Things you never knew about fuelies

Top Fuel Dragsters

One Top Fuel dragster 500 cubic inch Hemi engine makes more horsepower than the first 4 rows at the Daytona 500. Under full throttle, a dragster engine consumes 1-1/2 gallons of nitromethane per second; a fully loaded 747 consumes jet fuel at the same rate with 25% less energy being produced.

A stock Dodge Hemi V8 engine cannot produce enough power to drive the dragster supercharger.

With 3000 CFM of air being rammed in by the supercharger on overdrive, the fuel mixture is compressed into a near-solid form before ignition.

Cylinders run on the verge of hydraulic lock at full throttle.

At the stoichiometric (stoichiometry: methodology and technology by which quantities of reactants and products in chemical reactions are determined) 1.7:1 air/fuel mixture for nitromethane the flame front temperature measures 7050 degrees F.

Nitromethane burns yellow. The spectacular white flame seen above the stacks at night is raw burning hydrogen, dissociated from atmospheric water vapor by the searing exhaust gases.

Dual magnetos supply 44 amps to each spark plug. This is the output of an arc welder in each cylinder.

Spark plug electrodes are totally consumed during a pass. At half way, the engine is dieseling from compression plus the glow of exhaust valves at

1400 degrees F. The engine can only be shut down by cutting the fuel flow.

If spark momentarily fails early in the run, unburned nitro builds up in the affected cylinders and then explodes with sufficient force to blow cylinder heads off the block in pieces or split the block in half.

In order to exceed 300 mph in 4.5 seconds dragsters must accelerate an average of over 4G's. In order to reach 200 mph well before half-track, the launch acceleration approaches 8G's.

Dragsters reach over 300 miles per hour before you have completed reading this sentence.

Top Fuel Engines turn approximately 540 revolutions from light to light! Including the burnout the engine must only survive 900 revolutions under load.

The redline is actually quite high at 9500rpm.

The Bottom Line; Assuming all the equipment is paid off, the crew worked for free, and for once NOTHING BLOWS UP, each run costs an estimated $1,000.00 per second.

The current Top Fuel dragster elapsed time record is 4.441 seconds for the quarter mile (10/05/03, Tony Schumacher). The top speed record is 333.00 mph. (533 km/h) as measured over the last 66' of the run (09/28/03 Doug Kalitta).

There is no existing axle/wheel dyno that measures over 5000 Horsepower. So HP of top fuel dragsters can not be measured, only calculated.

Putting all of this into perspective:

You are driving the average $140,000 Lingenfelter "twin-turbo" powered Corvette Z06. Over a mile up the road, a Top Fuel dragster is staged and ready to launch down a quarter mile strip as you pass. You have the advantage of a flying start. You run the 'Vette hard up through the gears and blast across the starting line and past the dragster at an honest 200 mph. The 'tree' goes green for both of you at that moment.

The dragster launches and starts after you. You keep your foot down hard, but you hear an incredibly brutal whine that sears your eardrums and within 3 seconds the dragster catches and passes you. He beats you to the finish line, a quarter mile away from where you just passed him. Think about it, from a standing start, the dragster had spotted you 200 mph and not only caught, but nearly blasted you off the road when he passed you within a mere

1320 foot long race course.
Reply to
NokNokMan
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The dragster launches and starts after you. You keep your foot down

Wow... never been to the drags, think I might like to go sometime after reading this.

Bet they do make a 'noticeable' racket for some reason...

Erik

Reply to
Erik

A quick google search and I found the source of all this. There's a certain amount of hyperbole involved, which isn't to say that they aren't extremely impressive beasts. The author was perhaps reproducing info he'd been told that he didn't have the maths to check.

1g is 21.94 mph per second.

300 mph in 4.5 seconds is an average of 66.67 mph per second or 66.67/ 21.94 =

3g.

The maximum launch g is under 5 rather than 8. In fact g force peaks a bit into the run as downforce increases tyre grip and then drops again as aerodynamic drag starts to overwhelm power.

All the above gives me some cynicism about things like "fuel/air mixture being compressed nearly solid" but I don't have time to run through the calcs just now.

Dave Baker - Puma Race Engines

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Reply to
Dave Baker

Bloody! Even applying a healthy 50% "fudge factor" them's some pretty impressive numbers.

-- Jeff (don't forget the figures about deafness!)

Reply to
A.Gent

Got to be in the start area, behind a couple Top Alcohol (Fed Mogul class) cars when they launched. That was one I won't forget. And they only peaked around

240-250 mph.

mj

Reply to
michael

On 05 Apr 2004 07:51:45 GMT, snipped-for-privacy@aol.comma (Dave Baker) shouted from the rooftop:

At least some of it was culled from a Car and Driver article.

-Carl "An honest man doesn't need a long memory"- Jesse Ventura

Reply to
Carl Byrns

On Mon, 05 Apr 2004 05:48:40 GMT, "NokNokMan" vaguely proposed a theory ......and in reply I say!: remove ns from my header address to reply via email

Awwh! What? Not _Everywhere_!

**************************************************** remove ns from my header address to reply via email

I went on a guided tour not long ago.The guide got us lost. He was a non-compass mentor.........sorry ........no I'm not.

Reply to
Old Nick

On Mon, 05 Apr 2004 05:48:40 GMT, "NokNokMan" vaguely proposed a theory ......and in reply I say!: remove ns from my header address to reply via email

So is the NokNok pre-ignition or bottom end problems?

**************************************************** remove ns from my header address to reply via email

I went on a guided tour not long ago.The guide got us lost. He was a non-compass mentor.........sorry ........no I'm not.

Reply to
Old Nick

On 05 Apr 2004 07:51:45 GMT, snipped-for-privacy@aol.comma (Dave Baker) vaguely proposed a theory ......and in reply I say!: remove ns from my header address to reply via email

I always watch drag races on TV, although I have only been to two meets. My wife derides me.

But the thing is not the (admittedly rather daft) idea of guys throwing valuable fuel away by the bucket load and never turning a corner. It's the fact that an engine (of which I have rebuilt a couple, and realise the beauty and complexity, timing and tolerance of even a sedan's sedate power module) can fit into the machine you see, and produce such an awesome result.

And then there's the few square inches of "rubber" that allows it all to happen.....we often forget the printer, when we think of the GHZ of the PC. The OP never mentioned tyres, AFAICR.

Jet drags are fun, but do not hold the same awe factor for me.

**************************************************** remove ns from my header address to reply via email

I went on a guided tour not long ago.The guide got us lost. He was a non-compass mentor.........sorry ........no I'm not.

Reply to
Old Nick

On Mon, 05 Apr 2004 07:04:21 GMT, Erik brought forth from the murky depths:

Take both ear plugs and muffs, wear both, and sit back to enjoy the best smell in the world, burned nitro-methane. (OK, second best smell. First is the scent of a woman.)

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Reply to
Larry Jaques

Most every top line racing class has very impressive numbers of some kind, at least once you allow for the rules.

So endurance car engines (LeMans/ACO/ALMS) may make 450hp, or 560hp, or 700hp, depending on class and car weight. On what is almost pump gasoline. Breathing all the air through a little teeny tiny restrictor.

For 24hrs at a time, spending less than 30minutes in the pits for refueling, etc.

And for what it's worth, total running costs are north of $10,000.00/hr, and engine rebuild costs alone above $12/mile or so. (I don't know what the Audi's cost to rebuild, I would assume it's more than we pay to rebuild LMP2 engines.)

Or consider F1, 1300# car, 800hp or so, 2g easy cornering, closing on

4G in some corners. And vastly more expensive than even LeMans cars or Drag cars.

Take you pick, as soon as you "go racing" things get very extreme quickly.

(I'll admit I've always loved the idea of an engine so powerful it cannot be dynoed...)

bmw

Reply to
bryanwi

Some years ago at a local car show, a local top alcohol racer was displaying his rig and fired the motor to please the crowd. Even at idle, I had to practically scream to speak with my wife. We were about

15' from the exhaust. After a few blips, he nailed the throttle once. First time I'd heard something so loud that it went beyond what my ears could register. I could just imagine from that what a top fueler would be like...

Jon

Reply to
Jon Anderson

That was my intuitive feeling. I don't have any personal knowledge of the performance numbers, but I do know that the Corvette going 200 mph will take only 4.5 seconds to go the 1/4 mile. The record holder would catch him .06 seconds before the line. Not within 3 seconds.

Reply to
Bob Engelhardt

Folow one to the pit area and watch the crew tear the motor completely down and rebuild it between rounds. To cool it off.

On Mon, 05 Apr 2004 05:48:40 GMT, "NokNokMan" wrote:

||Top Fuel Dragsters || || || One Top Fuel dragster 500 cubic inch Hemi engine makes more horsepower ||than the first 4 rows at the Daytona 500. || Under full throttle, a dragster engine consumes 1-1/2 gallons of ||nitromethane per second; a fully loaded 747 consumes jet fuel at the same ||rate with 25% less energy being produced. || || A stock Dodge Hemi V8 engine cannot produce enough power to drive the ||dragster supercharger. || || With 3000 CFM of air being rammed in by the supercharger on overdrive, ||the fuel mixture is compressed into a near-solid form before ignition. || || Cylinders run on the verge of hydraulic lock at full throttle. || || At the stoichiometric (stoichiometry: methodology and technology by ||which quantities of reactants and products in chemical reactions are ||determined) 1.7:1 air/fuel mixture for nitromethane the flame front ||temperature measures 7050 degrees F. || || Nitromethane burns yellow. The spectacular white flame seen above the ||stacks at night is raw burning hydrogen, dissociated from atmospheric water ||vapor by the searing exhaust gases. || || Dual magnetos supply 44 amps to each spark plug. This is the output of ||an arc welder in each cylinder. || || Spark plug electrodes are totally consumed during a pass. At half way, ||the engine is dieseling from compression plus the glow of exhaust valves at ||1400 degrees F. The engine can only be shut down by cutting the fuel flow. || || If spark momentarily fails early in the run, unburned nitro builds up ||in the affected cylinders and then explodes with sufficient force to blow ||cylinder heads off the block in pieces or split the block in half. || || In order to exceed 300 mph in 4.5 seconds dragsters must accelerate an ||average of over 4G's. In order to reach 200 mph well before half-track, the ||launch acceleration approaches 8G's. || || Dragsters reach over 300 miles per hour before you have completed ||reading this sentence. || || Top Fuel Engines turn approximately 540 revolutions from light to ||light! Including the burnout the engine must only survive 900 revolutions ||under load. || || The redline is actually quite high at 9500rpm. || || The Bottom Line; Assuming all the equipment is paid off, the crew ||worked for free, and for once NOTHING BLOWS UP, each run costs an estimated ||$1,000.00 per second. || || The current Top Fuel dragster elapsed time record is 4.441 seconds for ||the quarter mile (10/05/03, Tony Schumacher). The top speed record is 333.00 ||mph. (533 km/h) as measured over the last 66' of the run (09/28/03 Doug ||Kalitta). || || There is no existing axle/wheel dyno that measures over 5000 ||Horsepower. So HP of top fuel dragsters can not be measured, only ||calculated. || || Putting all of this into perspective: || || You are driving the average $140,000 Lingenfelter "twin-turbo" powered ||Corvette Z06. Over a mile up the road, a Top Fuel dragster is staged and ||ready to launch down a quarter mile strip as you pass. You have the ||advantage of a flying start. You run the 'Vette hard up through the gears ||and blast across the starting line and past the dragster at an honest 200 ||mph. The 'tree' goes green for both of you at that moment. || || The dragster launches and starts after you. You keep your foot down ||hard, but you hear an incredibly brutal whine that sears your eardrums and ||within 3 seconds the dragster catches and passes you. He beats you to the ||finish line, a quarter mile away from where you just passed him. Think about ||it, from a standing start, the dragster had spotted you 200 mph and not only ||caught, but nearly blasted you off the road when he passed you within a mere ||1320 foot long race course. || || ||

Rex in Fort Worth

Reply to
Rex B

Erik,

When you get the chance, two words of advice / warning

#1 If in the pits, and they start one up, DO NOT stand DOWN WIND, especially if your "up close and personal". I've never seen a crowd disperse so quickly :) The exhaust from the Nitro was so overpowering it was difficult to breath and your eyes watered something fierce. So when you see the crew dawning their Gas Masks, check the wind direction!

#2 Good hearing protection.

Take Care, James Lerch

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Press on: nothing in the world can take the place of perseverance. Talent will not; nothing is more common than unsuccessful men with talent. Genius will not; unrewarded genius is almost a proverb. Education will not; the world is full of educated derelicts. Persistence and determination alone are omnipotent. Calvin Coolidge

Reply to
James Lerch

What's that line from "Apocalypse Now" ? - "I love the smell of napalm in the morning"

Well My line is "there's nothing finer than nitro under lights"

tHAT

Reply to
thehatter

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