Adiabatics

You should read

Bob Kaplow NAR # 18L TRA # "Impeach the TRA BoD" >>> To reply, remove the TRABoD!

Actually, right now Al Franken is working on Chris Taylor's biography: "And you thought Rush Limbaugh was a Big Fat Idiot"...

Bob Kaplow NAR # 18L TRA # "Impeach the TRA BoD" >>> To reply, remove the TRABoD!

ROFLMAO!!!

I especially liked Mr. Wheeler...

David Erbas-White

Again bob please show one example outsite of the internet where bottom posting is prevalent.

Your statement implies you have no clue what BOTTOM POSTING actually is to let me clarify for you.

Here is top posting.

Q - What color are strawberries.?

A - Red.

NOW let me show you an example of BOTTOM POSTING

Q - What color are Strawberries?

A - >What color are Strawberries ? Red

PLEASE show me ONE example of this being common practice outside of the internet.

I await your responce.

Chris Taylor

Chris seems to think that it's a game of Jeopardy, and not a conversation. You know, where you get the'answer' first then go on to discover the question.

Nope; you've got it backwards...it's:

------------------ A - Red.

------------------

You gave your answer above the question that was asked, completely opposite of normal conversation.

Nope again:

------------------

A - Red.

------------------

There isn't any, as your example was completely flawed.

Help this helps. Please don't use "Jeopardy-style" posting to answer it.

Correcting you is not a 'misleading' statement. Or was that supposed to be 'mis-sledding', as in falling off a toboggan? ;-) (No personal insults intended!)

Now, I realize I'm going against my own previous statement about ending the thread, but speaking of toboggans, I have an on-topic update...

I lit some motors on my test stand with some friends yesterday (25 deg F) and we verified a difference of about 15% in reduced "delivered ISP" compared to 75F. This included reduced thrust and increased burn time, along with a reduced total impulse. Another side effect on a couple of the motors was some 'chuffing', most likely due to reduced initial start-up pressure. Those were lower Kn designs, so it didn't take much to get them below the required ignition pressure. Completely unscientific methods, but an interesting experiment nonetheless.

Since it could be important to performance and safety, it's useful to be aware of the temperature affect on APCP efficiency. Scientific papers and textbooks discuss it, but it would be nice to run a complete series of tests on some of the propellant formulas commonly available to consumers and amateurs.

-John DeMar

Your out of your mine.

Let me clarify for you.

I will post 100% of the text in the order that is appears on my screen.

Here goes.

On 12-22-2003 at 1430 Chris Taylor Jr Posted.

Again bob please show one example outsite of the internet where bottom posting is prevalent.

Your statement implies you have no clue what BOTTOM POSTING actually is to let me clarify for you.

Here is top posting.

Q - What color are strawberries.?

A - Red.

NOW let me show you an example of BOTTOM POSTING

Q - What color are Strawberries?

A - >What color are Strawberries ? Red

PLEASE show me ONE example of this being common practice outside of the internet.

I await your responce.

Chris Taylor

End of Chris Taylor's Content

Nope; you've got it backwards...it's:

------------------ A - Red.

------------------

You gave your answer above the question that was asked, completely opposite of normal conversation.

Nope again:

------------------

A - Red.

------------------

There isn't any, as your example was completely flawed.

Help this helps. Please don't use "Jeopardy-style" posting to answer it.

-- Mike KD7PVT NAR #70953 - Sr/HPR Level-1 ~ SeaNAR - The Seattle NAR Section #568 NO Junk Email, please! Real email to: amphoto [at] blarg [dot] net.

End of Mike Pearsons content.

Now I could be mistaken. No I am not mistake. I see MY CONTENT.

Then directly below it I see MY CONTENT AGAIN

and then directly below that I see YOUR CONTENT.

that is QUESTION followed by >QUESTION followed by ANSWER

Now if you have properly TOP posted It would have simply been QUESTION and then ANSWER which is as it should be.

Seeing as these posts are already cached and timestamped it is NOT POSSIBLE for me to be incorrect.

I have simple copied and pasted our posts from the top of each message to the end of each persons added content.

Please proceed to make an ass of yourself trying to prove me wrong.

Chris Taylor

Any time someone says toboggan, I think of the guy on the toboggan who friends bailed when they realized it was pointing straight at DuckCreek. Unfortunately, his feet/legs were in the rope and he went down the broken up concrete bank onto the frozen pond. Pretty messed up.

Was there any deviation in the test stand due to the cold? Not that we're likely to see that large a swing here.

Joel. phx

Pocket rocket, eh John? :-)

Mark Simpson NAR 71503 Level II God Bless our peacekeepers

Yes, He's the GUIDING light. ;-)

Mark Simpson NAR 71503 Level II God Bless our peacekeepers

His sequel will be " Dressing for Success; Tasteful Dresses for the Working Man". >;-)

Mark Simpson NAR 71503 Level II God Bless our peacekeepers

There seems to be enough prophecy and parable about god and light as being one that a rational person might take it literally as a postulate to "discover" the physicality of god.

This may be a basis for an entire newsgroup!

:)

Jerry

Which motor(s) did you test? The chuffing is a dead giveaway that the motors are not designed for use at 25 Deg F., assuming of course that you ignited the motors properly.

Perhaps, but more important would be actual sport rocket motor testing, possibly even labeling and certification, to specify minimum recommended initial motor temperature for use. In fact, I have been thinking of sending a letter to Jack Kane to get his observations on these issues. Perhaps the NFPA should be prompted to require minimum temperature labeling for each motor, or an additional certification requirement that all sport rocket motors must perform "well" at say 0 Deg. F. I think it is unreasonable to determine the low temperature limit in at certification testing, but the manufacturer could provide the low temperature limit as they do with maximum recommended launch weight.

Personally, I never fly APCP motors in cold weather, and even in cool weather, I try to keep them warm. The problem may be more common than I an aware of. I do know that professional APCP motors can be design to operated over a wide range of temperatures, say -60 Deg. F. I sport rocket motors are being flown temperatures too low for the particular motor, something should be done to alleviate the problem.

Alan

And your will be "how to use an anal probe properly" an alien's abduction guide.

:-)

Chris Taylor

I'm not the one running around in Mom's formalware. ;-)

Mark Simpson NAR 71503 Level II God Bless our peacekeepers

Chris Taylor Jr wrote:

Perhaps Jerry should cover his motors in lemon juice. I wonder how it would do as an aerodynamic coating for Grrr.

:-)

Bob Kaplow NAR # 18L TRA # "Impeach the TRA BoD" >>> To reply, remove the TRABoD!

Go read any other news group. Even rec.humor with it's 10 level quotes is bottom posted.

Me thinks you're the person who is clueless. I suggest you try this link:

No, this is clearly bottom posting. To use your posting style it would look like this:

CT: A - Red.

don't even know what the response applies to. Like this: We bring up the unfortunate affairs of Mr. Wheeler to make three points. The first two are noncontroversial. First, in many domains in life, success and satisfaction depend on knowledge, wisdom, or savvy in knowing which rules to follow and which strategies to pursue. This is true not only for committing crimes, but also for many tasks in the social and intellectual domains, such as promoting effective leadership, raising children, constructing a solid logical argument, or designing a rigorous psychological study. Second, people differ widely in the knowledge and strategies they apply in these domains ( Dunning, Meyerowitz, & Holzberg, 1989 ; Dunning, Perie, & Story, 1991 ; Story & Dunning, 1998 ), with varying levels of success. Some of the knowledge and theories that people apply to their actions are sound and meet with favorable results. Others, like the lemon juice hypothesis of McArthur Wheeler, are imperfect at best and wrong-headed, incompetent, or dysfunctional at worst.

Perhaps more controversial is the third point, the one that is the focus of this article. We argue that when people are incompetent in the strategies they adopt to achieve success and satisfaction, they suffer a dual burden: Not only do they reach erroneous conclusions and make unfortunate choices, but their incompetence robs them of the ability to realize it. Instead, like Mr. Wheeler, they are left with the mistaken impression that they are doing just fine. As Miller (1993) perceptively observed in the quote that opens this article, and as Charles Darwin (1871) sagely noted over a century ago, "ignorance more frequently begets confidence than does knowledge" (p. 3).]

I don't know what this is. Bottom posting does NOT repeat the question a second time. Your last two lines are EXACTLY how it should be written for clarity.

See above.

Bob Kaplow NAR # 18L TRA # "Impeach the TRA BoD" >>> To reply, remove the TRABoD!

Well stated. But how come he never puts his answers in the form of a question?

Bob Kaplow NAR # 18L TRA # "Impeach the TRA BoD" >>> To reply, remove the TRABoD!