comment on the old ways and the "whys" associated with them. Excellent, Stan!

Bob (loves to see the BS cut thru) Swinney

Lew Hartswick wrote in news:t7OdncenUol4J4TVnZ2dnUVZ snipped-for-privacy@earthlink.com:

I start using the version I heard in the movie 'Witness' with Harrison Ford, during one part you see a tourist group in the background and hear the leader say something about the Amish and pronounce it Aimish. basically Amish with a long 'A' in the front. After all it was in a movie so it must be the right way :)

Bill

============= Thanks for the insight and reminder. The old techniques make much more sense now. Also the reported depth-of-cut and feed rates for the shapers/planers, even with the slow carbon steel tool speeds. Operationally they were working with dead soft aluminum.

Unka' George [George McDuffee]

------------------------------------------- He that will not apply new remedies, must expect new evils: for Time is the greatest innovator: and if Time, of course, alter things to the worse, and wisdom and counsel shall not alter them to the better, what shall be the end?

Francis Bacon (1561-1626), English philosopher, essayist, statesman. Essays, "Of Innovations" (1597-1625).

Asian shops tend to be this way, based on my experience in So. Cal. Small 1-5 employee shops. Larger shops tend to accumulate Some tools over the years, though even they seldom have a bench vise, and an increasingly large number dont even have drill presses. Not all that much second ops stuff that a mill cant do..maybe a cheapy ChiComm drill press with a countersink or deburring tool stuck in it.

Ayup..and I think Crom for those people, for they provide me with my bread and butter.

On Thu, 01 May 2008 07:48:40 +0700 in rec.crafts.metalworking, Bruce in Bangkok wrote,

I have seen them molded from black plastic to foil metal detectors.

It's spelled with an A but the sound is like Au as in Author. ...lew...

Old Order Amish do not use modern technologies, more modern groups live much as we do, those in the middle can drive cars after they have painted the chromium flat black. Gerry :-)} London, Canada

That's Amish

Hey George, You and I are both "old techniques " and while we may not make more or less sense now, we'll get to watch the ride down.

I'm not sure that's a blessing but, in my case at least, I can stick with my standard line- "What the Hell did anyone expect".

Sorry for the HJ but I'm on the road at 4:30 AM and not usually back in the office before 8:00 PM and wanted to poke you and maybe Ed.

Two hours of paperwork and an hour of invoicing and checking bank records beyond that don't leave much time for Usenet.

Commonly known as Black Chrome Mennonites

Q: Do you know why the Amish girl was thrown out of her community?

A: Too Mennonite.

-- Jeff R.

Lew Hartswick wrote in news:4OGdndrpVO7eoofVnZ2dnUVZ snipped-for-privacy@earthlink.com:

Ok....I guess I'm not as funny as I think. I live in Pennsylvania a hop skip and a jump from where the movie was filmed and know how to pronounce it I just thought the movie way was funny. I'd never use it with someone not familiar with the correct pronounciation.

Bill

"Jeff R." wrote in news:481b01d6$0$30462$afc38c87 @news.optusnet.com.au:

My favorite is,

"What does an Amish bride get on her wedding day thats long and hard....... A new last name"

Yea, I know I need help.......

Bill

Are you sure those aren't Meonnites? ...lew...

=========== Be sure and send this to both Paulson at Treasury and Bernanke at the Fed, too late for Greenspan.

Unka' George [George McDuffee]

------------------------------------------- He that will not apply new remedies, must expect new evils: for Time is the greatest innovator: and if Time, of course, alter things to the worse, and wisdom and counsel shall not alter them to the better, what shall be the end?

Francis Bacon (1561-1626), English philosopher, essayist, statesman. Essays, "Of Innovations" (1597-1625).

Okie Dokie I doubt, however, that i could phrase my message nonsensically enough to get their attention. LOL I'm not real good at the "Up is Down" thing and these guys appear to be experts.

The "black bumper" Mennos in Ontario were the Waterloo-Markham group, mostly , and today they don't even paint any chrome that happens to be on the car.

A lot of the old-order Amish (Nafzinger?) don't use zippers on their clothing (hooks and eyes or buttons only) and use NO RUBBER - not even boots or soles or heels on shoes. Iron tires on the buggy. If it didn't exist in about 1540, it is not allowed.

Then there's us "modern mennos"

As I stated earlier, the "Black Bumpers" are a conservative Mennonite group (here in Ontario, generally Waterloo/Markham Mennonites) The old "Western Ontario Mennonite Conference" used to sometimes be referred to as the "amish" conference of Mennonites because many shared common ancenstry and family names (had come from the Amish to the less conservative Mennonites)

The Schwartzentruber Amish are the most conservative (Ohio and Indiana) The Weavers are less conservative, and there are also the "new order".None own or drive cars to the best of my knowlege.

Here in Ontario the "Dave Martin" Mennonites, or the "Reborn" are the closest Mennonites to the Amish in many ways (the "shun" etc) but they use computers and electricity in their businesses - some very high-tech manufacturing in the Yatton/Wallenstein area and it is not uncommon to see them talking on the cell phone on the way to town in the buggy. Most do not use electricity in the home, and they don't own or drive cars -------.

Not necessarily accountant types; but people who've learned machining since everything became CNC. I mean, why on Earth do I need a Bridgeport or (Are you kidding me??!!) a drill press (??!!) when I have a five axis machining center with 120 tools??.

Some don't want to "dirty up" their shops, or appear low-tech to customers. Others truly don't understand (till the downtime hits the fan) that you can't make repairs or patches for a broken machining center when all you have to work with is a broken machining center. There are times when a $75.00 drill press (and someone who knows how to program it), can save a shop thousands of dollars.

KG