Current Legal State

Can anyone tell me the current legalities assoc with L1 and 2 reloads/su ?
Excuse my ignorance but Im just not able to stay up to date with all the
regulations. Last I heard a lot of ATFB regs were coming into effect right
about now. Is that true?
I'm wondering what the real low-down is concerning HPR. If to possess a L1
or2 reload requires a leup wont the mfg's be forced to stop producing , at
any real volume, HPR reloads ? Will most people be forced into mid-power ?
If someone could explain whats going on in simple terms and how it will all
end up playing out, I'd certainly appreciate it. Thanks all !~
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The only real, practical, answer at this point is ask your dealer what would actually be required: it basically depends on their individual circumstances. (Some, for example, may sell motors for "on-site" usage and tie off the Federal "paper trail" for the customer; others will only sell to individual permittees: but even in these cases arrangements are sometimes made for somewith a permit to act as the "designated purchaser of record" for others' flights.
-dave w
Reply to
David Weinshenker
The only recent (past 5 years) changes are as a result of the HSA Safe Explosives act. In state transactions that used to be permit exempt now require a permit.
All other changes are proposed, but not yet in effect, or were illegally changed without notice and thus null and void.
At the last inspection, I asked the BATFE agent to show me in writing where the 62.5g limit is in the regulations. She showed me her highluighted copy of the NPRM with the 62.5g limit. I pointed out to her that that was still in the proposal state, and not yet in effect. She had no further response to the matter. Her superior refused further response as well.
They are clearly making up the rules as they go. Calvinball played by thugs and murderers with guns.
Bob Kaplow NAR # 18L TRA # "Impeach the TRA BoD" >>> To reply, remove the TRABoD!
Reply to
Bob Kaplow
There is no flux. ALL sport motors are EXEMPT. Many dealers, clubs, associations, and vendors are actively shooting themselves in the foot WRT ATF and sucking us down a black hole of reduced strength in the process.
Here's the law that shows that:
27 CFR 555.11, Propellant Actuated Device. Any tool or special mechanized device or gas generator system which is actuated by a propellant or which releases and directs work through a propellant charge.
27 CFR 555.141 exemptions (a) (8) Gasoline, fertilizers, propellant actuated devices, or propellant actuated industrial tools manufactured, imported, or distributed for their intended purposes.
Here's the JUDGE's words verifying it.
"In addition, the Court finds that the ATF's pronouncement that sport rocket motors are not PADs is invalid because it was made without compliance with the notice-and-comment rulemaking procedures of the OCCA and the APA."
Here is the court order that is from:
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Just factual Jerry
Reply to
Jerry Irvine
No such permit exists. If you want a user permit you have two choices:
Type 34, User of Low Explosives (aka LEUP) or Type 60, Limited Permit
Both require storage, records, inspections, etc.
The limited permit allows only 6 purchases per year. You cannot deal with an out of state vendor, You cannot transport what you purchase out of state.
The type 34 permit is $100 for the first three years and $50 per three years after that. The type 60 is $25 for the first year and $12 per year after that.
The bottom line is that the type 60 is slightly cheaper but you are strictly limited to intrastate purchase and transport.
Read the law at:
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and BATFE's regulations implementing that law at:
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Reply to
David Schultz
David S J.Hardy
It's going to take a while to read all that but most of it is dated 2004 and some 2003.
The old forms gave you an option on line 15 to check yes to on site use only. I missed the update.
Besides these rules seem for devices whose primary function is for explosions. Not our PAD's right. Is that the current court fight (position) over regulation of sport motors.
Thanks, Ken
Reply to
Kenneth Jarosch
Furthermore this is not news.
It has been happening at Tripoli and Tripoli centric motor vendors for YEARS.
Reply to
Jerry Irvine

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