Magicalia and the YahooGroups

Thats rather pathetic of them isn't it. Do you know if James has managed to salvage/store all the files for possible re-instatement in the future?

Peter

In article , ravensworth2674 writes

Is there any reason why you might imagine the copyright does not remain? Copyright in the UK exists for 70 years from the death of the author. Since MEW has only been going for about 10 years it is difficult to see how any copyright *could* have expired, unless they made a habit of re-printing very old articles (which they haven't).

There *are* circumstances in which copying of in-copyright material is permitted. Publishing them in their entirety on web-sites for anyone to make use of is definitely not one of them.

David

Norman -

Which Yahoo groups are we talking about here? (being a member of a few and not having seen any such correspondence).

Regards, Tony

Tony, from what I can see - or rather NOT see in my Yahoo Groups folder

- it seems to be the "Geometer" and "Beginners Workshop" groups at the least, Norman may know of some others.

These had many of the old "Duplex" articles in them which were quite interesting. James Early had spent a considerable time making PDF's of these which may otherwise have been lost to many.

Peter

I clocked it in the quorn_owners group but JWE is trying to focus the discussion in the mlprojects group.

I have been in touch with Carl Carlson of the Quorn groups. Please tell him that I am supporting his concerns.

Again, I believe that J W Early has most of mlathemods ones. Here, I helped post the Martin Cleeve stuff from the 50's. I have also written to James

My quick scan this morning suggests one large chaos with only photos left in many groups. By all means, readers can have any support from me. I feel that this is the beginning of the end of model engineering. I hope that I am wrong!

Norman

Interesting. The situation as I understand it (at least, for the articles I have written for the mags over the years) is that what the mag bought from me was essentially the right to publish the article in a single issue of the mag; however, I retain the copyright to my articles. The wrinkle here though is that the magazine retains copyright of their particular choice of layout, etc. - so you can't reproduce pages of the mag without infringing both the mag's and the author's copyright, but if you were to present the same material in a different form (on a web page, say) where it was obvious that you hadn't simply photocopied bits of the mag, then only the author's copyright would be infringed.

So if these were PDFs of scanned pages from the magazine, then Magicalia actually has a legal right to tell the group to remove the material. However, if you take the trouble to transpose the text, pics, and drawings into a suitable word processing/image editing/CAD format, and post that on the web somewhere, and you have the Author's permission, then, assuming the Author has the same agreement with the mag that I do, I believe you can raise the proverbial digit in the general direction of Encanta.

For example, many of the articles I have written appear on my website

- not as magazine page images, but as web pages of my own construction. If I chose to do so, I could grant you the right to publish those articles on your website, post them, on a Yahoo group, or whatever, and Encanta would have nothing to say about it.

Regards, Tony

You did say months, not years?? You've obviously built it wrong then

Regards, Tony

Don't say that for Christ's sake, I've just spent 10 months making a Quorn grinder ;-)

You think! ;-)

Regards, Tony

What I didn't say is it's only 5% complete ;-)

Can't find either of those - do you have a URL to hand?

Regards, Tony

The Question still remains of whether it is 25 or 70 years for what is 'copyright' in this instance. There are greater minds which have gone into this than mine.

Perhaps a better view is to see what has been written and a visit to the wreckage of these sites will still contain sufficient detail to know more.

I did write minutes ago to Carl Carlson at snipped-for-privacy@earhlink.net of all this.

Being somewhat of oblique mind, there is nothing in any of the articles which is actually ground breaking. Even Chaddock's much vaunted Quorn is development out of yet another Tool and Cutter grinder!

The plot thickens

Norm

Norman, for once I don't agree with you, model engineers are inventive, determined and resourceful individuals who will not be thwarted by the money grabbing accountants currently running various organizations.

With any research project one reads the "source" and uses the information gained to write a "new" interpretation of the same basic principles. So an updated presentation of this information even giving due recognition to the original source would I feel not give Magicalia or any other such organization any cause for concern.

I for one would certainly be willing to "research" some historical model engineering articles and present MY version of the engineering techniques that have been successful for many. I would of course be very happy to give recognition to my source material and also waive any copyright I may gain in presenting the fruits of my research.

Best regards

Keith

Tony, they appear to have completely disappeared from the Groups.

They were here:

Unlika a patent, copyright doesn't require anything to be ground-breaking.

Regards, Tony

That may explain why I couldn't find them ;-)

Yahoo says "no such group" when you follow the links.

Regards, Tony

Hurrah, hurrah! Keith.

So the classic ' Bird with the Broken Wing' worked!

Now for the 'Wooden Horse' It just so happens that I have crates of Martin Cleeve stuff. I have the 'Stent' drawings( no copyright that i can see) In my garage are the Kennet drawings. Big question mark but the Quorn Operating instructions are NOT copyrighted.

When do you want them? I warned of a devious mind.

Norm

Obviously you are, model engineering was around for decades before the internet was a twinkle in someone's eye so the ide that a copyright owner trying to protect their legal property from piracy on the net is going to end the hobby is quite laughable. I have a radical suggestion for you, why not spend a few bob on some genuine books as almost all of us have done in the past, if people don't then where's the incentive for anyone to write any more?. Greg